was Romanian national settled when his daughter was born?

Hi, my friend came to the UK sometimes around 2003/2004 he was on working visa as he is Romanian national. In 2007 Romania joined EU so he had something what Romanians call 'blue card' (I have never seen one of them, so don't really know what it is).
He was working all the time since he came here mainly as self-employed person. His daughter was born in July 2011, he wanted to register her as British citizen in next few months but I told him he does't need to as she was born as British citizen (born in the UK).
am'I right in saying so? did he acquired permanent residency rights before she was born in July 2011 if we take into account that he was working here since 2003/2004 first on working visa and than as EU citizen?
I told him to send tax returns covering 5 years before his child was born to demonstrate that he was settled before her birth.
I was reading somwhere here in the past that for EU citizens the time spend on working visas will count towards PR after their country join the EU.
From my point of view he will have to send his passport, 5 years worth of tax returns, passport form, photos, his daughter passport (Romanian) and short covering letter explaining that she was born British as her dad was settled before her birth.
if anyone can shed some light on this please.

Kind regards

boloney wrote: From my point of view he will have to send his passport, 5 years worth of tax returns, passport form, photos, his daughter passport (Romanian) and short covering letter explaining that she was born British as her dad was settled before her birth.

Yes, sounds like a good plan. However its six years if you do not hold a PR card, as far as I know. But I was not originally from EU myself, so I'd await further replies. Good luck.

vinny wrote:

EEA and Swiss nationals: free movement rights wrote:Permanent residence for nationals of accession states
Nationals of member states which have joined the EU since 2004 (EU8 countries, EU2 countries and Croatia) must have met any transitional arrangement which applied to them if they wish to rely on time spend in the UK to get a right of permanent residence.

Nationals of accession states can rely on time spent in the UK before the date on which the member state of which they are a national joined the EU for the purposes of getting a right of permanent residence in certain circumstances.

For further information on this, please see related links: EEA case law - Lassal and Dias.
For more information on permanent residence for nationals of accession states, see related links:
 Permanent residence for EU8 nationals
 Permanent residence for EU2 nationals
 Permanent residence for Croatian nationals

Thanks for info.
But it is still no clear to me if he can count period before Romania joined EU toward his pemanent residency.
Lassal is French national and France was in the EU during the period in question, while Romania was not.
At the time he was on working visa and is working as self-employed since, no breaks at all until now.
"Nationals of accession states can rely on time spent in the UK before the date on which the member state of which they are a national joined the EU for the purposes of getting a right of permanent residence in certain circumstances." - what are certain circumstances ?
if you could clarify this for me vinny please.

fwd079 wrote:

boloney wrote: From my point of view he will have to send his passport, 5 years worth of tax returns, passport form, photos, his daughter passport (Romanian) and short covering letter explaining that she was born British as her dad was settled before her birth.

Yes, sounds like a good plan. However its six years if you do not hold a PR card, as far as I know. But I was not originally from EU myself, so I'd await further replies. Good luck.

even if one does't hold the card 5 years still apply (my mate done this before, but he was EU citizen for whole 5 years, so this case is slighty different).

See also Ziolkowski (Freedom of movement for persons) [2011] EUECJ C-424/10 (21 December 2011) and
Vassallo (Qualifying residence; pre-UK accession) [2014] UKUT 313 (IAC) (11 Apr 2014) and
Miskovic & Anor v Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Rev 1) [2011] EWCA Civ 16 (20 January 2011),
etc.

As it's complicated, suggest daughter apply for confirmation of British nationality status (Fees), citing any applicable case laws.

Thanks vinny, after reading all cases you have provided I understand if he was legally working before Romania joined EU he can use this period for permanent residency, is that right?
I did draw a letter for him to send along with NS application, could you please have a look at it and let me know if thats any good and if his case have any chances of sucess?
"Dear Sir/Madam

I arrived in the UK on 20/01/2003, with intention to settle in the UK. I was granted working visa on 03/01/2003. Since than I was exercising my treaty rights as self-employed person.
„Article 16 of Directive 2004/38, entitled 'General rule for Union citizens and their family members', which forms part of Chapter IV thereof, entitled 'Right of permanent residence, is worded as follows:
'1. Union citizens who have resided legally for a continuous period of five years in the host Member State shall have the right of permanent residence there. This right shall not be subject to the conditions provided for in Chapter III. „
Based on judgements Ziolkowski (Freedom of movement for persons) [2011] EUECJ C-424/10 (21 December 2011) periods of residence completed by a national of a non-Member State in the territory of a Member State before the accession of the non-Member State to the European Union must, in the absence of specific provisions in the Act of Accession, be taken into account for the purpose of the acquisition of the right of permanent residence under Article 16(1) of Directive 2004/38, provided those periods were completed in compliance with the conditions laid down in Article 7(1) of the directive.
Also I would like to reffer you to case Vassallo (Qualifying residence; pre-UK accession) [2014] UKUT 313 (IAC) (11 Apr 2014) to suport my own case.
Based on the above cases and Article 16 of Directive 2004/38 as I was living legally and exercising treaty right for more than 5 years before July 2011 at this point I had automatically acquired right of permanent residence in the UK.
My daughter Ms. ……. …….. was born on …./07/2011 so after the date I acquired autmatically right of permanent residency in the UK, so based on Article 1 of British Nationality Act 1981 „(1)A person born in the United Kingdom after commencement [F1, or in a qualifying territory on or after the appointed day,] shall be a British citizen if at the time of the birth his father or mother is—
(a)a British citizen; or
(b)settled in the United Kingdom „
she was born as a British Citizen as I was settled in the UK before her birth.
Based on the above facts please send me letter confirming Nationality Status of my daughter which I wish to use in suport of Passport application which I wish to send to HM Passport Office soon.

Kind regards"

Thanks for your help

anyone can shed some light on this for me please?

Why don't you call passport helpline? I am sure they have more info

If no joy from the helpline, requesting confirmation of NS (as above) is a sensible option that also involves less outlay than a full application.