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kit21088
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Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 2:46 pm

Hi All,

I am a dutch citizen with full settled status, living and working in the UK. I moved over from California in March 2019, where I had been living with my partner (we are not married/ civil partnership). When I moved back, my partner not wanting to spend time apart, left his job and came to the UK with me, as a visitor. He spent 5 months here, while I looked for a job in London. I started working in August 2019, and he returned to CA in September, so that we could apply for his visa (Unmarried Partner). As I have only been in employment since August 2019, we are applying under category B, taking into consideration my income over the past 12 months (at the date of application), in the US. We applied on October 7th.

From my job in the UK:
Current salary £51,000
Payslips from August £3908.05
Payslip from September £4250

From my employment in the US:
Paid rate $25 per hour, rising to $27 later that year.
October 7th - 20th $1,809.00
October 21st - November 3rd $2,018.75
November 4th - 17th $1,800.00
November 18th - December 1st $118.75
December 2nd - 15th $1,800.00
December 16th - 29th $2,009.38
December 26th - 26th $273.67
December 30th - January 12th $1,724.63
January 13th - 26th $1,755.00
January 27th - February 9th $1,134.00

Total $14,443.18

The exchange rate on Oct 7th £1 = $1.2287

This gives total income over the past 12 months to be £19,912.19

My question for everyone is - is this accurately calculated? There is hardly any information on the UK gov website on this, and it is so vague as to how the actual calculation is done. I need someone who has gone through a similar process or knows the ins and outs of the process to tell me if the above is calculated correctly.

The reason we are not waiting for an additional month of payslips from my current job is because we have never been apart this long since we got together and we just both want to start our lives together in the UK. We have ample evidence of all other requirements (proof of living together, photos, etc), this is the only thing I am lost on because I am not 100% certain.

Please help!

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seagul
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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Sun Oct 13, 2019 3:51 pm

If you hadn't got job offer which was started within 3 months since arrived then you can't use your overseas income rather either have to spend 6 months with UK employer or need to have 6 months old cash savings.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

kit21088
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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:51 pm

Hi Seagul,


Thanks for your input. Can you please explain? I have not seen that stipulation anywhere online whatsoever and it is the first I am hearing it.

Kit

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by Casa » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:30 pm

Seagul is correct.

5.2.1. Where the applicant’s partner is returning with the applicant to the UK to work, they must
meet two requirements to rely on Category A:
• First, the applicant’s partner must be in employment at the date of application and
have been with the same employer for at least 6 months prior to the date of
application. They must have been paid throughout that period of 6 months at a level
of gross annual salary or income which equals or exceeds the level relied upon in the
Appendix FM 1.7: Financial Requirement
August 2017
23
application. Their gross annual salary or employment income can be combined with
any or all of the sources at section 5.1.6. in order to meet the financial requirement.
So, again, income under Category A can be combined with Category C: nonemployment income, Category D: cash savings and Category E: pension if
necessary to meet the financial requirement.
As with employment in the UK, gross income from non-salaried employment held
throughout the 6 month period will be calculated on the basis set out in section
5.1.4.).
• Second, the applicant’s partner must also have a confirmed offer of salaried or
nonsalaried employment in the UK, starting within 3 months of their return.
This must
have a gross annual starting salary (or in-non salaried employment a gross annual
income from that employment, based on the rate or amount of pay and the standard
or core hours to be worked provided by the employer in evidence) sufficient to meet
the financial requirement, alone or in combination with any or all the sources at
section 5.1.4. (Category C: non-employment income, Category D: cash savings and
Category E: pension).


https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... -ext_1.pdf
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:34 pm

Hi,

The information attached there seems to be for Cat A. We are applying under Cat B. since I have only been with my current employer for less than 6 months.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by Casa » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:41 pm

kit21088 wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:34 pm
Hi,

The information attached there seems to be for Cat A. We are applying under Cat B. since I have only been with my current employer for less than 6 months.
As Seagul has pointed out, you are unable to include your overseas income as your employment in the UK didn't start within 3 months of your arrival. You will have to wait to apply when you have 6 months of payslips for your current employment, together with the corresponding bank statements.

Edit: I see from your opening post that your have already submitted your application.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:22 pm

yes we have already applied. My partner's appointment is on Thursday.

So how does Category B work then? Because everywhere I read, including their site, states that if the sponsor has been in his or her current job for less than 6 months, then they can take into consideration the income from the previous 12 months at the date of application?

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:33 pm

kit21088 wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:22 pm
yes we have already applied. My partner's appointment is on Thursday.

So how does Category B work then? Because everywhere I read, including their site, states that if the sponsor has been in his or her current job for less than 6 months, then they can take into consideration the income from the previous 12 months at the date of application?
I think you are not studying the official guidance completely and relevantly. I will suggest you to read it from page 24-30 then come back here with question.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... -ext_1.pdf
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by Casa » Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:36 pm

kit21088 wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:22 pm
yes we have already applied. My partner's appointment is on Thursday.

So how does Category B work then? Because everywhere I read, including their site, states that if the sponsor has been in his or her current job for less than 6 months, then they can take into consideration the income from the previous 12 months at the date of application?
Yes, but only if the previous 12 months earnings are from employment within the UK. Otherwise, the official guidance I posted previously applies.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:29 pm

Casa wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:36 pm
kit21088 wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:22 pm
yes we have already applied. My partner's appointment is on Thursday.

So how does Category B work then? Because everywhere I read, including their site, states that if the sponsor has been in his or her current job for less than 6 months, then they can take into consideration the income from the previous 12 months at the date of application?
Yes, but only if the previous 12 months earnings are from employment within the UK. Otherwise, the official guidance I posted previously applies.
Hi,

So I see what you are saying, but my partner is not returning with me to the UK. I am already in the UK and he is applying from within the US. I do not see anywhere, where it says overseas income is not taken into account.

I do see where it says that if the two of us were coming together and I had a job offer letter, then the job would need to start within three months, but this case does not also apply to our scenario?

Appreciate all your help btw.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by Casa » Sun Oct 13, 2019 8:18 pm

My understanding of the financial specifications is that unless the sponsor and spouse are returning to the UK together, the sponsor is required to meet the 6 month employment requirement, before the application is submitted.

However, I will hand this over to Seagul or others, better placed to explain the complexity of the Immigration Rules regarding finances.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by geoeng » Mon Oct 14, 2019 1:13 pm

kit21088 wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:29 pm
Hi,

So I see what you are saying, but my partner is not returning with me to the UK. I am already in the UK and he is applying from within the US. I do not see anywhere, where it says overseas income is not taken into account.

I do see where it says that if the two of us were coming together and I had a job offer letter, then the job would need to start within three months, but this case does not also apply to our scenario?

Appreciate all your help btw.
Section 15 of Appendix FM-SE states the following with respect to meeting the second part of Category B (previous 12 months income):
"In respect of paragraph 13(b) and paragraph 13(d), the provisions in this paragraph also apply:
(b) The person must also meet the level of gross annual income required by Appendix FM on the basis that their income is the total of:
(i) The gross income from salaried employment in the UK or overseas earned by the person in the 12 months prior to the date of application;"

Page 26 of the Appendix FM guidance on financial requirements similarly states UK or overseas income may be used. This suggests that, provided you are currently employed in the UK in a job meeting the financial requirement to satisfy the first part of Category B, you can use overseas income and UK income to meet the second part. I'm willing for others to contest that though as it is a rather unique situation.
I'm just a guy on the Internet who immigrated to the UK. My opinions are based on my experience and interpretation of the immigration rules and should not be considered legal or immigration advice; your mileage may vary.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:04 pm

Thank you! We were going off the back of this. I agree that this is a completely unique scenario that I don't seem to find posted anywhere else, so it is a strange one and is confusing everyone. I mean we have applied now and his appointment is on the 17th October, which is why I am having this last minute panic.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:23 pm

kit21088 wrote:
Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:04 pm
Thank you! We were going off the back of this. I agree that this is a completely unique scenario that I don't seem to find posted anywhere else, so it is a strange one and is confusing everyone. I mean we have applied now and his appointment is on the 17th October, which is why I am having this last minute panic.
If either of you have 6 months older savings of at least £62500 then you can still submit its proof to meet the requirement because with your present arrangement the visa will not succeed.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Mon Oct 14, 2019 7:09 pm

seagul wrote:
Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:23 pm
kit21088 wrote:
Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:04 pm
Thank you! We were going off the back of this. I agree that this is a completely unique scenario that I don't seem to find posted anywhere else, so it is a strange one and is confusing everyone. I mean we have applied now and his appointment is on the 17th October, which is why I am having this last minute panic.
If either of you have 6 months older savings of at least £62500 then you can still submit its proof to meet the requirement because with your present arrangement the visa will not succeed.
Seagul, I do not know why you are saying this, when it clearly states in 5.3.11:

Second, the person must in addition have received in the 12 months prior to the date
of application the level of income required to meet the financial requirement, based on:
• The gross amount of salaried or non-salaried employment income of the applicant’s
partner (in the UK or overseas) and/or the applicant (if they are in the UK with
permission to work);
• The gross amount of any specified non-employment income received by the
applicant’s partner, the applicant or both jointly, provided they continue to own the
relevant asset (e.g. property, interest from shares) at the date of application; and/or
• The gross amount of any State (UK or foreign), occupational or private pension
received by the applicant’s partner or the applicant.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Mon Oct 14, 2019 7:53 pm

seagul wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 6:33 pm


I think you are not studying the official guidance completely and relevantly. I will suggest you to read it from page 24-30 then come back here with question.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... -ext_1.pdf
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:19 pm

For your situation following is relevant:
5.4. Category B: Less than 6 months with current employer or
variable income – overseas sponsor returning to the UK


5.4.1. Where the applicant’s partner is returning with the applicant to the UK to work, they do not
have to be in employment at the date of application to rely on Category B. Instead, the
financial requirement must be met and evidenced in two parts in the following way.
5.4.2. First, the applicant’s partner must have a confirmed offer of salaried or non-salaried
employment to return to in the UK (starting within 3 months of their return). This must
have a gross annual starting salary (or in non-salaried employment a gross annual
income from that employment, based on the rate or amount of pay and the standard or
core hours to be worked provided by the employer in evidence) sufficient to meet the
financial requirement, alone or in combination with any or all the sources at section
5.3.6. (Category C: non-employment income, Category D: cash savings and Category E:
pension).
5.4.3. Second, the couple returning to the UK must in addition have received in the 12 months
prior to the date of application the level of income required to meet the financial
requirement, based on:
• The gross amount of salaried or non-salaried employment income overseas of the
applicant’s partner;
• The gross amount of any specified non-employment income received by the
applicant’s partner, the applicant or both jointly, provided they continue to own the
relevant asset (e.g. property, interest from shares) at the date of application; and/or
• The gross amount of any State (UK or foreign), occupational or private pension
received by the applicant’s partner or the applicant.
5.4.4. So, under Category B, the assessment of the financial requirement will be based on both:
(1) The gross annual salary or income of the applicant’s partner’s confirmed offer of
salaried or non-salaried employment in the UK. This source can be combined with
Category C: non-employment income, Category D: cash savings and Category E:
pension; and
(2) The actual amount of gross income received from the applicant’s partner’s salaried
or non-salaried employment overseas in the 12 months prior to the date of
application. This can be combined with the actual gross income the couple received
from Category C: non-employment income and Category E: pension over the same
12-month period. Category D: cash savings cannot be used under (2).
5.4.5. Case study – Category B: Less than 6 months with current employer or variable
income – overseas sponsor returning to the UK

Example (a)
The applicant’s partner currently lives in China and is returning to the UK with the applicant.

The applicant’s partner left her job in China 3 months ago to prepare for the move to the
UK. She is not employed at the date of the application. From the job that she left, she
received an income of £19,000 in the 12 months prior to the application. So part (2) of the
Category B calculation for a returning sponsor is met because she received in the 12
months prior to the application the amount of income required to meet the level of the
financial requirement.
In addition, the applicant’s partner must also, under part (1) of the Category B calculation,
have a confirmed offer of salaried or non-salaried employment to return to in the UK
(starting within 3 months of her return). This must have an annual starting salary or income
sufficient to meet the financial requirement, alone or in combination with other sources. She
does have a confirmed job offer in the UK starting within 7 weeks of her return, with an
annual starting salary of £24,000.
So part (1) of the Category B calculation for a returning sponsor is also met because she
has a confirmed offer of employment in the UK to return to which has an annual starting
salary sufficient to meet the financial requirement.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by geoeng » Tue Oct 15, 2019 8:09 am

Right, but that's not really the situation. The applicant's partner is not returning with the applicant to the UK to work, the applicant's partner is already employed in the UK so section 5.3 should apply (section 5.3.9 specifically mentions the use of overseas income to satisfy the second part of Category B).

Accepting future employment in the UK starting within 3 months of returning to the UK but not actual current employment in the UK seems a bit inconsistent with the immigration rules. In theory, the same interpretation could make ineligible the partner of a British citizen (or equivalent settled person) residing in the UK but whose income is earned entirely overseas. Not saying it's incorrect necessarily, just an odd precedent.
I'm just a guy on the Internet who immigrated to the UK. My opinions are based on my experience and interpretation of the immigration rules and should not be considered legal or immigration advice; your mileage may vary.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:00 am

geoeng wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 8:09 am
Right, but that's not really the situation. The applicant's partner is not returning with the applicant to the UK to work, the applicant's partner is already employed in the UK so section 5.3 should apply (section 5.3.9 specifically mentions the use of overseas income to satisfy the second part of Category B).

Accepting future employment in the UK starting within 3 months of returning to the UK but not actual current employment in the UK seems a bit inconsistent with the immigration rules. In theory, the same interpretation could make ineligible the partner of a British citizen (or equivalent settled person) residing in the UK but whose income is earned entirely overseas. Not saying it's incorrect necessarily, just an odd precedent.
Yes! This is what I mean! There are two different sections under category B, the one that Seagul mentions about returning with the partner to the UK and the one that states that the sponsor is residing in the UK, which I am. In that respect, my overseas income and my UK income together should satisfy the financial requirement (according to the above calculation)?

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by geoeng » Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:37 am

kit21088 wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 10:00 am
Yes! This is what I mean! There are two different sections under category B, the one that Seagul mentions about returning with the partner to the UK and the one that states that the sponsor is residing in the UK, which I am. In that respect, my overseas income and my UK income together should satisfy the financial requirement (according to the above calculation)?
Yes, provided Home Office has the same interpretation of the immigration rules, which is obviously not guaranteed in this case. Since you've already applied, all you can really do is wait. Best case your partner gets a visa in a few months, worst case you have to re-apply once you have 6 months of UK payslips.
I'm just a guy on the Internet who immigrated to the UK. My opinions are based on my experience and interpretation of the immigration rules and should not be considered legal or immigration advice; your mileage may vary.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:41 pm

You both are just picking only your desired words out of the guidance and then fitting them into your desire which is totally incorrect. You are only focusing on word : applicant's partner is not returning with the applicant to the UK to work. If we use common sense then will know that how can an applicant enter the UK to work or even live when he/she has to apply from abroad.
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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by geoeng » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:03 pm

Nothing official in the UK is based on common sense, it is only ever based on rules and poorly written guidance documents. When the rules and guidance document present options for meeting the financial requirements based on whether the applicant's partner is either: (A) currently employed in the UK or (B) overseas and returning to the UK with the applicant to take up employment within 3 months of arriving, common sense would suggest only evidence to prove the former is required (given the latter is not applicable to the situation). I'm not saying my interpretation is correct necessarily, I just haven't seen any references to applicable immigration rules or guidance suggesting why it's wrong.
I'm just a guy on the Internet who immigrated to the UK. My opinions are based on my experience and interpretation of the immigration rules and should not be considered legal or immigration advice; your mileage may vary.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by seagul » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:08 pm

There is no confusion in the guidance which is very straight along with examples over this matter. If still someone is confident then better to apply which op has already done then see the results.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by kit21088 » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:17 pm

seagul wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:08 pm
There is no confusion in the guidance which is very straight along with examples over this matter. If still someone is confident then better to apply which op has already done then see the results.
Hi Seagul,

I think it would be better to get an overview of what you understand to be my situation. Because I am still not 100% certain that you understand that my partner is living in the US, while I have been living here. He will not be returning with me, he will be returning on his own. But I think it would be good to know what your understanding of my situation is, because maybe I didnt word it correctly in my original post.

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Re: Unmarried Partner Visa - Financial requirement calculation

Post by geoeng » Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:29 pm

seagul wrote:
Tue Oct 15, 2019 2:08 pm
There is no confusion in the guidance which is very straight along with examples over this matter.
I agree with that. As somewhat of a potential corollary scenario just for fun: the OP will have obtained greater than the required £18,600 of income earned in the UK before reaching 6 months with the current employer. In this case would they be eligible to apply under Category B with 5 payslips or would they still have to wait the extra month to apply under Category A because they have earned overseas income in the previous 12 months?
I'm just a guy on the Internet who immigrated to the UK. My opinions are based on my experience and interpretation of the immigration rules and should not be considered legal or immigration advice; your mileage may vary.

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