P11 refused as replacement of RT FPS

[zimba]

Zimba,

I have submit P11 and P46(Starter checklist) for start date and p45 who left from the firm. Do you think so is that suffice ? or Can we send additional documents before HO made decision ?

Thanks

You have to wait and see as you are not allowed to add any extra documents after you submitted your application.
FPS reports seem to be required as I explained earlier in this thread regarding the interpretation of the rules. http://www.immigrationboards.com/uk-tie ... l#p1346697

[regularuser]

This guy also got his ILR as he submitted P11.

by rahulsingh1 » Tue May 05, 2015 2:43 pm

Hi All, We have received our Accelerated ILR(10 jobs) today (within 4 weeks of application)- we had to expedite it as there was a health problem.

This list can be used for extension also

Here are the documents we submitted

company creation and running
1) CT41G
2) Companies house appointment report - download from website for £3.
3) Company creation certificate
4) Letter from bank saying that our business account is with them from xxx date, and it currently has xxx money - NO bank statements

investment
5) Companies management accounts for 3 years - done in 1 document - NOT for 3 years differently
6) Cover letter from accountant, that he has done the accounts and that we have invested £200,000 into the company via director loan
7) Simple Director loan agreement

employment creation
8 ) Employee passport copy
9) Employee payslips for whole period ( monthly paylsip, NOT weekly)
10) Employee P11 for each year (showing starting date of employee)
11) Letter from accountant saying that the jobs have been created,
12) Letter from accountant explaining that the P11s are in monthly format(and not weekly) as the payment of salaries is done monthly.

[Mrchaany]

he i knew that but now the guidance now changed and new guidance there is no P11, only RTIS

[jafersadeq]

he i knew that but now the guidance now changed and new guidance there is no P11, only RTIS

Nothing changed regarding FPS and P11, below is 2015 rules:
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=doqtrk&s=9#.VzjScWZfvBI

Thanks

[Mrchaany]

I don't want argue
Some users have been refused regarding their p11 instead of Real time RTIs

[ericn]

I have done some research on form p35. It can be call "Employers annual return". I don't think this form can be call Employee payment record.
So which form is actually called "Employee payment record" in 46-SD(i)?
If it is not P11, what else can it be?
If it is P11, that means HO has made hidden changes to the rule in 46-SD(i) but never publish it. This worth a AR or even JR.

[ericn]

Paragraph 46-SD(h)(i) is regarding evidence for reporting PAYE while Paragraph 46-SD(h)(vii) is listing documents to calculate net increase. So they are different.

I found a past guide document for case worker. At page 87, P11 is named as a example of Employee Payment Records:
http://clientextranet.in/highnet/wp-con ... ur_4.0.pdf

The exact clause for this requirement is written under 46-SD(h)(i):

evidence to show the applicant is reporting Pay As You Earn (PAYE ) income tax appropriately to HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC), such as printouts of Employee Payment Records, Real Time-Full Payment Submissions (either a series of individual monthly submissions including the first submission or summaries), or original HM Revenue & Customs P45 or P46, which either together or individually show the total payments made to the settled workers, as well as the tax deducted and date which they started work with the applicant’s business;

Given the recent refusals, I highly suspect that the the Employee Payment Records mentioned above does not mean P11 but possibly refers to the old P35 reports (before RTI reporting came into force in 2013)
Now that everyone has to report via RTI, P35 is not used at all. However it appears in the rules for people who might have to score points for any employment created in early 2013 or earlier and outside RTI.

My claim can be supported if you pay more attention to a similar clause which applies only to applicants who have joined/taken over an existing business. In their case, the rules clearly differentiate between the two and demand you to send either a P35s for pre-RTI and FPS reports for post RTI.
This is written under 46-SD(h)(vii):

if the applicant took over or joined a business that employed workers before he joined it, he must provide the following documentation for the year immediately before the jobs were created and the year that the jobs were created, showing the net increase in employment and signed and dated by the applicant:
(1) duplicate HM Revenue & Customers Full Payment Submission sent to HMRC under Real Time; or
(2) if the business started employing staff for which points are being claimed before they were reporting under Real Time, a form P35,

[zimba]

I wish this can be clarified by HO but I am not holding my breath. I suggest everyone to send FPS with their application

[sky_rise]

just a quick question here: i am submitting all FPS RTI, but also all P46/45 forms. All this for the period AFTER PAYE RTI was introduced. Do we need to sign also P45/46?

[thutmose]

Those are not required. As they are printed from the same commercial software. I would suggest you to sign them too.

[zimba]

just a quick question here: i am submitting all FPS RTI, but also all P46/45 forms. All this for the period AFTER PAYE RTI was introduced. Do we need to sign also P45/46?

P46 is not used any more. I suggest to rely only on FPS reports. You should send P45s if your employee left to show the leaving date. Sign and initial FPS reports

[jafersadeq]

just a quick question here: i am submitting all FPS RTI, but also all P46/45 forms. All this for the period AFTER PAYE RTI was introduced. Do we need to sign also P45/46?

P46 is not used any more. I suggest to rely only on FPS reports. You should send P45s if your employee left to show the leaving date. Sign and initial FPS reports

Dear Zimba,

Is it ok to write the full name (writing) or just the initial?

Thanks

[thutmose]

P46 is not used any more. I suggest to rely only on FPS reports. You should send P45s if your employee left to show the leaving date. Sign and initial FPS reports

Is P60 required if the employee worked say June to next june?

And also there is an end date column on the form. What should we write for employees still working? I wish to write the last payslip date date to show 12 months. Or shall I put till date?

Thanks in advance zimba.

[zimba]

Is P60 required if the employee worked say June to next june?

No

And also there is an end date column on the form. What should we write for employees still working? I wish to write the last payslip date date to show 12 months. Or shall I put till date?

End of the 12 months usually or the period you are claiming points for

[sm12]

When had you applied?
Have you considered reapplying?

[regularuser]

Any update in your AR ?

[yang_81]

Hi, everyone, Just wondering if you could help me.

My extension has been refused as I did't sumbit FPS.

The reply quoted paragraph 46-SD(h)(i) of Appendix A of Immigration Rules. And said form 2013 the appropriate evidence is RT FPS and I have not submitted this.

I have options of adminstrative review or new fresh application.

But do anyone think I have a change to win in administrative review due to evidence flexibility policy?

Thanks

[Mrchaany]

sorry for your refusal
this forum will help you if you put the exact wording of ukvi about your application so some one will help you.
Note. RTIs FPS is the most important documents for job creation points. if you failed to submit RTIs so there is very minor chances at AR, Although, so many people have successfully extended their visas after reapplied.
thanks
ik

[Mrchaany]

paragraph 46-SD(h)(i) is following.

(h) if the applicant is required to score points for job creation in Table 5 or Table 6, he must provide the following:
(i) evidence to show the applicant is reporting Pay As You Earn (PAYE ) income tax appropriately to HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC), such as printouts of Employee Payment Records, Real Time-Full Payment Submissions (either a series of individual monthly submissions including the first submission or summaries), or original HM & Customs P45 or P46, which either together or individually show the total payments made to the settled workers, as well as the tax deducted and date which they started work with the applicant’s business; and

[yang_81]

Thanks for ur reply. Here is exact writing in the refuse letter:

You have claimed points on the basis that you have created the equivalent of two new full-time paid jobs for people settled in the UK and that these jobs have each existed for at least 12 months.

As evidence of this, you have supplied:
+passport copies
+wage slips
+payroll summaries
+P11's
+P45's

Paragraph 46-SD(h) of Appendix A of the Immigration Rules lists the specified that is required to demonstrate the creation of jobs.

As specified at paragraph 46-SD(h)(i) you are required to show that you are appropriately reporting Pay As You Earn to HM Revenue and Custom. From October 2013 the appropriate evidence is Real Time-Full Payment Submission, you have not provided any evidence of this and therefore the hours you have claime have been discounted.

We have therefore been unable to award points for Attributes in accordance with Appendix A.

[zimba]

Submit a fresh application with FPS reports as required. AR would be waste of time given that you get the same outcome

[Mrchaany]

Agree with zimba88

[yang_81]

Thx for your suggestion, I get the FPS from my accountant, it is just two pieces of paper, it contains information like my company name, the accountant user name, submit date&time, submit status, correlation ID, number of employees paid, and amount of employee NI, amount of student loan and final submission status. I am a bit confused is that all information? What is first full payment submission report in the first month of employment that shows the starter's name and date? Is that employee payment record?
Sorry for keep asking:( really stressed

[zimba]

Please search the thread and forum for FPS samples. It has already been discussed many many times here

[yang_81]

Thank you zimba88, I have read Manual FPS topic, but I m worried that if I do manual FPS while the FPS my accountant had been submitted will be not the same. I m still confused if FPS is produced for each employee on monthly basis? which means each employee thorough all employment period will have a couple of months FPS?