Passport refused - uncancelled passport in maiden name

ChetanOjha wrote:Masked Passport number.

Thankyou Chetan, Thanks for masking my details

Thanks to everyone sharing their experiences and advice.

My wife is about to apply for naturalisation. Her Canadian passport was in her maiden name but she wants her British passport in her married name (which is the name she uses everywhere except on her BRP).
So she's applied for a replacement Canadian passport in her married name. Not an easy task, but easier than some it seems

We understand the BRP has requirements for updating within 3 months of a change, but hoping to get the naturalisation application going first (to get in before the fee increase, and maybe even get the whole thing done with before the BRP needs updating -- seeing several spouses getting < 2 months naturalisation when using NCS at the moment).

Once we have the new passport, can she apply for naturalisation while her BRP is still in her maiden name?

nathan2 wrote:Thanks to everyone sharing their experiences and advice.

My wife is about to apply for naturalisation. Her Canadian passport was in her maiden name but she wants her British passport in her married name (which is the name she uses everywhere except on her BRP).
So she's applied for a replacement Canadian passport in her married name. Not an easy task, but easier than some it seems

We understand the BRP has requirements for updating within 3 months of a change, but hoping to get the naturalisation application going first (to get in before the fee increase, and maybe even get the whole thing done with before the BRP needs updating -- seeing several spouses getting < 2 months naturalisation when using NCS at the moment).

Once we have the new passport, can she apply for naturalisation while her BRP is still in her maiden name?

My understanding is you are on right track with passport upgrade as that is HMPO's primary concern.

Name difference with BRP is readily explainable with marriage certificate.

So, if you don't exceed the 3 month limit, no need to update BRP. Once naturalissd it will be null & void anyway.

Good luck.

noajthan wrote:My understanding is you are on right track with passport upgrade as that is HMPO's primary concern.

Name difference with BRP is readily explainable with marriage certificate.

So, if you don't exceed the 3 month limit, no need to update BRP. Once naturalissd it will be null & void anyway.

Good luck.

Thank you very much!

Case is with MP hopefully. Given the prints from this forum and also the 4th page of guidance if you apply from outside UK that that HMPO will mention old name on observation.
Different rules if you are outside UK you can get passport with old name on observation but if you are inside UK you won't get passport at all. Hopefully
It will get sorted.

shashank2361 wrote:Case is with MP hopefully. Given the prints from this forum and also the 4th page of guidance if you apply from outside UK that that HMPO will mention old name on observation.
Different rules if you are outside UK you can get passport with old name on observation but if you are inside UK you won't get passport at all. Hopefully
It will get sorted.

Some people did get their UK passports with observation on it from inside UK. I think it's depend from passport office, some of them are more generous.
Anyway, good luck with your application to MP. I hope yours MP is better than my.

So My MP acted like an MP no help, The next appointment with MP is on 26th feb, means after a month of 1st Appointments,

So I went to VFS london Paddington yesterday but before that I forwareded the Hci london email to them,
The reply I received is below, I received this 2 hrs later I submitted my application.


There at VFS I asked them do they need Name deed, They said that this is a common scenario British home office is frequently asking for surrender certificate and we are taking the application without having British passport. HCI london know this your case is not an exception.
They didn't asked for the undertaking either. So i paued the money , submitted the application without any British passport.
Got SMS today from VFS . now waiting..


Why they cant just mention the whole thing on the website.

email is below.

--------------

Info On Passport & Consular Services India In UK <Info.Ppt-Consularuk@vfshelpline.com>
To xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Feb 9 at 12:30 PM
Dear Shashank,

Thank you for your email.

All such applicants should be able to produce all documents required apart from a new British Passport, in place of the British Passport the applicants should be advised to write an undertaking (addressed to the High Commission of India or Consulate General of India in Birmingham or Edinburgh as the case may be) for their inability to provide a British Passport and also confirming that if the HCI or its respective consulates were to issue a Surrender Certificate, ‘Passport Applied for’ remark will be ‘acceptable’ under the foreign passport details section on the Surrender Certificate.

Kindly refer to the following link for detailed information on documents required: http://www.vfsglobal.com/India/UK/Surrender.html and click on the documents required tab.


Best Regards,
Avit Singh
Information Service Desk
VF Services (UK) Limited

This e-mail is only for the use of its intended recipient. Its contents are confidential and privileged. If you have received this email in error, please contact the sender and delete the e-mail and its contents from your computer. VFS does not guarantee that this e-mail has not been intercepted and amended or that it is virus free.

From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: 08 February, 2016 2:25 PM
To: Info On Passport & Consular Services India In UK
Subject: Fw: Request to Surrender Indian passport without obtaining British Passport.


Hi

I have a appointment tomorrow In London Paddington office. I am surrendering my Indian Passport but I still haven't received my British Passport yet. I have the naturalisation certificate.
I have received the conformation form HCI London to surrender the passport, Please check the email below.
So If there is anything else I need to bring please let me know.

Regards
Shashank
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Note As this is a public forum, I have removed all personal identifying details from your post so as to maintain your privacy & security.

Ref forum T&Cs (click)
- Board Moderator

Hello everyone,

I have the same problem! I'm so, so angry! It's all just beyond any common sense for me!
I am now waiting my documents back from Passport Office. They said they will hold my application for 6 months. I'm thinking to change my name to my maiden name on all documents I have and sent a request to Home Office to change a name on my certificate of naturalization.

Has anyone done the same? Will it help to solve the problem?

Mashec wrote:Hello everyone,

I have the same problem! I'm so, so angry! It's all just beyond any common sense for me!
I am now waiting my documents back from Passport Office. They said they will hold my application for 6 months. I'm thinking to change my name to my maiden name on all documents I have and sent a request to Home Office to change a name on my certificate of naturalization.

Has anyone done the same? Will it help to solve the problem?

Hi Mashec - Pls look at my last couple of posts on the thread below. It may help. Basically, you need to ensure the name on application for British passport matches name on foreign passport. If certificate of nat/reg has different name, it cannot be altered (no point asking Home Office). You just need to send along to HMPO a deed poll to say you have adopted your maiden name for all purposes.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 03092.html

JohnnyZee wrote:

Mashec wrote:Hello everyone,

I have the same problem! I'm so, so angry! It's all just beyond any common sense for me!
I am now waiting my documents back from Passport Office. They said they will hold my application for 6 months. I'm thinking to change my name to my maiden name on all documents I have and sent a request to Home Office to change a name on my certificate of naturalization.

Has anyone done the same? Will it help to solve the problem?

Hi Mashec - Pls look at my last couple of posts on the thread below. It may help. Basically, you need to ensure the name on application for British passport matches name on foreign passport. If certificate of nat/reg has different name, it cannot be altered (no point asking Home Office). You just need to send along to HMPO a deed poll to say you have adopted your maiden name for all purposes.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/britis ... 03092.html

JohnnyZee, so you want to say that I shouldn't send anything to Home Office? Even if I change my name on all the documents, HO still won't change it on certificate of naturalization?

From official guidance...

"4.1. A certificate of registration or naturalisation is issued on the basis of the information supplied by the applicant at the time of application and cannot be altered. Those who change their name after they have been naturalised or registered, and ask for their certificate to be altered to show the new name, should be advised that:

• it is not the normal practice of the Home Office to alter a certificate once it has been issued

Ref: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... LUME_2.pdf

noajthan wrote:From official guidance...

"4.1. A certificate of registration or naturalisation is issued on the basis of the information supplied by the applicant at the time of application and cannot be altered. Those who change their name after they have been naturalised or registered, and ask for their certificate to be altered to show the new name, should be advised that:

• it is not the normal practice of the Home Office to alter a certificate once it has been issued

Ref: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... LUME_2.pdf

I read this link but I still don't get it. I saw this document on the gov website: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... icates.pdf

"If the applicant objects to the use of the name as shown on the certificate, formal evidence of change of name must be requested. The examiner must ensure that all permutations of the original name, as shown on the certificate, have been checked against the system".

So, in a way I see the situation I need to prove HO that I don't use my husbands name anymore and I have adopted my maiden name for all purposes. in this case they will change my name on the certificate.

And I stay in Scotland, Scotland doesn't have deed poll: http://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/registrati ... n-scotland

I can write my own deed poll and sign it with witnesses if it is required.

Do you want to say that even if I change all my docs and I write the statement HO still won't change certificate? It's like there is no any way to change the name on the certificate? I have to deal only with Passport Office now???

Mashec wrote:...

Do you want to say that even if I change all my docs and I write the statement HO still won't change certificate? It's like there is no any way to change the name on the certificate? I have to deal only with Passport Office now???

Yes, it is not normal practice for HO to change the naturalisation certificate.

The HMPO policy is all about regulating names on passports - what they see as multiple identities.

If you have a foreign passport in a different name from the name you want for first British passport that is where your challenge lies.
You will not need to fix the naturalisation certificate (& you cannot).

You will have to fix any foreign uncancelled passports;
- or get them cancelled (that's what my wife did in the end);
or provide a convincing reason why you can't make such a change (eg if your country won't allow it).

noajthan wrote:

Mashec wrote:...

Do you want to say that even if I change all my docs and I write the statement HO still won't change certificate? It's like there is no any way to change the name on the certificate? I have to deal only with Passport Office now???

Yes, it is not normal practice for HO to change the naturalisation certificate.

The HMPO policy is all about regulating names on passports - what they see as multiple identities.

If you have a foreign passport in a different name from the name you want for first British passport that is where your challenge lies.
You will not need to fix the naturalisation certificate (& you cannot).

You will have to fix any foreign uncancelled passports;
- or get them cancelled (that's what my wife did in the end);
or provide a convincing reason why you can't make such a change (eg if your country won't allow it).

This is exactly where my challenge lies. My consulate refused to give me any letter saying that I can't change my name in my foreign passport and I'm not willing to cancel my foreign passport. In fact I do can change my name but its very complex process which requires me to go back to my home country and stay there for a long time. I will need to quite my job and I don't even know how I can enter UK on a way back because I don't have visa anymore. I cut my ILR 5 days later since I received my certificate of naturalisation. And the thing is my country has 2 types of passport: internal and external. So I need to go back to change name in my internal passport and then come back and go to a consulate in Edinburgh to change name in my external passport. So, even if I quite my job, go back, change name in internal passport, when I will be coming bk I will have external passport on my maiden name and certificate of naturalisation on my married name. it's all together doesn't make any sense. I explained all this to Passport office but they don't care.

This is guide to correction of certificate of naturalization: https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... icates.pdf

It says: "UKBA will add endorsements to certificates in cases where satisfactory evidence of a change to personal details has been supplied". This is exactly what i expect them to do.

"UKBA does not produce standardised endorsements, however some examples have been provided below:
Where a change of name has been officially accepted:
I HEREBY CERTIFY that this is a true extract of the Home Office record of
the Certificate of Naturalisation (or Registration) issued to *SURNAME*
FORENAMES (new names)"

I wonder if I do change my name and write a statutory declaration of changing my name will UKBA give me this endorsement which should be enough for Passport Office to solve my case??
That's the only way I see just now.

Mashec - what is your aim here?

1) are you trying to amend your certificate of naturalisation (near to impossible) OR
2) Are you trying to get a UK passport in your maiden name?

If only 2, why do you really care about amending certificate? Just make your own deed poll, use 2 witnesses and send to HMPO. Write a cover letter what you are trying to do. Also print out gov.UK website which says you need a deed poll when certificate has different name:

https://www.gov.uk/changing-passport-in ... -documents

I don't think Scotland rules are different unless you are looking to enroll your deed poll in gazette. Besides, I assume you are not born in Scotland so that probably wouldn't apply. So best to use your own deed poll.

This way, you don't need to do anything to your foreign passport! It stays the same. Happy days

JohnnyZee wrote:Mashec - what is your aim here?

1) are you trying to amend your certificate of naturalisation (near to impossible) OR
2) Are you trying to get a UK passport in your maiden name?

If only 2, why do you really care about amending certificate? Just make your own deed poll, use 2 witnesses and send to HMPO. Write a cover letter what you are trying to do. Also print out gov.UK website which says you need a deed poll when certificate has different name:

https://www.gov.uk/changing-passport-in ... -documents

I don't think Scotland rules are different unless you are looking to enroll your deed poll in gazette. Besides, I assume you are not born in Scotland so that probably wouldn't apply. So best to use your own deed poll.

This way, you don't need to do anything to your foreign passport! It stays the same. Happy days

OMG! If it is true than it is absolutely amazing! But I don't understand why passport office has never told me about it???? The guy from the hotline told me I need to change certificate of naturalization if I want British Passport on my maiden name and never mentioned deed poll Same women who called me asking to get letter from the embassy! That's why I was looking for how to amend certificate.....

and who can be my witnesses? Anyone? Is there any requirements?

JohnnyZee wrote:Mashec - what is your aim here?

1) are you trying to amend your certificate of naturalisation (near to impossible) OR
2) Are you trying to get a UK passport in your maiden name?

If only 2, why do you really care about amending certificate? Just make your own deed poll, use 2 witnesses and send to HMPO. Write a cover letter what you are trying to do. Also print out gov.UK website which says you need a deed poll when certificate has different name:

https://www.gov.uk/changing-passport-in ... -documents

I don't think Scotland rules are different unless you are looking to enroll your deed poll in gazette. Besides, I assume you are not born in Scotland so that probably wouldn't apply. So best to use your own deed poll.

This way, you don't need to do anything to your foreign passport! It stays the same. Happy days

It won't work, as name in passport and certificate will be different and HMPO won't accept this. I went through all possible solutions and only one way to make HMPO happy is to change name in your original passport. HO will not amended nat.certificate.
Mashes are you Russian? If yes, I could advise you how to change everything through Embassy, although this may be too long and not acceptable for you.
P.S. It was foolish to cut your ILR

Marii wrote:

JohnnyZee wrote:Mashec - what is your aim here?

1) are you trying to amend your certificate of naturalisation (near to impossible) OR
2) Are you trying to get a UK passport in your maiden name?

If only 2, why do you really care about amending certificate? Just make your own deed poll, use 2 witnesses and send to HMPO. Write a cover letter what you are trying to do. Also print out gov.UK website which says you need a deed poll when certificate has different name:

https://www.gov.uk/changing-passport-in ... -documents

I don't think Scotland rules are different unless you are looking to enroll your deed poll in gazette. Besides, I assume you are not born in Scotland so that probably wouldn't apply. So best to use your own deed poll.

This way, you don't need to do anything to your foreign passport! It stays the same. Happy days

It won't work, as name in passport and certificate will be different and HMPO won't accept this. I went through all possible solutions and only one way to make HMPO happy is to change name in your original passport. HO will not amended nat.certificate.
Mashes are you Russian? If yes, I could advise you how to change everything through Embassy, although this may be too long and not acceptable for you.
P.S. It was foolish to cut your ILR

Yes, Russian. I can't change my documents via embassy. If I could I wd have done it 3 years ago. The whole problem lies in the fact that I have to go to Russia to change my internal passport and then come bk and change external passport via embassy. Embassy refused to give me letter to prove it, they said Passport Office needs to make official request to them then they will give them information. I told it to Passport Office but they said no, they won't do any requests. So its like a circle.
p.s. it wasn't foolish because rules say to do so 5 days since you get certificate or you pay fine 1 000£. Foolish was to listen to the guy from Nationality checking Service who advised which name to write on my application for citizenship

Is there a such thing as class action lawsuits in the UK? Because if there is, you women have an iron-clad case against the UK for violation UDHR Section 13. I don't know what hope the UK government would have of defending itself.

ouflak1 wrote:Is there a such thing as class action lawsuits in the UK? Because if there is, you women have an iron-clad case against the UK for violation UDHR Section 13. I don't know what hope the UK government would have of defending itself.

This would be too expensive to do anyway

Mashec wrote:
Yes, Russian. I can't change my documents via embassy. If I could I wd have done it 3 years ago. The whole problem lies in the fact that I have to go to Russia to change my internal passport and then come bk and change external passport via embassy. Embassy refused to give me letter to prove it, they said Passport Office needs to make official request to them then they will give them information. I told it to Passport Office but they said no, they won't do any requests. So its like a circle.
p.s. it wasn't foolish because rules say to do so 5 days since you get certificate or you pay fine 1 000£. Foolish was to listen to the guy from Nationality checking Service who advised which name to write on my application for citizenship

Russian Embassy never will say that they can't change name in your passport because they can and they do it.
You do not need to change name in your internal passport if you do not have registration in Russia. If you do have registration in Russia, you can cancel your registration through embassy, although you may not wish do do this. I know many people would like to keep their registration for various of reasons.
Next step after you cancel your registration is to apply for name change by certificate of name change. You would need to show evidence (documents) of name change whenever in your life (marriage, divorce, etc) including your birth certificate.
And then you apply to change your external passport in your new name.
If you would like ever to change your external passport, you could do it in Russia in any FMS by showing your certificate of name change and external passport.
All together it will take approximately 6 months minimum. During this time you probably won't be able to go abroad, as you don't have ILR anymore or british passport yet.
This really stressful, but don't waste too much time on arguments with HMPO as this is useless. Good luck!

ouflak1 wrote:Is there a such thing as class action lawsuits in the UK? Because if there is, you women have an iron-clad case against the UK for violation UDHR Section 13. I don't know what hope the UK government would have of defending itself.

I don't know about it but I am sooo angry that I wouldn't mind to make a collective case and take them all to a court! It's absolutely unnecessary problem which has been created on empty place. I don't understand why they take my biometric enrolment every time then??? I don't believe it's very hard to track name of a married woman. Plus, to be fair I will use Russian passport only to go to Russia. And I will need to show two passports at the boarder anyway. I really don't see how this can affect security of the UK?!


To be honest I don't even care about meaning behind all this but I don't understand why they can't provide clear rules and guidelines to apply for citizenship?! The sad thing is that I actually paid money to a professional person to check my application before sending it to Home Office and I followed his advice! Why then Nationality Checking Service is not aware of this rule?! Is it a profesional incompetence of one individual officer or do they just deliberately want to put people in this situation?! This is a question for me......

Mashec wrote:

JohnnyZee wrote:Mashec - what is your aim here?

1) are you trying to amend your certificate of naturalisation (near to impossible) OR
2) Are you trying to get a UK passport in your maiden name?

If only 2, why do you really care about amending certificate? Just make your own deed poll, use 2 witnesses and send to HMPO. Write a cover letter what you are trying to do. Also print out gov.UK website which says you need a deed poll when certificate has different name:

https://www.gov.uk/changing-passport-in ... -documents

I don't think Scotland rules are different unless you are looking to enroll your deed poll in gazette. Besides, I assume you are not born in Scotland so that probably wouldn't apply. So best to use your own deed poll.

This way, you don't need to do anything to your foreign passport! It stays the same. Happy days

OMG! If it is true than it is absolutely amazing! But I don't understand why passport office has never told me about it???? The guy from the hotline told me I need to change certificate of naturalization if I want British Passport on my maiden name and never mentioned deed poll Same women who called me asking to get letter from the embassy! That's why I was looking for how to amend certificate.....

and who can be my witnesses? Anyone? Is there any requirements?

JohnnyZee, thank you for your advice but it won't work

I called Passport Office hot line, I asked them if I can use statutory declaration of changing my name. A guy on the phone said I can but I still need to make Home Office aware about it. So, in a way I see the situation right now I still need to send documents to Home Office. They might not change it on the certificate but I don't even need them to do it. All I need them to do is send me a letter or make an endorsement that they officially have accepted changing of my name. This statement will be enough for Passport Office to leave me alone.

To be honest I don't think Home Office has a right to refuse to do that. As a British Citizen I have a right to call myself any name I want so if I provide enough evidence that I use my maiden name only they sort of will have to accept it. However, after what happened I can't be sure in anything anymore

Marii wrote:

Mashec wrote:
Yes, Russian. I can't change my documents via embassy. If I could I wd have done it 3 years ago. The whole problem lies in the fact that I have to go to Russia to change my internal passport and then come bk and change external passport via embassy. Embassy refused to give me letter to prove it, they said Passport Office needs to make official request to them then they will give them information. I told it to Passport Office but they said no, they won't do any requests. So its like a circle.
p.s. it wasn't foolish because rules say to do so 5 days since you get certificate or you pay fine 1 000£. Foolish was to listen to the guy from Nationality checking Service who advised which name to write on my application for citizenship

Russian Embassy never will say that they can't change name in your passport because they can and they do it.
You do not need to change name in your internal passport if you do not have registration in Russia. If you do have registration in Russia, you can cancel your registration through embassy, although you may not wish do do this. I know many people would like to keep their registration for various of reasons.
Next step after you cancel your registration is to apply for name change by certificate of name change. You would need to show evidence (documents) of name change whenever in your life (marriage, divorce, etc) including your birth certificate.
And then you apply to change your external passport in your new name.
If you would like ever to change your external passport, you could do it in Russia in any FMS by showing your certificate of name change and external passport.
All together it will take approximately 6 months minimum. During this time you probably won't be able to go abroad, as you don't have ILR anymore or british passport yet.
This really stressful, but don't waste too much time on arguments with HMPO as this is useless. Good luck!

Yes, you are correct. It's not impossible to change your name but it's very difficult, and I explained it to Passport Office. I also explained embassy my situation and asked them to send me letter where they just describe the procedure but they refused to do it unless they will receive an official request from Passport Office. They also mentioned that Passport Office doesn't will to communicate with them properly which says to me that they had issues with each other before.

Yes, I do have registration in Russia and I'm not willing to change it. However, as far as I remember when I spoke to embassy in 2013 I've been told they don't have any rights to do anything with internal passports anymore. They can change my external passport not a problem and this does take up to 6 months. But if I want to change my name I need to change it in internal passport first In Russia and I can't do it with my marriage certificate. Scottish certificate doesn't have info saying what names spouses keep after a marriage so in Russian passport office its not a legal base to change name due to a marriage. If this information was there I would change my name not a problem as it doesn't take long. But in my case if I want to change my name I need to do it like I'm willing to change my name as my own wish. So I need to do it via registrar office with my birth certificate and this is very looong process. When I've been in Russia in 2013 and I faced this problem I made a decision that I won't do it. Usually you can make a power of attorney and someone can deal with paper work for you but in the case of birth certificates and passports you can't do power of attorney you are the only one who can send and receive documents.

So, as you see all together it's one big hassle. I'm not going to fight for the justice with Passport Office and Home Office (however, I'm so angry now that I wouldn't mind to take them to a court after all) but its easier for me (and faster) to change my name in British documents and send them to Home Office then to change my name in Russian documents. At the end of the day both countries gave me a right to choose my name, so I don't need to use my marriage name if I don#t want to. And this is what makes me angry, British Passport Office didn''t give me a choice: change your name in your Russian passport or change it in your certificate of naturalization. They were pushing me on the phone to change my Russian passport and I told them very strictly I'm not willing to do that because its too complicated. Only thanks to a guy from this forum and a guy from Passport Office hotline I actually found out about option 2.

I believe this information should be clearly provided as a guidelines to a application for a citizenship and all officers of Nationality Checking Service MUST be aware of it, so people can sort out their documents before they get certificate of naturalization with a "wrong" name on it.

Mashec wrote:....

To be honest I don't even care about meaning behind all this but I don't understand why they can't provide clear rules and guidelines to apply for citizenship?! The sad thing is that I actually paid money to a professional person to check my application before sending it to Home Office and I followed his advice! Why then Nationality Checking Service is not aware of this rule?! Is it a profesional incompetence of one individual officer or do they just deliberately want to put people in this situation?! This is a question for me......

Although AN application & passport forms have been updated over the past year (since this first came up and caught out my wife), it seems the training and knowledge transfer has still not made its way out to various helplines, to NCS and to Post Offfice Check&Send clerks.

Part of the problem seems to be that although citizenship is regulated by legislation, the issue of passports is by Royal Prerogative (a gift of the Queen if you will).
So this is down to more than the usual left-hand versus right hand type of problem that is typical in government departments.

A very sad & frustrating state of affairs. I feel your pain.