REFUSED RC: NO RIGHT OF APPEAL

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Tue May 14, 2013 4:02 pm

Hi there, I am new on this board.
My immigration history.
I am from Pakistan. I came first in July 2007 in UK as student and get PSW till october 2010.
In October 2010 I applied for student visa, returned my documents due to Picture. I again sent my Application during this time my Visa expired so Ho retained my passport which expired in 2011 and then i went for Judicial review (JR).
In late 2011 I met my wife who is from Bulgaria. In early 2012 we started living together. After 8 months, in August 2012 we married.
I sent my RC application through lawyer on late August 2012 stating that they got my Passport already.
HO did not sent us COA till November. Then my lawyer sent them reminder and Ho emailed him that they did not received my application. Lawyer sent Ho Royal mail recorded delivery proof.
Then they issue us Coa and asked further document and my Passport. We provided documents and again wrote that UKBA already had my passport.Any was 08/02 Ho refused my RC application on basis that I did not provide vaild passport as the passport with them is already expired on 2011. There was no right of appeal. My lawyer worte to case worker that her decision is unlawful. But she took that reply as JR and replied that she couldnt cange her decsion and any further corespondence should be to Jucial Review Unit.

On 7 May my lawyer sent grounds for appeal to High court. My question is how long will it take to High court for my JR.

My RC TimeLine:

RC Application sent : 19/08/2012
Reminder to send COA: 28/11/2012
COA issued (Further document requested) : 17/01/2013
Refused RC: 08/02/13 (No right of Appeal as my passport was expired)
Pre-Action Protocol : 13/03/2013
Grounds for Appeal sent to High Court : 07/05/2013

My basic question is how long High court take to decide.

Post by **sheraz7** » Tue May 14, 2013 5:24 pm

Juss wrote: I again sent my Application during this time my Visa expired so Ho retained my passport which expired in 2011 and then i went for Judicial review (JR).

If the passport is already with the HO then how you managed to give marriage notice at registrar office.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Tue May 14, 2013 5:27 pm

Basically iv got my Pakistani ID card and Uk driving licence.

Post by **sheraz7** » Tue May 14, 2013 5:33 pm

If HO retained your passport then most usually they must have served you with the notice to leave the country and report to the enforcement authorities who are holding your passport with ticket. If that was not your case then you must have released your passport at that time by fulfilling the requirements necessary for it. But now I think UKBA has made correct decision because your passport is already expired and the passport must be valid at the time of application.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Tue May 14, 2013 5:35 pm

To renew my passport in Uk i need valid leave to remain. Any advice?

What will happen in JR as my lawyer said that they should issue you RC at first instance. What will happen next?. How long Court take for hearing as my lawyer advised me to go for paper hearing.

Anyone in same boat?

Schastlivchik · Post by **Schastlivchik** » Tue May 14, 2013 6:07 pm

Juss wrote:To renew my passport in Uk i need valid leave to remain. Any advice?

What will happen in JR as my lawyer said that they should issue you RC at first instance. What will happen next?. How long Court take for hearing as my lawyer advised me to go for paper hearing.

Anyone in same boat?

Hi my friend has the same problem he was refused in march his passport was invalid when he applied. And same reason and no Appel rights. Well he want to the court and they let him appeal but the court will only be in September. Hope in your case it will be faster.

Post by **sheraz7** » Tue May 14, 2013 9:35 pm

Juss wrote:To renew my passport in Uk i need valid leave to remain. Any advice?

What will happen in JR as my lawyer said that they should issue you RC at first instance. What will happen next?. How long Court take for hearing as my lawyer advised me to go for paper hearing.

Anyone in same boat?

Yes because overseas passport authorities do not renew the passport without any leave/visa and the same (valid passport) HO need as well even request it back anytime after forwarding them the application. But they want valid original passport even the visa is expired under EEA application route.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Wed May 15, 2013 9:46 am

Hi anyone who got same experience of expired passport with HO.

Please help me?

Thanks

Schastlivchik · Post by **Schastlivchik** » Wed May 15, 2013 10:29 am

Juss wrote:Hi anyone who got same experience of expired passport with HO.

Please help me?

Thanks

Hi please tell me on which grounds your solicitor going to appeal? In a eea directive it's clearly says that the passport should be valid. May be its easier to go home and apply for family permit make a new passport and come back. May be your solicitor by advising you to appeal just want your money?

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Wed May 15, 2013 10:44 am

No he did my my grounds not so much money he demanded.
This is a part of grounds for appeal:

“5.1.10 No evidence of non-EEA national’s identity

Under Regulation 17 (1) (a) of the 2006 Regulations we are only required to issue a Residence Card to those non-EEA family members who produce a valid passport. Where an applicant produces a marriage certificate, but does not produce any evidence of their identity, we cannot be satisfied that they are the person to whom the marriage certificate relates. We cannot, therefore, be satisfied that they are the person who actually married the EEA national. In such cases, the application for a residence card should be refused. There would be no right of appeal under the Regulations in cases where no evidence of identity is produced... [original emphasis]

Applicants producing insufficient evidence of identity

Where an applicant produces a marriage certificate, but produces insufficient evidence of identity, for instance, they may produce a birth certificate, an identity card with no photo or forged documents, we cannot be satisfied that they are the person to whom the marriage certificate relates. In such cases, we should initially write to the applicant requesting conclusive evidence as to their identity (i.e. a passport, or Home Office ID i.e. ARC card) or another form of conclusive evidence (see section below). If they fail to produce further evidence, then we would refuse the application. The applicant would have a right of appeal under Regulation 26 (3) (b) of the 2006 Regulations”.

Now my appeal is in Queen's Bench high court. Anyone know what will happen next and how long it will take.

thanks all of you guys

Schastlivchik · Post by **Schastlivchik** » Wed May 15, 2013 11:13 am

Juss wrote:No he did my my grounds not so much money he demanded.
This is a part of grounds for appeal:

“5.1.10 No evidence of non-EEA national’s identity

Under Regulation 17 (1) (a) of the 2006 Regulations we are only required to issue a Residence Card to those non-EEA family members who produce a valid passport. Where an applicant produces a marriage certificate, but does not produce any evidence of their identity, we cannot be satisfied that they are the person to whom the marriage certificate relates. We cannot, therefore, be satisfied that they are the person who actually married the EEA national. In such cases, the application for a residence card should be refused. There would be no right of appeal under the Regulations in cases where no evidence of identity is produced... [original emphasis]

Applicants producing insufficient evidence of identity

Where an applicant produces a marriage certificate, but produces insufficient evidence of identity, for instance, they may produce a birth certificate, an identity card with no photo or forged documents, we cannot be satisfied that they are the person to whom the marriage certificate relates. In such cases, we should initially write to the applicant requesting conclusive evidence as to their identity (i.e. a passport, or Home Office ID i.e. ARC card) or another form of conclusive evidence (see section below). If they fail to produce further evidence, then we would refuse the application. The applicant would have a right of appeal under Regulation 26 (3) (b) of the 2006 Regulations”.

Now my appeal is in Queen's Bench high court. Anyone know what will happen next and how long it will take.

thanks all of you guys

Thanks for you reply. Sorry I don't know how long does it take for court to make a desicion but when it made and if you win HO can appeal to high court within 7 days I think and if they don't they have to issue your RC immediately. But usually takes around 2month to get your RC.
Appeal timeline :
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewto ... &start=280

EEA2 · Post by **EEA2** » Wed May 15, 2013 9:36 pm

Hi there we are in a same boat mate. I was refused because of invalid passport after 11 month waiting. No right of appeal also. My solicitor sent letter to court asking for appeal last week. Still waiting.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Wed May 15, 2013 10:26 pm

Very sad to hear for you.
So how your passport was expired. Little bit immigratio history
What are grounds of appeal.

Thanks for ur reply

EEA2 · Post by **EEA2** » Thu May 16, 2013 8:18 am

hi! I came here as a student in 2005 and was refused a visa in 2009 because not enough funds on my account. I lost the appeal. And after was leaving here illegally. Than I met my future wife in 2010 after leaving together for about 2 years we got married and applied for RC. my passport was 2 month expired at the time. I got COA after couple of month and refusal letter after 11 month. My solicitor said he will win the case because I couldn't make a new passport in UK because of no visa. But my wife contacted 100 layers everyone saying I have no chance to win. I don't know what to do and what to expect.
What do you think Juss and other guys on this forum do I have a chance? or its just waste of time???

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Thu May 16, 2013 8:50 am

I hope that your and my lawyer are right as i know some one who was visitor here expired his passport and got indefinite leave to remain.
First his visa Sticker come on A4.
Problem is with dodgy regulations by UKBA. I contacted to many lawyers and they said that this decision can be challenged in UK.

So im hopeful.

Best of LUCK.

Babz · Post by **Babz** » Thu May 16, 2013 12:28 pm

Juss wrote:To renew my passport in Uk i need valid leave to remain. Any advice?

Why not go to your country's high commission with UKBA letter...You could be lucky they might issue you a new passort

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Thu May 16, 2013 12:38 pm

No i went to renew my passport but they said no. They want valid VISA then i can renew my passport.

Any one who got Visa when his Passport was expired??????

Thanks.

Post by **sheraz7** » Thu May 16, 2013 2:57 pm

Juss wrote:I hope that your and my lawyer are right as i know some one who was visitor here expired his passport and got indefinite leave to remain.
First his visa Sticker come on A4.
Problem is with dodgy regulations by UKBA. I contacted to many lawyers and they said that this decision can be challenged in UK.

So im hopeful.

Best of LUCK.

Under EEA application route the expiry of visa does not matter but an expired passport certainly cause problem. A visa/residence permit can be issued on A4 sized page especially on those occasions when UKBA has already returned the valid (unexpired) passport to applicant on its request. But at the time of forwarding the application UKBA always need original valid passport.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Thu May 16, 2013 3:02 pm

Yes you are right Shera

But hope for best iv seen many case where they issue RC even on expired passport. They need passport as proof that this is same person who was married to EEA memeber.

Post by **sheraz7** » Thu May 16, 2013 3:09 pm

Juss wrote:Yes you are right Shera

But hope for best iv seen many case where they issue RC even on expired passport. They need passport as proof that this is same person who was married to EEA memeber.

Passport need to be valid at the time of sending application and it can be expired while being possessed by UKBA for 6 months which is usual.

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Thu May 16, 2013 3:22 pm

Thanks Sheraz

We will see what happen next.
Anyway i will be in touch here.
Thanks you are updating me.

EEA2 · Post by **EEA2** » Thu May 16, 2013 7:05 pm

Hi Juss what your solicitor says , how long does it normally take to hear from court? Have he ever dealt with cases like that?

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Thu May 16, 2013 7:16 pm

He told me that there is no time frame but hr and 3 other solicitor told me that in this case they eventually grant RC.

Allah may help all those who are in trouble.
So what was your immigration history. How ur paaport expired
What other reasons of refusal.

EEA2 · Post by **EEA2** » Thu May 16, 2013 7:30 pm

there is no other reasons just this. I think they didn't even open my application ,after 11 month they just check the passport and refused straight away . I am wondering what if I win the case will they ask me to send all paperwork back to them or they will have to grant the RC?
But did they let you appeal? I am waiting for court to tell me weather I can appeal and if yes I will have to wait for hearing date, 2-3month the lawyer told me. And did they give you any other reason on refusal letter?

Juss · Post by **Juss** » Fri May 17, 2013 1:19 pm

Hi everyone i discussed my case with Riaz Gull Immigration lawyer on Venus Tv and he was surprised to know that why they did not issue me RC. If they got my passport and marriage certificate what else they need. Even it was expired i was the same person. I provided other IDs like my driving licence but they didnt accepted. My lawyer said that they need to issue me RC. This can take time now but that decision is unlawful and irrational.

Allah may help all.

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REFUSED RC: NO RIGHT OF APPEAL