Refused (based on past earnings) -- please help

[melimango]

Hi all,
I just discovered this forum and need some advice. I received my refusal on the 22nd (sent it from the USA on the 7th, payment was taken on the 12th, and my letter is dated the 18th, if you're curious). This is what I submitted:

Education: 30 points awarded
Original bachelor's diploma submitted

Age: 20 points awarded
Driver's license submitted (I'm 25)

English: sufficient
Letter from university stating my graduation, degree, degree taught in English submitted

Salary: 0 points awarded (25 claimed)
I was claiming 15 October 2005-14 October 2006. My evidence was split into 3 parts as in the US we only receive tax forms at the beginning of the calendar year, and I held a job from Oct-March and a different one from March-Oct.

-For Oct-Dec 2005 I had my original W2 tax form, which I submitted.
-I also submitted my bank account statements printed from my online account.

-For Jan-March, I submitted my 2nd to last wage slip which showed the amount of my regular biweekly salary, but it also showed the cumulative amount that I earned since January. I also submitted my final wage slip which reflected a bonus, but also showed the cumulative amount I had earned that calendar year.
-I again had my bank account statements printed from online.

-For March-Oct 2006, I had my current employer write a letter stating my salary (on letterhead, signed).
-I had not saved my 15th October wage slip because I didn't know at the time I would be needing it--due to the slipping rate of the dollar I didn't qualify until the 5th December changes, and 15th Oct was the only end-date I could use! My employer was unable to re-do any wage slips, so my accounting department had their computer program spit out a list of all of my earnings, which showed the date, amount, and total.
-I again had my bank statements printed from online.

My letter from the Home Office states "You have not provided original evidence of your bank statements, as outlined in the HSMP guidance, regarding your previous earnings. The evidence you have supplied, i.e., the two wage slips included, shows that you earned XXX, which is below the scoring threshold. In line with the published guidance, no points have been awarded."

First off--prior to finding this message board, I had never spoke with anyone who had applied to HSMP or dealt with the Home Office. I had no idea about how unfair it is and I would have done a few things differently but based on the PUBLISHED GUIDANCE as they say reference, I believe I do qualify based on what is written! And the most absurd thing is that the amount of XXX they felt is sufficiently evidenced does not correspond to any of the amounts of money I claimed!

I called the Home Office inquiry line and the guy first says "oh, was your wage slip on company letterhead?" No, it's on payroll letterhead but it has a watermark, etc. Then he realized that the evidence they DID accept was the wage slips, so the period from January-March 2006. But they added the two cumulative amounts together, which is what the XXX they referenced equals. Which is wrong in my favor, but still wrong!!! (one wage slip showed x, and the other x+400, so x+400 was the total amount but they added x+x+400). So it's not the wage slips they (at least this caseworker) have a problem with.

Then he goes "your bank statements weren't on letterhead or stamped or signed, it could be that." I see from reading the forum NOW that stamped and signed is the norm, but NOWHERE in the guidance does it say anything about stamped and signed. I have a paperless account so I don't receive paper statements, and in order to get the online statements I had to log into my account and specifically request each month's statement and wait for them to email it to me. So those were the originals as far as I was concerned!

And even if it was the bank statements that were the issue, I should have been approved for the period from March-Oct 2006, where I had the letter from my employer AND the print out from accounting. (although the letter from accounting looks flimisiest--no letterhead or signed--but in the letter from the home office they never referenced it!).

So sorry for the lengthy post--but I'm very frustrated. I had wanted to move by March, and I certainly do not want to pay another application fee unless absolutely necessary. I hate the idea of paying a second fee when I feel as though I did nothing wrong. If I must, I can wait a few weeks and use the period from Jan-Dec 2006 once I get my W2 tax forms, and have my bank sign and stamp my statements, but since their reasoning is so bizarre I'm afraid to get rejected again.

I just think it's really unfair of them as in the printed guidelines they mention nothing about stamping and signing--for my paperless account, the printed statements are originals, and I'm sure they look exactly the same as the originals would have! Or I'm wondering if it's because I didn't send individual wage slips--but the ones from Jan-March I sent show the cumulative amount, and from March-Dec I didn't save them and my job can't redo them.

Think my reasoning is legit and I should appeal? Can anyone explain why they use criteria for refusing that's not in the printed guidelines?! And why the inquiry line people can't even tell me what I did wrong?!

[Jk2007]

Regarding Online Printouts, in case of wage slips the guidelines mention that -- if the pay slips are online printouts they need to be signed and stamped --

I think they applied the same logic for Bank statements too..

[melimango]

I personally do not consider it to be the same at all. They ask for "originals" and my online statements are the originals, as simple as that. Not trying to argue with you, I just think their logic is faulty!

[Jk2007]

melimango

I understand the difficulties with Online Saver accounts. I have an Online Saver account with an international bank, and one of the conditions of this account is that they would not issue paper statements. Recently I requested the Bank to sign and stamp the online printouts, they refused. I needed this to show my funds availability, but the bank officials were not cooperative.

However, from various feedbacks provided by members in this forum, we find that HO may not accept online printouts of Bank statements unless it is signed and stamped..

Since you cannot provide additional evidences for review, I think you can call HO and give them the contact phone number of your Bank so that they could verify the details over phone. I am not sure, if the caseworker / reviewer would agree to this. You can try.

[shockboy2000]

i'm not having a go here, but its just common sense to get something authorised (i.e. signed and/or stamped) that is simply printed out.

One of the main reasons for the new HSMP rules is to crack down on possible fraudulent documentation being used, so submitting something printed out from online could be anything you knocked up in MSWord/photoshop as HomeOffice are concerned.

With wage slips etc its easy enough for them to phone up employer to clarify amounts - but NO bank is going to confirm your transactions to Home Office (or anyone for that matter) over the phone are they?

i send a lot of pounds earned to my aussie account, which is an online account too. I just rang them up, yes called Australia, and told them i MUST have paper printed copies on coloured letterhead.
Yes the bank may charge you a couple of dollars per sheet - since it wasnt your agreement with the bank to receive printed statements...but its worth the effort/cost.
I'd be extremely surprised if they didnt do it if you paid them - banks are always lookin for more ways to take money from you.
Mine came from oz to uk within a week too which was impressive.

i honestly thought i read somewhere anyway that online statements would not be accepted...possibly it was off one of the websites (not guidance notes obviously)...i will have a hunt around tomorrow morning.

[webhunter]

I dont think the bank individuals have the right to disclose any information about an Account Holder, even if the call is from the HSMP team.

It is not the first time that HomeOffice have'nt been fair. Melimango, sorry to hear about your refusal. Since you have mentioned that you are new to the HSMP stuff, you may want to browse more on these forums, the way they have changed 1 + 3 + 1 system and ILR 5 yrs and re-qualifying at the end of the initial approval for extension etc.,

From my understanding, when home office refers to something as Original document, they really mean it as the original. (Not xerox, Not an online printout, Not a certified copy and etc.,)

Since you are not in a hurry to come to UK, and since appeal does'nt cost any money, you may want to test your luck.

The way they give points for Age and Education are crystal clear, there is no ambiguity at all. I just wish they do something similar to Earnings as well.

[paramjit2k]

Hi melimango,

Sad to hear u got rejection.

But i see some valid reasons for ur rejection even I can see ur genuine part. Somethings they r really sticked r RULES, like any evidence not endorsed by concerned authoirty is not accepted. So for earning points, u need 2 mandatory evidences. In the abscence of, signed and stamped bank statements or statement on letter head, they did not had 2nd evidence with which they can check and match ur earnings.

Writing this post, I do not feel u was lacking in the evidences, but somethings i have learned in this forum and from old cases is they want full proof evidences. So that they do not need to communicate to anyone to clarify for that.

I suggest u to go for the Fresh app with 2 valid evidences per company.

U have 4 to choose from:
ITR, SAL SLIP, EMP LETTER, BANK STATEMENTS

Original means direct from authority, if print outs get them endorsed.

Hope it helps.

[melimango]

OK. So if I do reapply, if I use the period from Jan-Dec 2006 I will have W2 tax forms for the entire 12 month period. I can request from my bank my bank statements and have them sign and stamp them.
Do I need my W2 tax form stamped and signed? Do I need each bank statement stamped and signed or just one on the top? Should I include any of the following or will it detract:

-letter from employer stating salary (however, I wasn't employed there for the entire 12 month period, and the letter stating my salary doesnt include a bonus I received in december which I needed to get into the right salary bracket)
-cumulative wage slip from job held jan-march and one from march-dec (do not have wage slips from all months)


anything else I should take into consideration? I'm just worried they will decide something else is wrong.