FTT judge is claiming i said something i did not said during the hear in his refusal letter

[WIIL WAAL]

FTT Judge is claiming i said something i didn't say in the courtroom he also said my partner said something she did not say in his refusal letter im very shocked about this! He is also contradicting
One he said i said something another time he said i said something else!! What can i do?

[Frontier Mole]

You can appeal the decision on the basis the judge erred in law in considering inaccurate or a misunderstanding of the evidence given. Your legal rep will have kept notes of the hearing including your answers given to the questions put to you or your partner.

[WIIL WAAL]

Thanks for your reply, i change my solicitor to new one i asked my previous solicitors to give me the notes of the hearing since we don't have enough time cuz we have to appeal he told me he can't even remember the barrister name who attend the court is there anything i can do? I have only tomorrow to appeal if i call the tribunal do u think i will be able to get any evidence such audio recording ECT? And if i get the evidence after i subtimed the appeal what can i do?

Thanks

[Obie]

Well file the appeal,and then notify the tribunal that further counsel note of the proceedings will be provided, as proof that the Judge misrepresent the evidence you gave, and possibly say you will invite the tribunal, if they so wish to seek the view of the presenting officer, as proof that the allegations made against you ( provided they are material to the determination) were so serious such that it amounts to a material error of law or a misdirection on the part of the judge.

[WIIL WAAL]

Thank you very much for your reply Obie,
I will do that but i need to know how will they find the presenter officer's notes is it already in court or they have to request from Home Office?
Thanks

[Frontier Mole]

Thank you very much for your reply Obie,
I will do that but i need to know how will they find the presenter officer's notes is it already in court or they have to request from Home Office?
Thanks

The PO’s notes will need to be requested from the Home Office however I doubt very much they will be released as there is no obligation to do so. The file note that is completed is more of a possibility as that is logged electronically but that contained the briefest of summary of the hearing and nothing more. That will not have a record of the and Q&A.

Your court determination lists the representative name so you already have that information. So you can go back to your solicitor and get the notes. I have a feeling you are not going to be supported by your previous solicitor as they know exactly who is allocated to a case - it is in their case file and they know the determination names the representative. So they are basically just telling you to get lost.

[Obie]

They have a duty to OP to provide him with these details. If they delay or refused to do so maliciously, then it is open to him to make a complain to the SRA, notify the FTT about this in his application for permission to appeal to the UT.

[Frontier Mole]

They have a duty to OP to provide him with these details. If they delay or refused to do so maliciously, then it is open to him to make a complain to the SRA, notify the FTT about this in his application for permission to appeal to the UT.

I totally agree with what you say but unfortunately the quality of service from all too many legal representatives is very much linked to wither you are seen as a “worthwhile” client. As soon as you instruct another solicitor then your value as a client is zeroed and so is the service provided. This is regardless of wither there is a possibility of SRA involvement as the reps know it rarely happens, there is no deterrent really.

And you can see the figure of blame being pointed at the barrister very quickly too - “ they did not provide the hearing notes...”

[WIIL WAAL]

Hi thanks very much for your reply guys.

My new solicitors argue other grounds even though he mentioned im not happy with some of comments the judge made in his refusal letter , and he said we don't have the evidence of the proceedings now but we will add these grounds when we find the evidence of the proceedings,do you guys think thats enough, my solicitors also said there is alot of error of law the judge made and we should get permission to appeal

Thanks

[Frontier Mole]

Without seeing the appeal grounds and the evidence you wish to rely on it is impossible to comment.

Remember many unscrupulous immigration legal reps peddle hope to the hopeless as a way of making a living. There are very few truly outstanding small / medium immigration legal firms out there that will turn away the desperate seeking a solution when there is none.

Your legal rep has nothing to lose by offering a solution that will empty your pockets and fill theirs. Be wary of confident claims that permission to appeal will be granted, especially where new grounds are being put forward. That is a sure indication that the original grounds for refusal and subsequent appeal dismissal are not going to be overcome. Rarely do new grounds get allowed into consideration for permission to appeal.

Please do not get your expectations raised too high.

[Obie]

. Rarely do new grounds get allowed into consideration for permission to appeal.

Please do not get your expectations raised too high.

Do you mean new evidence?

[Frontier Mole]

New evidence is a no no. There is a push back on new grounds for appeal in that new matters not under previous consideration will not be readily entertained. The throw everything and the k i t c h e n sink mentality at PAP and JR is not cutting any ice and diminishes the overall case when it comes to the judicial system. There is far less tolerance to these types of cases.

[Frontier Mole]

Why is k i t c h e n coming up as the word spam?

[Casa]

Why is k i t c h e n coming up as the word spam?

It's one of the words auto-changed by the Board's word sensor. I assume that way back, k i t c h e n companies were flogging their wares on the forum. There are a few other strange ones....

I've now edited your post for you.

[Obie]

New evidence is a no no. There is a push back on new grounds for appeal in that new matters not under previous consideration will not be readily entertained. The throw everything and the k i t c h e n sink mentality at PAP and JR is not cutting any ice and diminishes the overall case when it comes to the judicial system. There is far less tolerance to these types of cases.

failure to consider new grounds of challenge which was not advanced before the FTT will clearly not amount to an arguable error of law, nevermind an error of law.

[WIIL WAAL]

Thanks guys

Its not new grounds the grounds is what was in front of the FTT judge for example the FTTJ said he was not satisfy i have genuine relationship with my partner but in the HO refusal letter cleary stated they accepted our relationship is genuine , me and wife has also has kids together the judge also did not take this into consideration, he also said even if im wrong about the genuiness of the relationship they can go back to Somalia ( the home office also said " is accepted it would undly hursh my wife and kids to go to Somalia beacuse of the situation of somalia however my solicitor did not include this is grounds of premmision to apeal but the FTTJ said my wife and kids they can go with me to sonalia) or the wife and the kids can stay in the UK,but solicitor is arguing the judge didnt say anything about what would hrappen to them if they go Somalia with me or if they stay in UK without me the solicitor also arguing the judge did not use applicable fact or caselaw.
I used false travel documents when i was coming to the UK from Somalia to claim asylum the judge said i have committed ""so serious crime" and he believes i put risky "the security of the country" because i use false document to calim asylum!! i find that very ridicules, in permission to appeal letter my solicitor also said the criminality in this case was immigration ducumantion which i was seeking to claim asylum
My patner and kids are british.