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Spouse Visa after Deception

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sop
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Spouse Visa after Deception

Post by sop » Thu Aug 27, 2009 4:52 pm

DELETED
Last edited by sop on Tue Feb 09, 2010 4:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Obie
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Post by Obie » Thu Aug 27, 2009 5:29 pm

Have a look at This Flow Chart. I suppose you might only get a 10 years ban.

Then again, if you were not aware of the deception and it was unintentional, you could be exempted from the ban
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

immigrationuk2009
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Re: Spouse Visa after Deception

Post by immigrationuk2009 » Fri Aug 28, 2009 10:15 am

sop wrote:hi,

i was refused visa under deception , CCL case...now i'd liek to apply for dependant visa as my husabnd is a full time student in London...any chances of getting / rejection??..i came back in Feb 09 before a period of 28 days on my own

will deception be an obstacle in obtaining dependent visa??

Pls suggest....im dead scared!!

thanks
Hi

You are banned for 10 years for any time of visa.

Please read general grounds for refusals.

UK_Banned_Member

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Casa
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Post by Casa » Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:12 pm

ImmigrationUK, this is a sweeping statement for a legal advisor to make without knowing the full facts of the refusal. The CCL cases are complex with appeals pending from students. This may fall into the same category as Obie has pointed out.
Are you OISC registered, or is this just the impression from your display name?

sop
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Post by sop » Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:37 am

DELETED
Last edited by sop on Tue Feb 09, 2010 4:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

sop
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Post by sop » Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:51 am

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... les/part9/

as per my understanding , it states that , ban is not applicable in dependants case and its applicable if i wudnt have left in 28days , on my own ie.e if i wud have been removed / deported

PLS CLARIFY

thxxx

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Post by Obie » Sat Aug 29, 2009 6:46 am

The 28 day ban is correct if you overstayed and left on your on accord shortly after, without being forced to or without public funds.

If you used deception to obtained an entry clearance, then the rule says a ban will be in place for 10 years, for any type of entry clearance you apply for.

If however a right of appeal was granted in your case, and it was found that you did not intentionally used deception to gain an entry clearance, you will be exempted from any ban.

If you read the link you provided us, you will find that it says the same thing.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

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Post by batleykhan » Sat Aug 29, 2009 10:10 am

ImmigrationUK, this is a sweeping statement for a legal advisor to make without knowing the full facts of the refusal. The CCL cases are complex with appeals pending from students. This may fall into the same category as Obie has pointed out.
Are you OISC registered, or is this just the impression from your display name?
Fully agree with Casa. This is not the first time this has been done.I think he should be careful because some poor sod will litterally take his advise and end up with serious consequences

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Post by keshgrover » Sat Aug 29, 2009 12:59 pm

batleykhan wrote:
ImmigrationUK, this is a sweeping statement for a legal advisor to make without knowing the full facts of the refusal. The CCL cases are complex with appeals pending from students. This may fall into the same category as Obie has pointed out.
Are you OISC registered, or is this just the impression from your display name?
Fully agree with Casa. This is not the first time this has been done.I think he should be careful because some poor sod will litterally take his advise and end up with serious consequences
I fully agree with obie and batleykhan. UK_Banned_Member has been giving reckless wrong advises at other places as well. UK_Banned_Member need to specify whether he is talking about his opinion or law.
KESH

sop
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Post by sop » Sat Aug 29, 2009 4:44 pm

the deception was unintentional and i was given right to appeal , however i dint appeal

thanxx for sharing ya opinions though!!!

sop
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Post by sop » Sat Aug 29, 2009 4:58 pm

hey guys..i hav found anoda link where one 1 side it says that i can apply for depndant , with no ban n on oda side it says , i cant aaply cus of sdecption...pls have a look!!!

http://www.ukvisas.gov.uk/en/ecg/refusa ... s#20576068

vinny
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Re: Spouse Visa after Deception

Post by vinny » Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:33 am

sop wrote:hi,

i was refused visa under deception , CCL case...now i'd liek to apply for dependant visa as my husabnd is a full time student in London...any chances of getting / rejection??..i came back in Feb 09 before a period of 28 days on my own

will deception be an obstacle in obtaining dependant visa??

Pls suggest....im dead scared!!

thanks
sop wrote:hi janabee,

pls guide me dear, gues i have teh same case..my husnband is in england n m in india , i applied for PSW but was refused on the grounds of deception , with right to appeal..i came back in feb09 on my own expense and taht too before teh period of 28 days, my only question is:

Do i have to wait to apply for student depandant visa??..or can i apply in Nov09??

Pls leme know if u hav any idea!!

thanks!!!
Spouses of British citizens or settled persons are exempted (paragraph 320(7C)) from the ban. Unfortunately, spouses of student visa holders are subject to it.
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

sop
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Post by sop » Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:23 pm

ya..but its not saying anywhere the same point u mentioned!!

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Post by samnton » Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:32 pm

Hi vinny & all,

My gf is in a similar situation as sop and i am here in UK on HSMP. She was on psw after ccl and cuz of every 1 getting refusals from ccl, she returned back once psw finished without applying for extension. Now i intend to marry her, would she be able to come as my dependent after marriage or she will face deception charge or ban?

Any guidance/advise will be much appreciated.

Thanks.

sop
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Post by sop » Mon Aug 31, 2009 4:37 pm

since she wasnt banned or anythin , u can easily mary her and she can come back!!!

vinny
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Post by vinny » Sun Sep 06, 2009 8:24 am

sop wrote:Dear all,

I'm a married girl an my husband is studying in London. i'd like to apply for student dependant visa in non 09, however i was refused once in jan'09 under the charges of deception with the right to appeal and was given 28 days to leave.1 year ban was imposed as well if i meet all these requirements and leave teh country voluntarily.

If u can pls have a look , i was given the follwoing letter , the highlighted point does show that spouse visa can be applied as decpetion charges on this visa aren't considered..Plsss suggest if i apply for Student Dependant visa befoe a period of 1 year??

Part 9 - General grounds for the refusal of entry clearance, leave to enter or variation of leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom
Immigration rules
Refusal of entry clearance or leave to enter the United Kingdom

320. In addition to the grounds of refusal of entry clearance or leave to enter set out in Parts 2-8 of these Rules, and subject to paragraph 321 below, the following grounds for the refusal of entry clearance or leave to enter apply:
Grounds on which entry clearance or leave to enter the United Kingdom is to be refused

(1) the fact that entry is being sought for a purpose not covered by these Rules;

(2) the fact that the person seeking entry to the United Kingdom is currently the subject of a deportation order;

(3) failure by the person seeking entry to the United Kingdom to produce to the Immigration Officer a valid national passport or other document satisfactorily establishing his identity and nationality;

(4) failure to satisfy the Immigration Officer, in the case of a person arriving in the United Kingdom or seeking entry through the Channel Tunnel with the intention of entering any other part of the common travel area, that he is acceptable to the immigration authorities there;

(5) failure, in the case of a visa national, to produce to the Immigration Officer a passport or other identity document endorsed with a valid and current United Kingdom entry clearance issued for the purpose for which entry is sought;

(6) where the Secretary of State has personally directed that the exclusion of a person from the United Kingdom is conducive to the public good;

(7) save in relation to a person settled in the United Kingdom or where the Immigration Officer is satisfied that there are strong compassionate reasons justifying admission, confirmation from the Medical Inspector that, for medical reasons, it is undesirable to admit a person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom.

(7A) where false representations have been made or false documents or information have been submitted (whether or not material to the application, and whether or not to the applicant's knowledge), or material facts have not been disclosed, in relation to the application.

(7B) subject to paragraph 320(7C), where the applicant has previously breached the UK's immigration laws by:

(a) Overstaying;

(b) breaching a condition attached to his leave;

(c) being an Illegal Entrant;

(d) using Deception in an application for entry clearance, leave to enter or remain (whether successful or not);

unless the applicant:

(i) Overstayed for 28 days or less and left the UK voluntarily, not at the expense (directly or indirectly) of the Secretary of State;

(ii) used Deception in an application for entry clearance more than 10 years ago;

(iii) left the UK voluntarily, not at the expense (directly or indirectly) of the Secretary of State, more than 12 months ago;

(iv) left the UK voluntarily, at the expense (directly or indirectly) of the Secretary of State, more than 5 years ago, or

(v) was removed or deported from the UK more than 10 years ago.

Where more than one breach of the UK's immigration laws has occurred, only the breach which leads to the longest period of absence from the UK will be relevant under this paragraph.

(7C) Paragraph 320(7B) shall not apply in the following circumstances:

(a) where the applicant is applying as:

(i) a spouse, civil partner or unmarried or same-gender partner under
paragraphs 281 or 295A,

(ii) a fiancé(e) or proposed civil partner under paragraph 290,

(iii) a parent, grandparent or other dependent relative under paragraph 317,

(iv) a person exercising rights of access to a child under paragraph 246, or

(v) a spouse, civil partner, unmarried or same-gender partner of a refugee or person with Humanitarian Protection under paragraphs 352A, 352AA, 352FA or 352FD; or

(b) where the individual was under the age of 18 at the time of his most recent breach of the UK's immigration laws.
Grounds on which entry clearance or leave to enter the United Kingdom should normally be refused

(8) failure by a person arriving in the United Kingdom to furnish the Immigration Officer with such information as may be required for the purpose of deciding whether he requires leave to enter and, if so, whether and on what terms leave should be given;

(8A) where the person seeking leave is outside the United Kingdom, failure by him to supply any information, documents, copy documents or medical report requested by an Immigration Officer;

(9) failure by a person seeking leave to enter as a returning resident to satisfy the Immigration Officer that he meets the requirements of paragraph 18 of these Rules, or that he seeks leave to enter for the same purpose as that for which his earlier leave was granted;

(10) production by the person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom of a national passport or travel document issued by a territorial entity or authority which is not recognised by Her Majesty's Government as a state or is not dealt with as a government by them, or which does not accept valid United Kingdom passports for the purpose of its own immigration control; or a passport or travel document which does not comply with international passport practice;

(11) where the applicant has previously contrived in a significant way to frustrate the intentions of these Rules. Guidance will be published giving examples of circumstances in which an applicant who has previously overstayed, breached a condition attached to his leave, been an Illegal Entrant or used Deception in an application for entry clearance, leave to enter or remain (whether successful or not) is likely to be considered as having contrived in a significant way to frustrate the intentions of these Rules.

(11) DELETED

(12) DELETED

(13) failure, except by a person eligible for admission to the United Kingdom for settlement or a spouse or civil partner eligible for admission under paragraph 282, to satisfy the Immigration Officer that he will be admitted to another country after a stay in the United Kingdom;

(14) refusal by a sponsor of a person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom to give, if requested to do so, an undertaking in writing to be responsible for that person's maintenance and accommodation for the period of any leave granted;

(15) whether or not to the holder's knowledge, the making of false representations or the failure to disclose any material fact for the purpose of obtaining an immigration employment document;

(16) failure, in the case of a child under the age of 18 years seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom otherwise than in conjunction with an application made by his parent(s) or legal guardian to provide the Immigration Officer, if required to do so, with written consent to the application from his parent(s) or legal guardian; save that the requirement as to written consent does not apply in the case of a child seeking admission to the United Kingdom as an asylum seeker;

(17) save in relation to a person settled in the United Kingdom, refusal to undergo a medical examination when required to do so by the Immigration Officer;

(18) save where the Immigration Officer is satisfied that admission would be justified for strong compassionate reasons, conviction in any country including the United Kingdom of an offence which, if committed in the United Kingdom, is punishable with imprisonment for a term of 12 months or any greater punishment or, if committed outside the United Kingdom, would be so punishable if the conduct constituting the offence had occurred in the United Kingdom;

(19) where, from information available to the Immigration Officer, it seems right to refuse leave to enter on the ground that exclusion from the United Kingdom is conducive to the public good; if, for example, in the light of the character, conduct or associations of the person seeking leave to enter it is undesirable to give him leave to enter.

(20) failure by a person seeking entry into the United Kingdom to comply with a requirement relating to the provision of physical data to which he is subject by regulations made under section 126 of the Nationality, Immigration and Asylum Act 2002.

(21) DELETED
Refusal of leave to enter in relation to a person in possession of an entry clearance

321. A person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom who holds an entry clearance which was duly issued to him and is still current may be refused leave to enter only where the Immigration Officer is satisfied that:

(i) False representations were made or false documents or information were submitted (whether or not material to the application, and whether or not to the holder's knowledge), or material facts were not disclosed, in relation to the application for entry clearance; or

(ii) a change of circumstances since it was issued has removed the basis of the holder's claim to admission, except where the change of circumstances amounts solely to the person becoming over age for entry in one of the categories contained in paragraphs 296-316 of these Rules since the issue of the entry clearance; or

(iii) refusal is justified on grounds of restricted return ability; on medical grounds; on grounds of criminal record; because the person seeking leave to enter is the subject of a deportation order or because exclusion would be conducive to the public good.

Grounds on which leave to enter or remain which is in force is to be cancelled at port or while the holder is outside the United Kingdom

321A. The following grounds for the cancellation of a person's leave to enter or remain which is in force on his arrival in, or whilst he is outside, the United Kingdom apply;

(1) there has been such a change in the circumstances of that person's case since the leave was given, that it should be cancelled; or

(2) false representations were made or false documents were submitted (whether or not material to the application, and whether or not to the holder's knowledge), or material facts were not disclosed, in relation to the application for leave; or

(3) save in relation to a person settled in the United Kingdom or where the Immigration Officer or the Secretary of State is satisfied that there are strong compassionate reasons justifying admission, where it is apparent that, for medical reasons, it is undesirable to admit that person to the United Kingdom; or

(4) where the Secretary of State has personally directed that the exclusion of that person from the United Kingdom is conducive to the public good; or

(5) where from information available to the Immigration Officer or the Secretary of State, it seems right to cancel leave on the ground that exclusion from the United Kingdom is conductive to the public good; if, for example, in the light of the character, conduct or associations of that person it is undesirable for him to have leave to enter the United Kingdom; or

(6) where that person is outside the United Kingdom, failure by that person to supply any information, documents, copy documents or medical report requested by an Immigration Officer or the Secretary of State.
Refusal of variation of leave to enter or remain or curtailment of leave

322. In addition to the grounds for refusal of extension of stay set out in Parts 2-8 of these Rules, the following provisions apply in relation to the refusal of an application for variation of leave to enter or remain or, where appropriate, the curtailment of leave:
Grounds on which leave to remain in the United Kingdom is to be refused

(1) the fact that variation of leave to enter or remain is being sought for a purpose not covered by these Rules.

(1A) where false representations have been made or false documents or information have been submitted (whether or not material to the application, and whether or not to the applicant's knowledge), or material facts have not been disclosed, in relation to the application.
Grounds on which leave to remain in the United Kingdom should normally be refused

(2) the making of false representations or the failure to disclose any material fact for the purpose of obtaining leave to enter or a previous variation of leave;

(3) failure to comply with any conditions attached to the grant of leave to enter or remain;

(4) failure by the person concerned to maintain or accommodate himself and any dependants without recourse to public funds;

(5) the undesirability of permitting the person concerned to remain in the United Kingdom in the light of his character, conduct or associations or the fact that he represents a threat to national security;

(6) refusal by a sponsor of the person concerned to give, if requested to do so, an undertaking in writing to be responsible for his maintenance and accommodation in the United Kingdom or failure to honour such an undertaking once given;

(7) failure by the person concerned to honour any declaration or undertaking given orally or in writing as to the intended duration and/or purpose of his stay;

(8) failure, except by a person who qualifies for settlement in the United Kingdom or by the spouse or civil partner of a person settled in the United Kingdom, to satisfy the Secretary of State that he will be returnable to another country if allowed to remain in the United Kingdom for a further period;

(9) failure by an applicant to produce within a reasonable time information, documents or other evidence required by the Secretary of State to establish his claim to remain under these Rules;

(10) failure, without providing a reasonable explanation, to comply with a request made on behalf of the Secretary of State to attend for interview;

(11) failure, in the case of a child under the age of 18 years seeking a variation of his leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom otherwise than in conjunction with an application by his parent(s) or legal guardian, to provide the Secretary of State, if required to do so, with written consent to the application from his parent(s) or legal guardian; save that the requirement as to written consent does not apply in the case of a child who has been admitted to the United Kingdom as an asylum seeker.
Grounds on which leave to enter or remain may be curtailed

323. A person's leave to enter or remain may be curtailed:

(i) on any of the grounds set out in paragraph 322(2)-(5) above; or

(ii) if he ceases to meet the requirements of the Rules under which his leave to enter or remain was granted; or

(iii) if he is the dependant, or is seeking leave to remain as the dependant, of an asylum applicant whose claim has been refused and whose leave has been curtailed under section 7 of the1993 Act, and he does not qualify for leave to remain in his own right.

(iv) on any of the grounds set out in paragraph 339A (i)-(vi) and paragraph 339G (i)-(vi).

Curtailment of leave or alteration of duration of leave in relation to a Tier 2 Migrant, a Tier 5 Migrant or a Tier 5 Migrant

323A. In addition to the grounds specified in paragraph 323, the leave to enter or remain of a Tier 2 Migrant or a Tier 5 (Temporary Worker) Migrant may be curtailed, or its duration altered, if:

(a) the migrant's Sponsor ceases to have a sponser licence (for whatever reason)

(b) the migrant's Sponsor transfers the business for which the migrant works or at which the migrant is studying to another person, that person does not have a sponser licence and that person:

(i) fails to apply for a sponser licence within 28 days of the date of the transfwer of the business,

(ii) applies for a sponser licence but is refused, or

(iii) applies for a sponser licence and is granted one, but not in a category that would allow it to issue a Certificate of Sponsorship to the migrant,

(c) the migrant fails to commence, or ceases, working for the Sponsor, or

(d) in the case of a Tier 4 Migrant:

(i) the migrant fails to commence studying with the Sponsor, or

(ii) the migrant studies at an institution other than that which issued the visa letter on the basis of which the migrant?s current entry clearance, leave to enter or leave to remain was granted unless the United Kingdom Border Agency has given its written consent for the migrant to transfer to another Sponsor, or

(iii) the migrant ceases studying with the Sponsor.

Crew members

324. A person who has been given leave to enter to join a ship, aircraft, hovercraft, hydrofoil or international train service as a member of its crew, or a crew member who has been given leave to enter for hospital treatment, repatriation or transfer to another ship, aircraft, hovercraft, hydrofoil or international train service in the United Kingdom, is to be refused leave to remain unless an extension of stay is necessary to fulfil the purpose for which he was given leave to enter or unless he meets the requirements for an extension of stay as a spouse or civil partner in paragraph 284.
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
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vinny
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Post by vinny » Sun Sep 06, 2009 8:30 am

(7C) Paragraph 320(7B) shall not apply in the following circumstances:

(a) where the applicant is applying as:

(i) a spouse, civil partner or unmarried or same-gender partner under
paragraphs 281 or 295A,
Unfortunately, a spouse of a student visa holder is not under paragraphs 281 or 295A. Paragraphs 76-78 or 319A-319E are applicable to spouses of students or Tier 4 holders respectively.
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

sop
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Post by sop » Fri Sep 11, 2009 8:05 am

right ok..so can i apply after the ban period is over????

vinny
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Post by vinny » Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:38 pm

Yes, provided you are eligible and don't fall under any other grounds for refusal.
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

sop
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Post by sop » Sat Sep 12, 2009 6:08 am

vinny, in general grounds it says refusal under deception unless the applicant has overstayed, now what does that mean????

i have used deception , however i dint overstay..does my application b automatically rejected or do i have any chance of getting student dependant visa after the ban period is over??

pls suggest!!..thxxx

AppealUK
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Re: Spouse Visa after Deception

Post by AppealUK » Sat Sep 12, 2009 8:07 pm

vinny wrote:,


Spouses of British citizens or settled persons are exempted (paragraph 320(7C)) from the ban. Unfortunately, spouses of student visa holders are subject to it.
Hi Vinny,
Pls correct if I am wrong in understanding. Do you mean a person applying as a spouse of British Citizen is exempted from any kind of ban under all deception rules and even 7(A) above...

Got bit confused

Thanks

vinny
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Post by vinny » Sat Sep 12, 2009 10:38 pm

Yes. However, [quote="RFL3.3 Refusal where applicant has previously breached UK law"]ECOs need to consider whether it is appropriate to refuse the applicant under paragraph 320(11) of the immigration rules where the applicant has “previously contrived in a significant way to frustrate the intentions of the Immigration Rules.â€
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

AppealUK
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Post by AppealUK » Sat Sep 12, 2009 11:03 pm

[quote="vinny"]Yes. However, [quote="RFL3.3 Refusal where applicant has previously breached UK law"]ECOs need to consider whether it is appropriate to refuse the applicant under paragraph 320(11) of the immigration rules where the applicant has “previously contrived in a significant way to frustrate the intentions of the Immigration Rules.â€

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Post by Obie » Sun Sep 13, 2009 1:55 am

Factors to consider for Para 320(11) Refusal wrote: When can you refuse under para 320 (11)?
This is a discretionary refusal where an applicant has ‘contrived in a significant way to undermine the intentions of the immigration rules’ and where there are aggravating circumstances. This means where an applicant has either:


been an illegal entrant; or
overstayed; or
breached a condition attached to his leave; or
used deception in a previous entry clearance or leave to enter or remain application;
and there are aggravating circumstances. These include offences such as:

absconding;
not complying with reporting restrictions;
using an assumed identity or multiple identities to obtain asylum benefits, state benefits, tax credits goods or services;
receiving NHS care to which not entitled;
a sham marriage;
harbouring an immigration offender; and
facilitating/people smuggling.

This is not an exhaustive list and all cases must be considered on their merits taking into account family life in the UK and the level of responsibility for the breach in the case of children. ECOs will need to obtain ECM authorisation for all refusals under Paragraph 320(11).
This is a discretionary refusal.

Where an applicant falls to be refused under 320(7A) or 320(7B), the ECO must also consider whether it is also appropriate to refuse the applicant under paragraph 320(11). Where 320(7C) applies which makes an applicant exempt from 320(7B), an ECO must consider whether a refusal under paragraph 320(11) is appropriate
Factors for 320(7B) refusal wrote: (7B) subject to paragraph 320(7C), where the applicant has previously breached the UK's immigration laws by:

(a) Overstaying;

(b) breaching a condition attached to his leave;

(c) being an Illegal Entrant;

(d) using Deception in an application for entry clearance, leave to enter or remain (whether successful or not);
The extent of breach for 320(11) is obviously much greater, than that of 320(7B). 320(11) also list aggraviating factors which are not present in 320 (7B)

Also please note that 320(7C) people can also find themselves excluded on grounds of 320(18 ) and 320(19) , as they are not exempted from this.
Smooth seas do not make skilful sailors

sop
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Post by sop » Sun Sep 13, 2009 8:35 am

hi vinny..m still waitin for ya reply..pls suggest..txx

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