Tier 2 Dependent Extension and Maintenance Funds

[darklym]

I have been a Tier 2 Dependent for 4.5 years. My wife is the Main Tier 2 migrant with "A"-rated sponsor, and is applying for LTR in August after 5 years as Tier 2. Our daughter was born in the UK, and will be applying with MN1 simultaneously. Since I am 6-months short of the requirements for LTR, I am figuring I will need to extend my Tier 2 Dependent visa and then apply for LTR later on.

I had originally assumed my maintenance requirement would be covered by my wife's "A"-rated sponsor, however I just discovered on this board that this does not matter once she has LTR, and I will once again have to bring in bank statements to confirm adequate maintenance fees. Therein lies my problem.

I assume I will have to apply for my Tier 2 Dependent extension immediately following my wife's application for LTR. However, our bank accounts have fluctuated throughout the past months, and though I've now placed £630 in my account to remain untouched, I will only fulfil three full months of minimum balance by 27 October 2018. This is after my current visa expires.

Main visa holder
Tier 2 visa start: 24 Aug 2013
Tier 2 visa expiry: 06 Oct 2018
Eligible to apply for LTR: 27 July 2018
Applying for LTR (premium service): 31 Aug 2018

Dependent visa holder:
Tier 2 Dependent visa start: 13 Feb 2014
Tier 2 Dependent visa expiry: 06 Oct 2018
Eligible to apply for LTR: 16 Jan 2019

Can I apply a few weeks in advance of my expiry, so I am not overstaying? Or would I need to apply and then leave the country until the visa is processed? Or should I apply for the extension from outside the UK? What else can I do?

I had also hoped to apply at a PSC since I have business travel in December. But I would only be able to apply after my visa expires two weeks before.

I have spent days going through the boards here and can't seem to find an answer to my dilemma. Any assistance would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you
David

[CR001]

You must apply before your visa expires. You can stay in the country while it is being processed.

If you do not meet the maintenance funds requirement, your application will likely be refused.

Any funds in overseas bank accounts perhaps???

[darklym]

Thank you for your reply.

Unfortunately I would not have minimum £630 throughout the past few months in foreign bank accounts. We do own a home here in the UK, but that doesn't seem to count.

[darklym]

In this case I would be short two weeks of maintenance when I apply. Is there no recourse available to me short of losing my visa status and abandoning my family in the UK?

Thanks again for all your assistance.

[darklym]

I have looked through all my bank accounts, foreign and domestic. Unfortunately, the balance dipped below the £630 threshold for one single day this year (on 25 July 2018). Therefore I would only now have the 90 day maintenance requirement complete by 23 Oct 2018, only two weeks after my Tier 2 Dependent visa expires.

1. Is my only recourse now to submit an FLR(M), therefore resetting the clock to zero? In other words, have I just forfeited my chance at ILR for five more years due to this two week maintenance anomaly?

2. Can I apply for my Tier 2 visa extension by post on the date that my current visa expires, therefore allowing me to remain in the UK legally while the extension is being processed, with a note detailing that the maintenance requirement will be met several days later?

3. Can my spouse's bank account (or both hers and mine together) be used to prove maintenance funds, since she is considered my "Main" sponsor since I am a Tier 2 Dependent?

4. Is there anything else I might try without having to opt for FLR(M)?

Any insight you have would be sincerely appreciated. Thank you.

[darklym]

Ok now I'm really confused...

I just got off the phone with the UKVI help line. They said in no uncertain terms that a Tier 2 extension does NOT require proof of maintenance, since it is clear the applicant has been living in the UK for 5 years and is either supporting himself or being supported. They also said all I would need to include is proof of my or the main applicant's pay slips.

This is the first time I'd heard of this. And I'll probably call them again to ask the same question of another service agent for a second opinion.

[CR001]

They are wrong. There have been at least 3 refusals in the past few months for PBS dependents applying without sufficient maintenance funds after the main PBS visa holder got ILR.

Your choice, apply and let us know the outcome.

Remember that the call centre is outsourced to a third party, with poorly trained staff. They frequently give out incorrect information and take no responsibility for it. That being said, how and what is asked of them will also depend on the answers you get and you would likely get different answers in 3 different calls asking the same questions.

There is no 'maintenance funds' requirement for a PBS Dependent applying for ILR on their own (when payslips are all that is needed), but there most certainly is a maintenance fund requirement for a PBS Dependent extension.

[darklym]

Thank you for the response, very much appreciated. I had a feeling that was the case, as I tend to trust your experience far more than the call centre's staff.

Does this mean I lose my qualifying years for ILR? Is my ony recourse to go the FLR(M) route??

[darklym]

I just called the UKVI Helpline again. They said I can use the COS from the last Tier 2 extension instead of proof of maintenance, just to change the expiry to three years from the date of my application. That the COS switches from the main applicant to the dependent when the main applicant gets ILR.

It still makes little sense.

[CR001]

No the CoS does not 'switch' to the PBS Dependent if the main applicant gets ILR.

A PBS Dependent is dependent on the spouse and not the tier 2 general sponsor.

[darklym]

Just a brief followup: I spoke to yet another call service agent at UKVI and they told me I should just apply for Tier 2 Dependent Extension alone, and use the original COS (from the Tier 2), which is supposed to handle the maintenance for dependents (me). Just to make sure I bring the Main visa holder's pay slips for 6 months previous.

I am still doubtful, based on your guidance. Could I not also bring a letter from the Main visa holder's "A"-rated sponsor which states they will cover me, in lieu of 90 days bank balance?

I still don't see any alternative short of opting for FLR(M), if I don't have 90 days maintenance in account by the date of renewal.

Can you see any other option available to me?

[darklym]

Can I submit a Maintenance letter from my wife's "A"-rated employer that will attest to support me as a dependent in my Tier 2 Dependent Extension application, in lieu of 90 days maintenance in my account?

[darklym]

I've been searching high and low all over the internet for a solution to this. It seems no one knows the answer. Not even UKVI. I start to understand what Gilliam was on about when he made the film "Brazil". The bureaucracy is such that it is feeding on itself, and is so complex and so gargantuan that no one knows how it works any longer, or whether this pile of documents or that one will get the applicant through the door, thousands upon thousands of pounds spent and the results are still arbitrary, unpredictable. What utter madness.

[darklym]

Just as a humorous aside, I just decided to call UKVI call centre again (for what purpose, I don't know) and they told me that if the primary Tier 2 holder applies for ILR, I will lose my Dependent status and need to leave the country and apply for another visa to enter.

Clearly they haven't a clue what they're talking about over there.

[CR001]

Just as a humorous aside, I just decided to call UKVI call centre again (for what purpose, I don't know) and they told me that if the primary Tier 2 holder applies for ILR, I will lose my Dependent status and need to leave the country and apply for another visa to enter.

Clearly they haven't a clue what they're talking about over there.

It is a third party outsourced agent!!

If you do not meet the maintenance funds requirements for 90 days, your visa will be refused if you apply to extend the PBS dependent visa (a few recent cases of this on the forum). The 'old' tier 2 sponsor cannot certify maintenance for you if the main Tier 2 G applicant has ILR, as you have already discovered.

I cannot see any other route except FLR(M).

[darklym]

Just thinking here... Based on my calculations, I would have 90 days of maintenance by 9 October. My visa expires on 6 October. What if I overstayed for 3 days (using the 14 day rule) with an explanation?

[CR001]

You would still have no Section 3C protection and will still be an overstayer and could still risk refusal for an out of time application.

[cyclina1]

You would still have no Section 3C protection and will still be an overstayer and could still risk refusal for an out of time application.

Can he apply for something irrelevant and varies back to Tier 2 PBS dependent? To cover those few days short?

[darklym]

Thank you Cyclina. After reading dozens of such cases on these boards I was considering varying (maybe FLR(M) to Tier 2 extension), but I would still not be able to prove 90 days maintenance before the date of the application. Unless I sent in an FLR(M) and then by the time I varied to Tier 2 I would have the full 90 days. Is this what you meant?

Meanwhile, some updates:

1. I received emailed guidance from UKVI stating that, quote, "For maintenance requirements, 6 months of bank statements can be used." Even if this is wrong, if I am refused I can make the case on appeal that I was following this guidance, and it could buy me some time under 3C. I think I should record the conversations I have with them. Had I done so over the past couple of weeks I could probably have grounds for appeal.

2. I added up my bank balances in the UK and in two accounts I hold abroad. At my visa expiry date I will have 87 days above £630. (There are four days when this amount dipped below £630, but I can include a statement from my wife's account specifically for those dates, and added together they are above £630). This should be acceptable, right?

So my idea is to apply on the last day possible (my visa expiry date) at a Premium service centre. I will still have to explain the three days I am missing out of the 90. I am hoping that if include six months of bank statements, the written guidance from UKVI (wrong as it is), added to the fact that I have a mortgage and property in the UK, that my daughter is a UK citizen, that my wife is settled, should allow them to use discretion before refusing my visa extension outright for this three-day technicality. (And In the worst case, I will still have 14 days to appeal, and then reapply, with 3C protection so I am not overstaying).

What do you think? Does this seem to make sense? Your input would be greatly appreciated, as usual.

[CR001]

Which guidance notes, post the link?

PBS route applications and dependents have no appeal rights anymore. You will only have the option of Administrative review, which is for when you believe HO made an error and AR is based on the documents you submitted at the time of application and you cannot submit additional evidence.

[darklym]

They did not send guidance notes, only a written reply to my query.

My thoughts are it makes no sense to lose my 5-year status toward ILR (I am two months shy) for missing 3 days of maintenance, after having lived here with my family for 5 years and that any semi-reasonable visa officer will see this. The alternative is borderline insanity.

[CR001]

Guidance notes link below. It does not say anything about 6 months bank statements.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.u ... 7-2018.pdf

The visa officers follow the immigration rules.

See Immigration Rules Part 8 - Family members of relevant points-based system migrants - 319C

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration ... ly-members

And see Immigration Rules : Appendix E - maintenance (funds) for the family of Relevant Points Based System Migrants

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration ... m-migrants

[darklym]

Thank you Char, I really appreciate all your insight.

However, when I've read through all the guidance I have still not found any mention of extension. Appendix E and 319C speak of joining a PBS Migrant, not already residing in the UK and extending.

The way it was explained to me by the UKVI people (in at least a half-dozen phone conversations) was that extending a Tier 2 Dependent application with a Primary Migrant who now has received ILR is considered by the Immigration rules as if the Tier 2 primary Migrant still has Tier 2 and is extending as well. (In other words, the Dependent is still considered the continuing Dependent of a Tier 2 Migrant).

Therefore since the Primary Migrant would have no maintenance requirement at this stage (only proof of minimum income), the Dependent would not have the maintenance requirement either.

This is where it remains ambiguous.

[darklym]

And of course there's item 83. in the PBS (Dependent) Policy Guidance which states:

83. If you apply separately from the main applicant you will need to have the necessary funds to meet the maintenance requirement or have a written undertaking from an A-rated Sponsor, unless the main applicant already had leave in a Tier 2 category and when applying for their most recent period of Tier 2 leave was not required to show evidence of satisfying maintenance requirements.

In the above, I was instructed that as far as the dependent is concerned, the main applicant is still considered as if they still have PBS Tier 2 even if they now have have ILR.

[CR001]

However, when I've read through all the guidance I have still not found any mention of extension. Appendix E and 319C speak of joining a PBS Migrant, not already residing in the UK and extending.

The call centre is a outsourced third party, who are poorly trained, give frequent incorrect advice and take no responsibility for it.
Not sure why you believe the rules DO NOT refer specifically to an 'extension' when it clearly states on "319C. Requirements for entry clearance or leave to remain', what do you believe 'leave to remain' refers to??

The way it was explained to me by the UKVI people (in at least a half-dozen phone conversations) was that extending a Tier 2 Dependent application with a Primary Migrant who now has received ILR is considered by the Immigration rules as if the Tier 2 primary Migrant still has Tier 2 and is extending as well. (In other words, the Dependent is still considered the continuing Dependent of a Tier 2 Migrant).

Yes, no one is disputing that as the rules clearly allow this scenario and you as the PBS Dependent are still required to meet ALL the requirements for an extension, including maintenance funds for 90 days. Your spouse is not considered a tier 2 general visa holder anymore if they hold ILR and are now free from immigration restrictions.

Therefore since the Primary Migrant would have no maintenance requirement at this stage (only proof of minimum income), the Dependent would not have the maintenance requirement either.

This is where it remains ambiguous.

You are mistaken. You need to provide evidence of 90 days bank statements to prove maintenance, there is no way around this. The primary migrant is irrelevant in this sense as they primary migrant will hold or does hold ILR, so free form any immigration rules around PBS route.

319C. Requirements for entry clearance or leave to remain
To qualify for entry clearance or leave to remain as the Partner of a Relevant Points Based System Migrant, an applicant must meet the requirements listed below. If the applicant meets these requirements, entry clearance or leave to remain will be granted. If the applicant does not meet these requirements, the application will be refused.

Requirements:
-------
(g) Unless the Relevant Points Based System Migrant is a Tier 1 (Investor) Migrant or a Tier 1 (Exceptional Talent) Migrant, there must be a sufficient level of funds available to the applicant, as set out in Appendix E.

Appendix C for additional information on maintenance funds.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/immigration ... ance-funds

And of course there's item 83. in the PBS (Dependent) Policy Guidance which states:

83. If you apply separately from the main applicant you will need to have the necessary funds to meet the maintenance requirement or have a written undertaking from an A-rated Sponsor, unless the main applicant already had leave in a Tier 2 category and when applying for their most recent period of Tier 2 leave was not required to show evidence of satisfying maintenance requirements.

In the above, I was instructed that as far as the dependent is concerned, the main applicant is still considered as if they still have PBS Tier 2 even if they now have have ILR.

Yes, and point 100 states the below. Your partner is no longer considered a Tier 2 General migrant if holding ILR. Free to leave his employer as no longer sponsored or bound by the sponsor.

Evidence of certifying maintenance for family members of Tier 2 Migrants
100. If you are making your application at the same time as the Tier 2 Migrant, then A-rated sponsors
are able to certify your maintenance on the Tier 2 Migrant’s Certificate of Sponsorship or by
providing a letter. Your maintenance cannot be certified if your main applicant has indefinite leave
to remain.