advice needed to bring my wife and baby to uk

[jrdx]

Hello all,

i am a UK citizen, born and bred in UK to UK parents.

i have been spending 6 months a year in west Africa for the past few years, i have a 6 month old baby girl here in Senegal with my senegalese wife of 15 months with whom i have been in a relationship with for 28 months.

i recently applied for a British passport for our baby, 2 weeks ago i sent the forms off to OVS-D, Millburngate.
the turn around time is expected to be 12 weeks.

i want to bring my wife and baby to UK.
i do not own a property in UK but my parents own a reasonably large house. i am not currently employed in UK but have never claimed any benefits. my parents who are self employed would be able to sponsor if necessary.
i want to know if it possible to take my wife and child back to the uk where we can live at my parents house in the short term until i can find work.

i have read through some of the information on the .gov site and some posts here but i am a little lost to say the least and could really do with some expert guidance.

it is rainy season here soon and my baby seems to have the kind of blood that the mosquitos like, i want to leave here as soon as possible. i read somewhere i could apply for a tourist visa for my wife and baby and then apply to extend that once we are all in uk...

any help would be much appreciated...

[Casa]

In order to meet the strict conditions on income, you only have the following 3 options.
1. Relocate to the UK ahead of your wife and child and wait until you have been employed for 6 months with a salary of £18,600 p.a
2. If you have been earning the equivalent of £18,600 p.a in Senegal for the 12 month period prior to submitting your wife's application and have a confirmed job offer in the UK to start within 3 months of arrival, again with the £18,600 p.a minimum salary
3. Savings over £62,500, held in an accessible bank account for a minimum of 6 months.

Third party financial support is not accepted, although accommodation can be provided.
It is not permissible to switch from visitor to spouse from within the UK.
I've assumed that your child holds British nationality and doesn't need to be included in the financial calculation.

[Wanderer]

You need to have earned £1550 pcm for last six months in UK on ongoing employment, or £62,500 for the last six months in cash savings.

I know what you mean about mossies, I'm blood group O neg, and they love me, when I was in Siberia last year they bit me to buggery. Well they don't actually bite, just stick their nose things into your skin and fill up!

[jrdx]

Thank you for the fast responses...

Would I be able to bring her in on a family visitor visa for 6 months..? If so does anybody know if this is a lengthy process..?

[Casa]

You could try, but your challenge would be to convince the ECO that your wife has stronger ties to her home country than she has to the UK. With you living there that could prove difficult. Also, requesting a 6 month stay is pushing it and may flag up the intention to stay on.

Does your child have a British passport? He'll need to enter with one and this can take time to be issued.

[jrdx]

...can I assume from what you are saying that I would be difficult to get a visitor visa even for one or two months..?

At least with a short term visa we could visit my family...

My baby daughter's uk passport is in process...

[Casa]

You can certainly try it. If refused if won't affect a spouse visa application later on.

[jrdx]

I would have thought that obtaining a visitors visa would have been easy as I assume there is a clause that guarantees that she will leave the country before the expiration of the visa...??
Or is it the case that once a person is in the country on a visitors visa they could then apply to stay due to being married and having a British child which is why the the eco needs the be convinced that she would leave...

[Casa]

I would have thought that obtaining a visitors visa would have been easy as I assume there is a clause that guarantees that she will leave the country before the expiration of the visa...??
Or is it the case that once a person is in the country on a visitors visa they could then apply to stay due to being married and having a British child which is why the the eco needs the be convinced that she would leave...

There is no clause guaranteeing return, although the visitor would become an illegal overstayer with a big black mark on their immigration record for any future visa application.
The ECO will be concerned that once in the country the visitor will decide to stick it out here, either going underground beneath the UKVI radar, or fighting a lengthy and costly appeal through the courts. The days of the 'anchor baby' are in the past and the Home Office are generally taking a tough stance that family life can be enjoyed outside of the UK.

Edit: You do have one other option. Check out the Surinder Singh route.

https://www.gov.uk/family-permit/surinder-singh

https://www.freemovement.org.uk/surinde ... ion-route/

[jrdx]

... I will read through this, thank you for your help...

[Casa]

You'e welcome. You may well have more questions to ask about the Surinder Singh option, so feel free to post if you do.

[jrdx]

...great, because i have had a quick look through it and there will be questions.!

[vinny]

I know what you mean about mossies, I'm blood group O neg, and they love me, when I was in Siberia last year they bit me to buggery. Well they don't actually bite, just stick their nose things into your skin and fill up!

I don't think they differentiate by blood groups. They love me as well and I'm not group O.

[jrdx]

having looked through this, assuming there is no major change in the next few months in UK / EU immigration law due to "Brexit", it appears to me that i could take my family to Spain for example, spend 3-4 months there, living together, and then i would be eligible to bring my wife back to the UK.
i used Spain as the example EU nation as i used to live and work there, i speak Spanish and my wife also speaks a little already. therefor, proving integration into the community and way of life should be easy enough for us.

i have looked into things here in Dakar and it may be possible for me to obtain a visitors visa for my wife, up to 6 months.
have i interpreted this correctly and if so what do you think my chances are..?!?

[Casa]

You would have to show that you had 'moved the centre of your life' to Spain or which ever EU state you opt for by working, renting property, integrating with local life etc. However, Spain does have a very high level of unemployment at present, especially for foreign workers.

[jrdx]

.. if we took this route it would be an authentic move of our "centre of life", I'm aware of the mass unemployment in Spain but i do still have a few friends and connections which could help us to get started..

if we had the option to stay in Spain for longer then going to the UK could even take a back seat. as i said i have spent many years in Spain and it is like a second home to me, in the last few months since the baby was born i have been considering re locating there as an alternative.

if we were to go to Spain do you know if there would be a possibility that my wife would be able to apply for a residence card once there.?

[jrdx]

I know what you mean about mossies, I'm blood group O neg, and they love me, when I was in Siberia last year they bit me to buggery. Well they don't actually bite, just stick their nose things into your skin and fill up!

I don't think they differentiate by blood groups. They love me as well and I'm not group O.

i agree, i don't believe that they differentiate by blood group, it just seems that some people have a sent that is more attractive than others... i fortunately don't get bitten much, i have been in the same room as other people and come out un touched where they have been bitten to hell..! I'm not really bothered by the bites themselves, its the fear of the possibility of some horrible parasitic infection the malaria that is the worry..

[noajthan]

Everyone on a EU migration trajectory and residing in a memberstate has the right to apply for a RC.

Get up to speed on free movement here:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/doc ... 013_en.pdf

[jrdx]

thank you, this is making very interesting reading, i was unaware of this directive, it could be perfect for my family...

unless i am much mistaken and if so please correct me but it appears that i, as an EU citizen, have the right to go to the Spanish embassy in dakar tomorrow and begin the process (which should take no more than 15days) to obtain an entry visa (free) for my wife and baby (upon producing passports and our marriage certificate) due to the fact that we will be living and starting our new life in an EU country other then of my origin.
with that visa we can travel together to Spain and start our life there...without having to demonstrate employment and housing in advance. (which, as stated earlier i know i can arrange without difficulty).

could you confirm if i have this right..? it would be great as i could potentially get us out of here before the mosquito season...

many thanks

[noajthan]

thank you, this is making very interesting reading, i was unaware of this directive, it could be perfect for my family...

unless i am much mistaken and if so please correct me but it appears that i, as an EU citizen, have the right to go to the Spanish embassy in dakar tomorrow and begin the process (which should take no more than 15days) to obtain an entry visa (free) for my wife and baby (upon producing passports and our marriage certificate) due to the fact that we will be living and starting our new life in an EU country other then of my origin.
with that visa we can travel together to Spain and start our life there...without having to demonstrate employment and housing in advance. (which, as stated earlier i know i can arrange without difficulty).

could you confirm if i have this right..? it would be great as i could potentially get us out of here before the mosquito season...

many thanks

Yes, I think you've got it.

That's the beauty and elegance of EU free movement.
You have the power and weight of EU law behind you as you are, for now at least, a Union (EU) citizen.

Can't say if the embassy lives up to the published processing time but I'm sure you'll keep us posted.

More of possible interest here:
https://eumovement.wordpress.com/2007/0 ... u-citizen/

Note the lack of fees and financial requirements; no language tests etc etc. (Hard to imagine why anyone would throw all that away).

[jrdx]

thats really great, thank you for bringing this to my attention...

I'm obviously a little worried due to the Brexit situation, i am going to start the process ASAP but i have heard it could be some time until UK/EU immigration actually changes...any thoughts on that..?

[jrdx]

thats really great, thank you for bringing this to my attention...

I'm obviously a little worried due to the Brexit situation, i am going to start the process ASAP but i have heard it could be some time until UK/EU immigration actually changes...any thoughts on that..?

[noajthan]

thats really great, thank you for bringing this to my attention...

I'm obviously a little worried due to the Brexit situation, i am going to start the process ASAP but i have heard it could be some time until UK/EU immigration actually changes...any thoughts on that..?

I don't know much about it but it will apparently take 2 years (at least) after the Article 50 switch is flipped.
So you have 2+ years to get a headstart in Spain/UK.

As you'll be still be in 'mid-flight' what happens at the end will depend on any transitional arrangements that may be put in place. Noone knows.

[jrdx]

..that would certainly be good enough for us, i was just a little worried that we could end up missing out on this option by a just a couple of weeks if everything changed quickly after the brevet vote...

i have been to the Spanish embassy in dakar today, they were busy and could only answer a few basic questions and they also gave me an A4 print out of the requirements in Spanish.
i am fluent enough in Spanish but i don't understand a few of the terms that they used.

after reading the guide: (http://ec.europa.eu/justice/citizen/doc ... 013_en.pdf)
that you linked to, the info i was given at the embassy was pretty much as expected.

but they said that they do not accept the senegalese marriage certificate as proof. the lady i spoke to at the Spanish embassy said that i must have my senegalese marriage certificate verified/authenticated by the British embassy, i visited the British embassy but there they said that they offer no such service.

i re-read the hand out in Spanish that i was given by the embassy, the direct translation is that the documents required as proof that my wife is a "family member" are:

1: a document certifying the validity of marriage, issued by the State of Community (in this case my "state of community" is UK)
2: family book

any ideas..?

( yesterday i visited the office of VFS global the company contracted by the spanish and french embassies here to outsource visa applications, i was informed that visas are processed within 5 working days provided all necessary supporting document are supplied.. which is pretty good if true...but if/when i get that far i will update with actual processing time...)

[noajthan]

...

but they said that they do not accept the senegalese marriage certificate as proof. the lady i spoke to at the Spanish embassy said that i must have my senegalese marriage certificate verified/authenticated by the British embassy, i visited the British embassy but there they said that they offer no such service.

i re-read the hand out in Spanish that i was given by the embassy, the direct translation is that the documents required as proof that my wife is a "family member" are:

1: a document certifying the validity of marriage, issued by the State of Community (in this case my "state of community" is UK)
2: family book

any ideas..?

...

There may be some helpful links in this post about Spain and mcs:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/europe ... e#p1305108