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Hi, just a quick question.

A non-EEA national separated but NOT YET DIVORCED his EEA wife (who is exercising tr.rights as worker) in the UK.

He wants to take out a mortgage, but all the banks told him he needs an ILR or be a British citizen or an EEA4 PR card in order to apply. Or alternatively, his wife must have a PR for them to apply for a mortgage JOINTLY and he couldn't apply on his own until he is settled. A few questions arise:

1) whether it's lawful to demand of an EEA national to have PR for mortgage (Art.24 Directive 2004/38);

2) Equally, if answer to above is NO, then the same goes for the non-EEA national;

3) finally, if they divorced (a very likely outcome if they don't reconcile) and non-EEA retained his right to reside, if answer to 1 is that banks can't discriminate on grounds of nationality, presumably a Non-EEA without yet having PR but having retained RoR should be treated equally and allowed to take out mortgage in his own name?

If there is a case for discrimination, how could this discrimination be prevented? As banks are private institutions, the direct effect (or whatever the equivalent is- indirect effect through the courts' interpretation) doesn't seem to apply to private companies?

any advice would be appreciated.

How could someone without a right to live in Britain indefinitely, expect a financial institution to facilitate a loan over a period of 20-25 years?

May i remind u keffers that neitherthe eea national nor non-eea are subject to immigration control. moreover even if one gets ilr it doesnt mean he wont bugger off to another country so ur argument does not stand. Art.24 of the directive on equality says it all.

Please guys, if anyone has solid suggestions and not blind critique like keffers here do reply.

many many thanks

doesnt make sense. I know people who were on HSMP and got a Mortgage successfully. The arguments that banks have given do not make any sense. How many banks have you gone to. It could be that they are unaware of the Migration Status of an EEA National family member. It might be useful to wait for PR first.Or maybe involve a solicitor to iron out this issue.

How can it be discriminating on the grounds of nationality if the bank can show that people of the same nationality as the person concerned have satisfied the ILR requirement and have been given a mortgage? Would the mortgage company give a mortgage to someone who was not normally resident in this country even though they were British?

Its not about what someone may do in the future - its about what someone can do now. What someone without ILR cannot do is make a genuine contractual agreement lasting 25 years, because quite plainly they cannot stay here long enough to honour it. Even if they wanted to.

Wrong in every respect. EU is meant to be a borderless single state, thus, with this in mind, there shouldn't be any requirement for a person living in this "single STATE" to have anything different to another citizen of a particular Member State.

So, if an EEA national satisfies the requirement of a bank with regards to the income and capital (and being legally in the country exercising Treaty Rights), he cannot be discriminated purely on the basis of being a national of a different Member State to the one he's applying in.

Further, the fact that a person can abscond within 25 years is not decided by what status he has in the country. Many ILR holders and Brits are involved in possession proceedings and should an EEA national default on the payment etc, similar process will be followed.

Anyway, I was hoping for more knowledgeable replies, especially from Vinny, Obie, 86ti, John, Directive2004/38, Kitty, Sushmedta and others (sorry if I missed someone else out).

Thanks again.

keffers wrote:How can it be discriminating on the grounds of nationality if the bank can show that people of the same nationality as the person concerned have satisfied the ILR requirement and have been given a mortgage? Would the mortgage company give a mortgage to someone who was not normally resident in this country even though they were British?

Its not about what someone may do in the future - its about what someone can do now. What someone without ILR cannot do is make a genuine contractual agreement lasting 25 years, because quite plainly they cannot stay here long enough to honour it. Even if they wanted to.

I'm so happy I found this thread. Have a simialr issue.

I'm EEA national exercising treaty rights and my wife non-eea. We already got Agreement in Principle from one of the big 4 banks, but when we came to the application they wanted to see that she has ILR in her passport. I tried to explain them that she doesn't need because she didn't come through immigration process but as family member of EEA national.

The mortgage advisor spoke to underwriters and they said the same so application wasn't submitted.

I honestly can't understand this discrimination? My wife has exactly the same rights as I do in this country. Maybe a solicitor needs to phone the bank to explain them? Or should I try with a bank which is not xenophobic or stupid.

Banks do have a lot of freedom to decide with whom they do business or not. They can take any factor into account to assess the risk, and obviously it is often not very transparent how a decision in an individual case is reached.

However, the reasons given by the bank quoted here do not really make sense. My own bank was (years ago) quite happy to provide me with a mortgage within a few months after I arrived in this country.

And of course, even a born Brit can take out a huge loan and then disappear to waste the money somewhere on booze, drugs and women on a far-away island.

I suppose OP should shop around; surely not all banks use exactly the same criteria.

However, the reasons given by the bank quoted here do not really make sense. My own bank was (years ago) quite happy to provide me with a mortgage within a few months after I arrived in this country.

And of course, even a born Brit can take out a huge loan and then disappear to waste the money somewhere on booze, drugs and women on a far-away island.

I suppose OP should shop around; surely not all banks use exactly the same criteria.

Well exactly there is no sense in discriminating against EEA citizen and his wife. As you said ILR is irrelevant as anyone can escape and not pay. The bank will anyway take the property if you don't pay.

I guess the solution is to check other lenders and also in the meantime to make formal complaint about this bank.

to share my experience

i am non-eu on a 5 years RC

only two banks who agreed to my mortgage application were HSBC or Barclays, others declined due to not having a PR , both banks requested minimum 25 % deposit to proceed.

UK_BR5 wrote:to share my experience

i am non-eu on a 5 years RC

only two banks who agreed to my mortgage application were HSBC or Barclays, others declined due to not having a PR , both banks requested minimum 25 % deposit to proceed.

Thanks for sharing. So you made a sole application, or was it a joint?

I don't see the logic by refusing to let you apply if you don't have a PR. If you have BR5 (as your name suggests), you have no limits and work and living here because you have an EEA family member and in fact you enjoy the same rights as every other EU citizen in this country.

Jersey wrote:

UK_BR5 wrote:
Thanks for sharing. So you made a sole application, or was it a joint?

it was a sole application.

I think we are going to complain to the management of the bank ,also to the FSA and potentially break the story to the media.

I think the banks are breaking eu treaties and regulations by preventing my wife from getting a mortgage because she doesn't have PR. She doesn't need to have one because she is spouse of EU-citizen and as such enjoys same residence status and other rights.

Im a non-EEA national currently on Tier 1 General migrant visa. I got granted a mortgage with Abbey bank (Santander). I went through a mortgage advisor and never had any problems.

A colleague of mine also non-EEA national with a british partner tried to get a joint morgage directly through Barclays and was refused. They then went through a mortgage advisor and was able to secure one. She also is on a Tier 1 General migrant visa.

EQ wrote:Im a non-EEA national currently on Tier 1 General migrant visa. I got granted a mortgage with Abbey bank (Santander). I went through a mortgage advisor and never had any problems.

A colleague of mine also non-EEA national with a british partner tried to get a joint morgage directly through Barclays and was refused. They then went through a mortgage advisor and was able to secure one. She also is on a Tier 1 General migrant visa.

Thanks. Obviously I don't know their financial circumstances, but I hope I can still find a financial solution.

I'm glad I found this post. I'm a non-EEA citizen and my partner is an EEA national we've been living in the UK for more than 5yrs. We applied for a mortgage two years after our arrival and had no pbms with it. We have premier accounts with our banks and my partner has applied for two loans with our bank to pay for an academic degree. They were granted and we paid the balance in full very early. We then did the same for the third stage of the degree and for our surprise the bank told us that they would only grant the loan with a reduced payback period on the grounds that the renewal date of my partner's residence card has a renewal date in 2018. However, this is our understanding (see below). We've even applied for the permanent residence card. Is the bank right in refusing the loan on those grounds?

http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 20573.html

Under EEA regulations, after 5 continuous years of the EEA national exercising treaty rights, the EEA national (and family members living in the UK) automatically obtain Permanent Residence status. Whether you had a residence document or not is irrelevant. Whatever the dates on your RC is irrelevant. The HO just confirm your rights. They don't grant them. If you have been living in the UK for 5 years as married to a EEA national exercising treaty rights, it seems you have PR status already. If you wish (it's optional), you can apply for a confirmation of your PR status using form EEA4.

jojosmith01 wrote:I'm glad I found this post. I'm a non-EEA citizen and my partner is an EEA national we've been living in the UK for more than 5yrs. We applied for a mortgage two years after our arrival and had no pbms with it. We have premier accounts with our banks and my partner has applied for two loans with our bank to pay for an academic degree. They were granted and we paid the balance in full very early. We then did the same for the third stage of the degree and for our surprise the bank told us that they would only grant the loan with a reduced payback period on the grounds that the renewal date of my partner's residence card has a renewal date in 2018. However, this is our understanding (see below). We've even applied for the permanent residence card. Is the bank right in refusing the loan on those grounds?

http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 20573.html

Under EEA regulations, after 5 continuous years of the EEA national exercising treaty rights, the EEA national (and family members living in the UK) automatically obtain Permanent Residence status. Whether you had a residence document or not is irrelevant. Whatever the dates on your RC is irrelevant. The HO just confirm your rights. They don't grant them. If you have been living in the UK for 5 years as married to a EEA national exercising treaty rights, it seems you have PR status already. If you wish (it's optional), you can apply for a confirmation of your PR status using form EEA4.

This thread is 4 to 5 years old from 2011 and 2012. The link you have provided is also a few years old. Please refrain from digging up old threads.