THIS IS AN EMERGENCY, I NEED HELP AND ADVISE GOING TO THE UK

[charles4u]

I was called after 4 weeks that I applied for an EEA going to visit my wife in the UK but I was refused.

I want to know if I can still go with just my RESIDENCE CARD FOR FAMILY MEMBER and passport with the stamp on my passport that I was not given the visa, Wont there be a problem boarding from the airline or even at the airport in London seeing my passport that I wasnt given the visa and I just flew to the UK.

Can I still go or what should I do? tell my wife to cancel her work and come back home? ...

PLS ADVISE ME AND I NEED A FAST RESPONSE AS I WANT TO GO BY NEXT WEEK.

[Mr Rusty]

Give us a bit more info:-

1. Your nationality
2. Your wife's nationality
3. Do you have an EEA residence card? For which country? When was it granted?
4. What is your wife doing in the UK? How long has she been here?
5. What were the reasons you were refused an EEA family permit? (quote the exact words if you can).

You will probably be refused boarding by any airline or ferry if you don't have a visa for the UK.
Also, the 2006 Regulations say that if you seek admission as an EEA Family Member at a UK port or airport the Immigration Officer cannot turn you away without giving you the opportunity to prove that you are so entitled - BUT - if you've already taken that opportunity by applying abroad and have been refused, I suspect the IO would also feel justified in refusing you without further enquiry.

I doubt you'll be able to travel next week.

[Richard66]

You were refused? You were REFUSED???? What reasons did they give you, Charles? You need to compalin about this to the European Commission. As the husband of a Romanian citizen exercising her treaty rights in the UK they have no legal basis to refuse you.

You need to forward a copy of your refusal to the Commission.

Another thing, Charles, try not to open a new topic all the time and do not post the same text in two or three discussions: it causes confusion and it might raise a few eyebrows at moderator level.

[charles4u]

Ok Richard I will take note of that.

First I didnt even ask for the refusal letter cus I was too angry and I dont even wanna hear there stupid reason as it makes no sense after-all they cant change there mind or the decision that as being made.

Yes I have a Residence card for family members here in Romania and am from Nigeria, My wife is a romanian and she is making a nursing course and also working in the UK and she her as residence there (yellow card for Romanians).

After all the complains I made to the EU, its already taking them yrs to solve. I guess by the time they finish with it we would have had our second child lool . So I have bought the ticket today and flying on friday with WIZZAIR Romania- London Luton airport, As u said Richard am not stepping back and I will try and see what happens but also I will need advise and help from you guys and Prawo didnt anwser me concerning coming to the airport if an assistance is needed..

I need all ur surpports and advise guys....

[John]

So I have bought the ticket today and flying on friday with WIZZAIR Romania- London Luton airport

Good luck! That is, hopefully the airline will let you board the plane .... but probably a good chance that they will not.

If you do menage to get on the plane, when you get to the Immigration Officer at Luton airport .... what is your course of action? What are you going to say or do?

I didnt even ask for the refusal letter cus I was too angry and I dont even wanna hear there stupid reason as it makes no sense after-all they cant change there mind or the decision that as being made.

That was not very sensible, was it! After all you might have been missing just one piece of evidence, and armed with that the EEA Family Permit might be granted. But now, well you don't have a clue why they refused you!

[Wanderer]

Hello all, I am married to a Romanian and she works in the UK and I wanted to join her there but I was refused the visa saying we met too soon to get married according to the consular officer and just bringing out things just for her reason to refuse like the phone call bills of the calls we made b4 meeting..

So you DID get the refusal letter?

[charles4u]

OK I will ask for it on Monday but surely same whole nonsense reasons whats new, they always will find something to say and am not surprise or wont be surprise at anything they say.

Well I intend trying and hopefully the airline carrys me as I am not sure myself, Getting to Luton well I have millions of words to say and proves but thats if they will be ready to listen and consider my points. My wife will be there also and if any deportation then maybe they should bring us back together...

What else can I do, appeal takes 4-5 months to get an anwser and am sure I cant wait that long any longer, better to do the least or my wife should come back home but we consider this our last option.

[Frontier Mole]

Well I hope you don't pack much because you will not need a lot as you will be going straight home!

What kind of idiot are you coming to the UK without entry clearance and a recent refusal to boot! You are going to make things much worse and that will lead to further delays. You will show out like a distress beacon when your passport is scanned never mind the fact that you do not have a visa in a Nigerian passport, what do you hope to achieve?

[freon21]

What kind of idiot are you coming to the UK without entry clearance and a recent refusal to boot! You are going to make things much worse and that will lead to further delays.

WHY are you so rude?
And as a matter of fact I think that nothing stops Charles to try to get in the uk and I hope he will succeed without an EEA family permit wich is a pure creation of the uk .see link for case law.http://www.ait.gov.uk/Public/Upload/j20 ... igeria.docEuropean directives should be respected even by the uk.family members of EEA citizens holders of eea residence cards do not need entry clearence or any kind of visas.
It is about time that the uk accept all the consequences of signing to them or pull out of the EU once for all but would the uk can really afford it????
Good luck Charles

[paulp]

European directives should be respected even by the uk.family members of EEA citizens holders of eea residence cards do not need entry clearence or any kind of visas.
It is about time that the uk accept all the consequences of signing to them or pull out of the EU once for all but would the uk can really afford it????
Good luck Charles

As the UK currently doesn't follow the directive, what's going to happen to charles4u at the airport?

[charles4u]

Thank you very much FREON21 for ur words and advise, I cant blame him as thats his just his mentality and the way some people r. I just dont have a better option but if I am sent back atleast am not gonna "die while trying" its just same things that happens in life..

Thx all for ur words and I would like to know which company does WIZZAIR uses in checking for visa reqiurments e.g delta or IATA ?...Guess what guys I just also found out from Delta and IATA that no visa needed for family members going to IRELAND, So I guess its just UK left.

[John]

Well I intend trying and hopefully the airline carrys me as I am not sure myself

Put yourself in the position of the airline. For every person they bring into the UK who needs Entry Clearance in advance, and who has not got that Entry Clearance, the airline can be fined £2000 ..... per such passenger. They are also liable to return the person to the place from where they came.

Still think you might get on the plane! Very doubtful! Suspect that you have just throw away the fare that you have paid.

[UKBAbble]

I'm afraid charles4u has little chance of getting on the flight and probably less chance of avoiding refusal of entry and removal.

[charles4u]

Whatever the case maybe I accept and as u said I will have it in mind that I have thrown away 50pounds and I guess it not too much.

Whatever the chances are also in getting in I know it might be hard but the fact remains that I wasnt sitting back and expecting miracle to happen as everything is all about trying, The airline is just what am concern about ...as for Luton london am very very very relaxed as am sure the least will happen ( getting in ). We shall all know and u all should come here on saturday to check my report if I was carried or not by the airline and what happened in Luton (entered or deported).

[Frontier Mole]

Luton is looking foward to your arrival, if you make it past the airline that is.
Wish you luck

[John]

charles4u, don't get me wrong, I wish you well, but the reality is that you have little chance of getting on the plane.

However, in case you do make it to Luton, you might like to have a read of this UKBA document, which is part of the instructions given to UKBA border staff. Indeed you might like to print it out and take a copy to the airport!

Read 5.5 in particular, and note :-

5.5.1 Admission of family members who are unable to produce a valid passport, family permit or residence card

Immigration officers will need to assess whether or not a person qualifies for admission under the EEA Regulations in the above situations.

So charles4u, the blunt question is .... what proof will you be taking with you on your journey to show that your wife is exercising EU Treaty Rights in the UK? Notice in particular, at 5.5.2 :-

produces satisfactory evidence on arrival

[Mr Rusty]

charles4u, don't get me wrong, I wish you well, but the reality is that you have little chance of getting on the plane.

However, in case you do make it to Luton, you might like to have a read of this UKBA document, which is part of the instructions given to UKBA border staff. Indeed you might like to print it out and take a copy to the airport!

Read 5.5 in particular, and note :-

5.5.1 Admission of family members who are unable to produce a valid passport, family permit or residence card


Immigration officers will need to assess whether or not a person qualifies for admission under the EEA Regulations in the above situations.

So charles4u, the blunt question is .... what proof will you be taking with you on your journey to show that your wife is exercising EU Treaty Rights in the UK? Notice in particular, at 5.5.2 :-

produces satisfactory evidence on arrival

Yes, but the OP's problem is that he's already applied abroad and been refused, so unless he comes up with something that wasn't available to the ECO, they might well decide that he must make his case from abroad.

[charles4u]

I understand JONH and its ok whatever anybody says after-all I have to admit the fact that its 30% possible and 70% not possible.

I just wanna try, So for the prove from my wife... yes she has her Yellow card which is the residence document for romanians to work and stay in UK, I have her ID, a link from the UK gov site saying reasons why an officer will refuse an entry(having a refusal wasnt there) so being the fact that I have an EU residence its should be considerable, I will also have the EU directive also and some other personal papers. So I will be having a printed copies of all this papers and proves and ofcourse expecting the worst.

I know the refusal might be the delay or problem in Luton but my main concern is the airline which I dont know for sure if they will understand so good.

[freon21]

Charles read carefuly this
Border Force Operations Manual
Categories of Passenger EEA Nationals & their Dependents
Border Force Operations Manual 1
EEA Nationals & their family members (General Guidance)
Contents
5.5 Procedures when no EEA family permit or residence card is held
5.5.1 Admission of family members who are unable to produce a
valid passport, family permit or residence card

Border Force Operations Manual
Categories of Passenger EEA Nationals & their Dependents
Border Force Operations Manual 6
5.1 Residence card holders
Residence cards also do not confer leave and are not subject to any domestic
legislation governing returning residents. It is appropriate for immigration officers’ to
establish on what ground the card was issued, these being:
• He is the family member of an EEA national who is a qualified person.
Examination should be to establish that the passenger is the rightful holder of
the document and that he is still the family member of the EEA national who is
a qualified person.
• Because he is a person who has retained the right of residence (see paragraph
5.7.2 below). In this case there is no requirement for the EEA national to be in
the UK.
A residence card can be revoked if the holder of the card is no longer the family
member of a qualified person or an EEA national with a right of permanent residence
and has not retained the right of residence or acquired permanent residence.
If the family member is refused on the grounds of public policy, health or security the
residence card cannot be revoked by an immigration officer unless the family
member is in addition no longer the family member of a qualified person or an EEA
national with a right of permanent residence and has not retained the right of
residence or acquired permanent residence.
Such persons are entitled to an in country right of appeal. Ports should not
physically cancel the card until all the appeal rights have been exhausted or the
passenger signs a disclaimer.
5.2 Endorsing the passports of residence card holders - Regulation 11(3)
An immigration officer may not place a stamp in the passport of a person who holds
a residence card when he is admitted to the UK. Regulation 11(3) expressly
prohibits an immigration officer from endorsing the passport of a person who holds a
valid residence card or permanent residence card.
5.3 Permanent residence card holders
An EEA national and/or family member acquires a permanent right of residence if
they have been resident in the UK in accordance with the EEA Regulations for five
years; this applies to all EEA nationals including the accession states. Once
permanent residence has been acquired there is no requirement for the EEA national
to be in the UK in order for the family member to be admitted and to reside.
Examination should be to establish that the passenger is the rightful holder of the
document and that he has not been absent from the UK for more than 2 years.
If a person has been absent for more than 2 years and does not hold an EEA family
permit, refusal should not be automatic. His permanent residence card should be
revoked but re-admissibility under the EEA Regulations should be assessed and if he
Back to Top
Border Force Operations Manual
Categories of Passenger EEA Nationals & their Dependents
Border Force Operations Manual 7
still qualifies for admission as a family member he should be admitted for 6 months
on a Code 1A.and advised to apply for a residence card from European Casework.
5.4 No evidence that the EEA national is in the UK
When a person’s admission is based on the EEA national being in the UK the onus is
on the passenger to provide this evidence. It’s reasonable to expect the family
member to provide evidence on the day of arrival. If not, one further interview
represents adequate opportunity. When considering the location of the EEA national
ports must take account of the fact that an EEA national can be absent for up to 6
months per year without affecting the family members right of residence. Paragraph
6.5, below, explains.
I5.5 Procedures when no EEA family permit or residence card is held
5.5.1 Admission of family members who are unable to produce a valid
passport, family permit or residence card
mmigration officers will need to assess whether or not a person qualifies for
admission under the EEA Regulations in the above situations. Ports should take
particular note of the guidance on those who seek admission under the extended
family member provisions as dependents relatives and as family members of an EEA
national with whom they have a “durable relationshipâ€

[brownbonno]

I understand JONH and its ok whatever anybody says after-all I have to admit the fact that its 30% possible and 70% not possible.

I just wanna try, So for the prove from my wife... yes she has her Yellow card which is the residence document for romanians to work and stay in UK, I have her ID, a link from the UK gov site saying reasons why an officer will refuse an entry(having a refusal wasnt there) so being the fact that I have an EU residence its should be considerable, I will also have the EU directive also and some other personal papers. So I will be having a printed copies of all this papers and proves and ofcourse expecting the worst.

I know the refusal might be the delay or problem in Luton but my main concern is the airline which I dont know for sure if they will understand so good.

You need the following documents at point of admission-
-Marriage certificate(Proof of relationship)
-Proof that your wife is in the UK and exercising her treaty rights
-Copy(ies) of her identity
-your passport(Proof of identification)
-Possibly your wife`s telephone number

[charles4u]

I understand JONH and its ok whatever anybody says after-all I have to admit the fact that its 30% possible and 70% not possible.

I just wanna try, So for the prove from my wife... yes she has her Yellow card which is the residence document for romanians to work and stay in UK, I have her ID, a link from the UK gov site saying reasons why an officer will refuse an entry(having a refusal wasnt there) so being the fact that I have an EU residence its should be considerable, I will also have the EU directive also and some other personal papers. So I will be having a printed copies of all this papers and proves and ofcourse expecting the worst.

I know the refusal might be the delay or problem in Luton but my main concern is the airline which I dont know for sure if they will understand so good.

You need the following documents at point of admission-
-Marriage certificate(Proof of relationship)
-Proof that your wife is in the UK and exercising her treaty rights
-Copy(ies) of her identity
-your passport(Proof of identification)
-Possibly your wife`s telephone number

I have all this with the ones I mentionshed earlier and my wife will even be at the airport, I have her number to just call her to come meet me at the immigration clearance immidiately I arrive at Luton thats if the airline dont f**k me up. Thx so much.

[charles4u]

Thank u all so much, even if it doesnt work out atleast I tried and u guys surpported me with ur best ideas, I read ur post FREON21 and I'll take note of it with the laws but I hope they dont use the passport refusal against me. I have all the rest of the documents most in original and my wife will be coming with some originals also to the airport.

I would like to know if anyone as experience with WIZZAIR or know the details on which company site they use for visa information e.g Delta or IATA.
I really wish to know so as to know little of what to expect, well I guess no one would have any experience from here Timisoara Romania.

[brownbonno]

I hope they dont use the passport refusal against me. .

Which passport are you refering to here ?

[John]

the fact that its 30% possible and 70% not possible

That is far too optimistic! Personally I would put your chances are say 1% possible and 99% not possible.

Above you are getting very good advice about what documents you should present at Luton Airport, should you make it that far.

[charles4u]

the fact that its 30% possible and 70% not possible

That is far too optimistic! Personally I would put your chances are say 1% possible and 99% not possible.

Above you are getting very good advice about what documents you should present at Luton Airport, should you make it that far.

Thank u and I will have that in mind as I said earlier. So Brownbonno I was refering to my main nigerian passport that I used in applying for the EEA, its was dated that I made an application and normally the visa should be placed on it but unfortunately not.