Sponsoring EEA family member for period when was a child

[theuser2017]

I have been battling with this for a long time, I would really appreciate some help.

I have question regarding eligibility for Permanent Residence (PR). I will explain my case below.

I was born in October 1992. I came to England in August 2005. In September 2005, I started High School. I have been in full-time education,sixth form college then university until June 2016 with no gaps.

I started a part time job in September 2016 and full time employment in January 2017. I have not been absent from the country for more than a month per calendar year.

My father came to England in May 2004 and he has been working full time ever since, with one exception where we was made redundant for a year in 2007 and he was looking for work actively and was registered for Job Seeker allowance etc. In August 2011 he had his citizenship ceremony( he obtained citizenship in end of July I think)

My mother came with me at the same time in August 2005 and she has been working part time and then full time for period of 2005-2011. After 2011 she has been working part time until 2014. In June 2014 she left the country permanently back to Poland. We are all Polish.

I would like to apply for PR on the basis that I obtained PR in 2010 as a child/family member of an EEA national (my father).Since my father became a citizen as of 2011, is he able to sponsor my application ? I understand that as a UK citizen he is not exercising treaty rights but I do not see why he cannot sponsor my application for that period (2005-2010).

Also, as I was a child in full time education and my parents were working full time I did not require to have Comprehensive Sickness Insurance (CSI) and I was financially dependent on them until end of 2016.

Given I am able to supply the following evidence:
my father’s P60, his photograph, 2 photographs of myself, birth certificate, translation of the birth certificate, letter from high school and sixth form college confirming my attendance, GCSEs and A level certificates.

Are there any issues with my reasoning and thus problems in obtaining PR in this way ? If there are then is my mother able to sponsor me ? Also, I am not present on council tax because I was a child.

[Richard W]

Are there any issues with my reasoning and thus problems in obtaining PR in this way ? If there are then is my mother able to sponsor me ? Also, I am not present on council tax because I was a child.

The workers registration scheme could cause problems. Can you prove your parents were registered? Lack of registration would mean that a parent did not count as a 'qualified person'. If that is not a problem, and only the truth, as opposed to the provable truth, mattered, you would most clearly qualify on the basis of your mother. (Indeed, it is not impossible that your father acquired PR on the basis of her working while he was unemployed.) I'm not going to volunteer an opinion on whether your father remained a qualified person while he was unemployed.

[theuser2017]

Are there any issues with my reasoning and thus problems in obtaining PR in this way ? If there are then is my mother able to sponsor me ? Also, I am not present on council tax because I was a child.

The workers registration scheme could cause problems. Can you prove your parents were registered? Lack of registration would mean that a parent did not count as a 'qualified person'. If that is not a problem, and only the truth, as opposed to the provable truth, mattered, you would most clearly qualify on the basis of your mother. (Indeed, it is not impossible that your father acquired PR on the basis of her working while he was unemployed.) I'm not going to volunteer an opinion on whether your father remained a qualified person while he was unemployed.

Thank you and I really appreciate your reply.

Both of my parents were registered under Workers Registration Scheme as soon as they arrived in the UK. I would prefer my father to sponsor my application as he is in the country. My mother has left, I failed to mention they divorced in around April 2016 (I think) but I do not think it makes any difference regarding the period 2005-2010. What matters is that she left more than 2 years ago therefore she lost her Permanent Residence status(she never applied for any document certifying it). I believe this means she cannot sponsor me for the period 2005-2010. When she left to Poland, she hasn't undertook any employment.

My father was claiming benefits, actively looking for work and he received money from a British insurance company as he was insured in case he lost his job. He had to remain a 'qualified person' while he was unemployed because he first applied for PR and then for citizenship.

How would you advice to proceed ? I do not want to wait until Brexit and deal with more bureaucracy...

[Richard W]

Both of my parents were registered under Workers Registration Scheme as soon as they arrived in the UK. I would prefer my father to sponsor my application as he is in the country. My mother has left, I failed to mention they divorced in around April 2016 (I think) but I do not think it makes any difference regarding the period 2005-2010. What matters is that she left more than 2 years ago therefore she lost her Permanent Residence status(she never applied for any document certifying it). I believe this means she cannot sponsor me for the period 2005-2010. When she left to Poland, she hasn't undertook any employment.

The fact that she has lost her status as a permanent resident is irrelevant. You and she acquired permanent residence at the same time, and you have not lost it.

You may find it easier to establish your right on a mix. Use your mother's working for while your father was unemployed, and your father for the rest of the time. Of course, I might be worrying unnecessarily about your father's period of unemployment - I am disappointed no-one has dared to offer an opinion about whether he was a qualified person throughout the five years.

How would you advice to proceed ? I do not want to wait until Brexit and deal with more bureaucracy...

Actually, the proposed scheme of settled status on the basis of 5 years residence is intended to simplify the process - the Home Office can't cope with all the EEA permanent residents applying for DCPR. I don't think the 'generous' offer was made out of the kindness of May's heart. The downsides are that (1) habitual and serious criminals will be excluded; (2) Poles in the UK will cease to have greater rights to family (re)unification than British citizens; and (3) the ability to switch the country of residence will be lost - your mother won't easily return to the UK long term.

[theuser2017]

You may find it easier to establish your right on a mix. Use your mother's working for while your father was unemployed, and your father for the rest of the time. Of course, I might be worrying unnecessarily about your father's period of unemployment - I am disappointed no-one has dared to offer an opinion about whether he was a qualified person throughout the five years.

He must have been a 'qualified person' since he obtained citizenship. I think this is correct logic.
I forgot to mention he that he did apply for PR using the then called EEA3 form.

Again, I really appreciate your input. I think what you proposed is the best option.
Today, when going through the application, in Section 9.1, I realised that if my father can find a document with a reference number certifying that he obtained Permanent Residence then it will not be necessary to submit all the documents such as P60 etc.

However, upon obtaining citizenship, one is required to return the PR card within a week. I'm not sure that was the case in 2011 but most likely yes. I am not sure if the Home Office sends any other documents with a reference number, other the the PR card itself which I could greatly simplify my application.

Regarding Section 3 of EEA form, does this concern the relevant period based on which I'm applying for PR or the current situation or combination of both ?

Box 2 = I've lived in the UK for a continuous period of five years as an EEA national qualified person, the family member ... of a qualified person, or a combination of these.
Box 4 = I'm the family member ... of an EEA national who ceased activity.
Box 6 = I've retained my right of residence after my EEA national family member died or left the UK, or their marraige ... ended in divorcement,..., and I've lived in the UK for a continuous period of five years (including time spent as a family member).

Am I correct to choose Box 2 ?

[Richard W]

However, upon obtaining citizenship, one is required to return the PR card within a week. I'm not sure that was the case in 2011 but most likely yes. I am not sure if the Home Office sends any other documents with a reference number, other the the PR card itself which I could greatly simplify my application.

I don't believe that is the case even now. A requirement to return a BRP on naturalisation was introduced fairly recently, and I wonder if you are confused with that.

Box 2 = I've lived in the UK for a continuous period of five years as an EEA national qualified person, the family member ... of a qualified person, or a combination of these.
Box 4 = I'm the family member ... of an EEA national who ceased activity.
Box 6 = I've retained my right of residence after my EEA national family member died or left the UK, or their marraige ... ended in divorcement,..., and I've lived in the UK for a continuous period of five years (including time spent as a family member).

Am I correct to choose Box 2 ?

Yes.

[theuser2017]

I looks like I can't edit my first post as there is a mistake.
My father was unemployed from April 2010 to April 2011.

He received Permanent Residence in the beginning of October 2009. Hence, I am not required to submit any of his documents for the period until October 2009 as per Section 9.3. Is that correct ?

Did I start to exercise treaty rights only when I started the High school (October 2005), and NOT when I arrived (August 2005) in the UK ? Is that correct ?

I believe I need to provide evidence (P60s,Jobseeker allowance etc.) for the period from October 2009 to October(or August) 2010 for both of my parents to cover the period of April 2010 - October 2010 which might be questionable by case worker.

Also, do I need to provide any evidence that I (or my sponsor) stayed in the country AFTER the qualifying period of 5 years and for long ? I think this will answer all my doubts. Once again, thank you for your replies.

[Richard W]

I looks like I can't edit my first post as there is a mistake.
My father was unemployed from April 2010 to April 2011.

Hallelujah!

He received Permanent Residence in the beginning of October 2009. Hence, I am not required to submit any of his documents for the period until October 2009 as per Section 9.3. Is that correct ?

I don't know.

Did I start to exercise treaty rights only when I started the High school (October 2005), and NOT when I arrived (August 2005) in the UK ? Is that correct ?

Not really. It was your father who was exercising treaty rights. You were just benefiting from them.

I believe I need to provide evidence (P60s,Jobseeker allowance etc.) for the period from October 2009 to October(or August) 2010 for both of my parents to cover the period of April 2010 - October 2010 which might be questionable by case worker.

From August 2005 to May 2009, you were exercising your right of residence as the family member of a qualified person. From May 2009 to August 2010, you were exercising your right of residence as the family member of a person with permanent residence. In August 2010 you became a permanent resident.

You may choose to show that your father was also a qualified person from May to October 2009 just in case there is any doubt.

Basically, the evidence required is that needed for your father's permanent residence (for which his DCPR may suffice) plus the relevant residence of your father to August 2010 and of you at all times from your arrival in the UK.

Also, do I need to provide any evidence that I (or my sponsor) stayed in the country AFTER the qualifying period of 5 years and for long ?

You should demonstrate that you were never away for two whole years - so demonstrating presence in the UK for one day each calendar year thereafter would suffice. (This is different from ILR, for which it is residence rather than mere presence that matters.) What your sponsor did after you acquired permanent residence is irrelevant.

[theuser2017]

This might be a stupid question but I want to be 100% sure.

3.2 If you are (...) applying on the basis that you/they are (or have been) a family member during the qualifying period, tick the relevant box(es) below and complete the relevant section(s) as directed.

[BOX2] I am or have been the descendant (child or grandchild) aged under 21 of the sponsor, or of the sponsor's spouse or civil partner.

[BOX3] I am or have been the dependent child or grandchild aged 21 or over, parent, or grandparent of the sponsor( ...)

Does it relate to the qualifying period ?

Currently, I am 24 and I'm working full time, as previously stated. I have been financially dependant until January 2017 on my father.

[theuser2017]

Also, do I need to provide any evidence that I (or my sponsor) stayed in the country AFTER the qualifying period of 5 years and for long ?

You should demonstrate that you were never away for two whole years - so demonstrating presence in the UK for one day each calendar year thereafter would suffice. (This is different from ILR, for which it is residence rather than mere presence that matters.) What your sponsor did after you acquired permanent residence is irrelevant.

Richard, I have created a diagram which should help to visualise my situation.
https://framapic.org/1V6V1xek7HNd/EMt9SXRu8BeV.jpg

1. I understand that there should be no problem proving that I have been benefiting from a family member exercising Treaty Rights for the period October 2005 - October 2010.
However, assuming that I obtain PR, I will need evidence of residency when applying for Naturalisation.
Question: Is 'residency' essentially the same as Exercising Treaty Rights when applying for naturalisation ?

Furthermore, in the AN Booklet, section European Economic Area nationals and Swiss national, the Home Office clearly states that you should:

When you apply for a permanent residence document the evidence that you supply for your EEA(PR) application must be for a 5 year period that ended at least a year before you want to apply for citizenship.
For example:
If you apply for Permanent Residence on 1 June 2017 and want to apply for citizenship once that application is decided, you should send evidence that shows you were exercising Treaty rights as a qualified person or family member from 1 June 2011 to 1 June 2016.

► Show Spoiler

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... e_2017.pdf

2. As my father has become a dual EEA and UK citizen, I can not rely on him as a EEA national therefore I cannot be a classed as direct family member over 21 who is depended for the relevant period (see my diagram).
Am I correct ?

As per case: Shirley McCarthy v Secretary of State for the Home Department - Case C-434/09 (31 May 2011)

http://www.duncanlewis.co.uk/immigratio ... 2011).html

Or, does it only relate to non-EEA national family members ?
I find this very confusing.

See page 22 of Free Movement Rights: directfamily members of European Economic Area (EEA) nationals

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... plications

[Richard W]

1. I understand that there should be no problem proving that I have been benefiting from a family member exercising Treaty Rights for the period October 2005 - October 2010.
However, assuming that I obtain PR, I will need evidence of residency when applying for Naturalisation.
Question: Is 'residency' essentially the same as Exercising Treaty Rights when applying for naturalisation ?

No. For naturalisation, residency refers to physical presence. (Obtaining settled status is a different matter.)

2. As my father has become a dual EEA and UK citizen, I can not rely on him as a EEA national therefore I cannot be a classed as direct family member over 21 who is depended for the relevant period (see my diagram).
Am I correct ?

We await the Towfik Lounes case with interest. His sponsorship is valid for periods before he naturalised. It looks as though you will be able to count him as a sponsor, as he was sponsoring you before you became British. Assume for now that he cannot sponsor you for periods after he became British.

[Richard W]

Does it relate to the qualifying period ?

Currently, I am 24 and I'm working full time, as previously stated. I have been financially dependant until January 2017 on my father.

My understanding is that you are meant to supply all the relevant information, and the caseworker decides which claimed periods of sponsorship are valid and can be combined to give you a 5-year period.