British citizen, morocccain husband+4 month old daughter

[juju1979]

Also at the end of the application it is saying that we have to pay 90 euro, what is that about??, they will not get a cent from us

[JAJ]

I am british citizen living in Rome,Italy 8 years now, married to my husband who is Maroccain and we also have a 4 month old daughter, we have been living together for 5 years and married for nearly 3 of those years.
We would like very much to return to Scotland(uk)to start our new life as a family as here in Rome it is not working out for us anymore.
We have a few options i think, but need 100% confirmation that which ever i choose will be the right one. since havingn our daughter I lost my job and my huband was relieved of his work a year ago now and has had no luck in finding more.
1:- apply for EEA family permit(husband unemployed)can't finish application.
2:-Settlement visa ???
3:- EU law (EU Directive 2004)moving freely through the EU with EU(UK) wife.
Meaning for No3 if i know that i can get my husband into the UK using Eu law i will to any effect possible.
Please can anyone help as we would really appreciate it
thanks to all who read me and reply

1. Is there any option to get Italian citizenship?

2. Does your daughter have a consular birth certificate from the British Embassy in Rome?

3. Off topic, but you should be aware that your daughter is probably also a Moroccan citizen because of her father and if she is in Morocco, Britain will not be able to provide her with consular protection (eg she could be prevented from leaving).

I don't know if wives of Moroccan men automatically become citizens, but if so, you may also have to be aware of this.

[juju1979]

Italian citizenship nope, as while he HAS worked here in Rome and paid a some taxes, it has always been working as an EXTRA, so he would wait for them to call and tell him when they NEEDED him.
My daughter yes has birth certificate from the consulate in rome.
It would not be a problem if it ever occured leaving marocco as we will one day live there ourselves but at the moment we are focusng on Scotland, as that is my home and we have more and better options.
thanks julie

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

You do not have to pay 90 euros. This is an application under European law and so is done at no cost.

[juju1979]

well here i a to fill you in, well as you may know that the BritishEmbassy here in Rome DOES NOT HANDLE VISAS, in meaning they use a middle man Worldbridge services, we took all that we had and went there. all went well as it sems they only check that you have it all in order and all supporting documents, and then they send it to the Embassy(i think)
We just have to wait for a reply to find out if my husband got the eea family permit or not and yes it was FREE OF CHARGE, will keep you posted and thanks for all your help

[juju1979]

Received a phone call from the British Embassy in Rome this morning, I need to fax them evidence of me exercising my treaty rights here in rome, I said ok i would fax them no problem there and then she asked me also for bank statements, which i kindly replied, under EU law in which we are applying for the permit we do not need to provide those items.
I will fax some payslips from my first job and second one also, and also a declaration saying that neither of the 2 of us have a bank account here in Italy.

[Ben]

..and also [fax to the embassy] a declaration saying that neither of the 2 of us have a bank account here in Italy.

What for? As you have already mentioned, this is not a requirement in accordance with Directive 2004/38/EC.

[juju1979]

well what i will do, when i fax payslips for to show them i exercised my treaty rights, i will also write a letter saying again that i will not provide anything else as i do not have to thru the EU Directive,I do need to prove that i have exercised my treaty rights in italy don't i
(payslips) or nothing at all

[Ben]

I do need to prove that i have exercised my treaty rights in italy don't i
(payslips) or nothing at all

You need to evidence that you have been exercising EU Treaty rights in accordance with Directive 2004/38/EC. In your case, you have been employed. In my opinion, payslips relating to this employment is all that is required.

[juju1979]

well that is all i will give them then, it will do only a few payslips i don't think i need to send them all do i

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Out of curiousity, why have you never opened a bank account in Italy?

[juju1979]

just never done it, moved here when i was 20 and was stupid and not saving money, was in the pub all the time, and now i realise how stupid i have been to be here 8 years and i have othing to show for it,

[juju1979]

hi there, it looks like the embassy have started playing games already, received a phone call this morning at 10:15, they have called to say that because I am not exercising my treaty rights NOW that i have to fax a letter to the embassy saying that i am stopping the EEA family permit and re-apply for the settelment visa,
what is going on?? are they right or not!!
please help as soon as possible.

thanks julie

[juju1979]

I need to get this clear in my head,
Do i need to be exercising my treaty rights NOW to qualify for the EEA family permit under EU law,
I no longer work, so i am not exercising them anymore, does that matter???
Very frustrated

[juju1979]

thy also said that we would have to re-apply for the Settelment visa which surprisingly is the most expensive at 715.00 euro, funny isn't it,

any help would be appreciated

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Describe the last time you were working - for how long, full or part time, when did you finish?

[Ben]

I'm not 100% on this, but my understanding is that you should be exercising "economic" Treaty rights at the time of application, in order for your family member to qualify for an EEA Family Permit in relation to the Surinder Singh ruling.

Whilst there are some positives over using the UK national legislation router (spouse visa), there are also negatives, one being the cost.

Could you not just get a temporary job before you leave Italy? Any job would do.

[juju1979]

have been trying but nothing that is why I want to take my family home, so then there i know i can find a good job, i only stopped working in June as i was pregnant with my daughter and i lost my job because i was having a baby, that is why i no longer exercise my treaty rights now,

Yeah and the price for settlement is 715.00euro and that i just don't have, if we go home we have a house , my mum until we are on our feet and would not be claiming money from the government

[Ben]

i only stopped working in June as i was pregnant with my daughter and i lost my job because i was having a baby, that is why i no longer exercise my treaty rights now

You may be able to use this to your advantage. Certainly under UK law you are entitled to maternity leave and to return to work after your maternity leave. I'd be astonished if Italian law were not the same, in this regard. It may even be a requirement under European law.

Either way, if nothing else, I'd emphasize this point in your application, that you lost your job because you were having a baby. In my opinion, this should invoke analysis of your application under compassionate circumstances, at least.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

You need to take a deep breath and relax about all this. Getting worked up will not solve your problem. I personally think it is a pretty easy problem and I am personally quite clear you have been exercising your treaty rights.

I would strongly recommend that you NOT withdraw your EEA family permit application right now. You have very clearly been exercising your treaty rights in Italy. It is also 100% OK to be pregnant and have a baby in the EU, and it is in fact explicitly referred to in Directive 2004/38/EC. There is also a lot of case law about this.

What is your complete work history in Italy since you have arrived?

How did the job in June finish? Did you quit, or were you fired or did you officially take maternity leave?

Please contact http://ec.europa.eu/citizensrights/ with a summary of your work history in Italy, and with a description of what you want to do and with the embassy response. See what they say.

[juju1979]

Letter from British Embassy regarding application:-
Dear ******
In order to process your visa application,ref ****** you are required to provide the documents listed below, by 26/03/2008.The documentation must be sent in original unless otherwise specified.If you do not produce the requested documents, your visa applicationwill be considered on the basis of the documentation produced so far.

- Evidence your spouse has been exercising her treaty rights in Italy, therefore we need to see evidence of work and funds(to show your spouse can support you)

If you do not meet the requirments you should apply for settlement.

End of letter.

So i faxed over some payslips from jobs that i have worked and also letter declaring that we don not have bank accounts here and i also made it clear that we were applying under EU LAW.
Since i have lived in Italy i have worked the following:-
2000-2005:-contract full time BAR MANAGER
2006:- 6 month contract UAE EMBASSY
2007:- 3 months contract WAITRESSING
2007:- 3 months cashier (non contract)
2007:- 3 months waitress, cleaner, cook,(job that lost because was pregnant)no renewal of contract.

[juju1979]

Also was told before starting my last job that i would be full-time, when it became time to sign the contract it was only for 3 months and so i signed, when it came to the middle of June I was no longer able to work as they expected me to work in a Spam by myself with an oven that was to stay at 300 for the pizza's and also take care of the customers(seating,taking food orders, cleaning), so was told by my boss to go on sick leave, which i did, and then was on matenity leave, still up til now being on maternity leave. Contract finished on 23 july 2007

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Please read carefully what they wrote. They ask for original documentation, and I am sure a fax will not do. Remember that they do not know you and do not know your situation, and you need to provide documentation that fills in their picture of the past.

You should send them a package of material consisting of
- all your pay slips and job starting and finishing documentation for any previous jobs in italy and especially for the most recent one.
- any documentation which supports your claim that you were on maternity leave – i.e. proof that you were on maternity leave. Do you have anything from the government or your local municipal government? Or something your doctor or midwife signed in anticipation of maternity leave?
- evidence that you have had a child (birth certificate)

Evidence for 2007:- 3 months cashier (non contract)
Can you get a letter from your employers or do you have pay slips or tax receipts for this job?

You also need to write the embassy a good letter which acturately describes your situation and calls their attention to the law which applies to your case. You need to explain clearly to them that you have been working for a long time in Italy and have recently taken off time, as allowed under the EU rules, to have a baby. You now want your husband's entry to the UK to be considered on the basis of the EU Singh ruling and that you intend to seek and find work immediately on your return to the UK. Because you plan to work, you are not required to provide evidence of resources for your husband. You will have to write this letter very carefully.

[juju1979]

hi there, just letting you kno that we done it and were granted the EEA Family permit for 6 months, on the 2 April, we thank you for your help and look forward to our new lives in BONNIE SCOTLANDand thank you once again

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

What information did you submit that made them reverse their original decision?

When you get to scotland, you need to get a job and as soon as you have that your husband needs to apply for a Residence Card