EEA Family Permit - Extended Family member - Presettled Status after coming to UK after 31st DEC, 2020

it takes around 20 WDs to get a response from them.

Strange. if they just tell UKVI the status they can avoid a lot of traffic asking them unnecessary questions.

It's such a same that this is taking so long. If the decision has been made then they should return the passport asap, especially when you have escalated this twice and also made a complaint. Sometimes it makes me think whether they are telling the truth or not. Also, I think that they are not giving priority to extended family member of EEA national. When did your brother had his biometric?

kamoe wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 25, 2020 3:48 pm

SHM201 wrote: ↑

Thu Dec 24, 2020 8:30 pm

a. Can he invite his family members with his pre-settled status? (wife and 2 kids (7/8yrs old))

This one is a wild guess, since I have not seen this spelled out anywhere, and judging by the fact that if you allow an adult to be financially independent, surely that means they are allowed to live independently.

I believe I should try and clarify this in the hope that it may help others.

Under the treaty, dependants and members of the household retain their rights on 2 conditions.

1.The had residence card issued to them before transition period ends or have applied before it ended.

2. They contiune to remain in the UK.

If those 2 conditions are met, then they are able to retain their rights exclusively on an independent basis.

They do not need to live with sponsor as they will retain their rights.

The UK requires them to show they are dependent at time of application, but that is not consistent and may be challenged in court.

The government is silent on continued membership of EU citizen household, but for the reasons given, they cannot lawfully impose such condition.

SHM201 wrote: ↑

Sun Jan 31, 2021 7:17 pm

Hi Sajid,
Today My brother got the same response. following is their response. What's your take on such responses.
FYI.

- 14th DEC: they told us the decision is made through a paid service UKVI.
- 17th DEC: 1st escalation, 15 days wait time... but we got no news
- 13th JAN: upon request to get the response they escalated again, 15 days wait time.
- 18th JAN: formal complaint
- 27th JAN: MP contacted
- 30th JAN: the following email from Liverpool International SITEL LiverpoolInternationalSitel@homeoffice.gov.uk



Hello,
Thank you for your enquiry regarding your Family Permit application.

We apologise for the delay with your application. A decision has been made and the Visa Application Centre will be in touch with regards to the return of your documents.

If you have any other enquiries please do not respond to this email as this mailbox is for internal use only, please contact UKVI using the details on gov.uk https://www.gov.uk/contact-ukvi-inside-outside-uk

We hope this resolves your query.

I have received a response today and it is a refusal sadly.

1. You state that the sponsor is your brother and as evidence of your relationship you
have supplied your birth certificate along with your sponsors. It is noted that both of
these birth certificates have been registered over 30 years after your births. You have
supplied no information as to why this is. Without further historical documentation or
evidence of your relationship to the sponsor I am unable to accept that you are related
as claimed.

The documents I provided for this were:
a. My ID card (fathers name is printed)
b. My brothers ID card (fathers name is printed)
c. Family registration certificate: this certificate is shows all members of family and their names/ID card numbers
d. Birth Certificate of my self: In Pakistan, official documentation is a mess. This is why I had to get a new certificate because i had left Pakistan 16yrs ago. so the Birth certificate was newly issued.
e. Birth Certificate of my brother

What I plan to do is: Get a DNA test.

Could somebody suggest please what is the best way to prove a relationship legally accepted in the UK? and if DNA test, is there a specific DNA test.

2. On your application you state that your sponsor has resided in the UK since 2017 and
that you are financially dependent on him. As evidence of this, you have provided money
transfer remittance receipts from your sponsor to you, however, it is noted that these
transfers are dated immediately prior to your application (within the last twelve months).
Unfortunately, this limited amount of evidence in isolation does not prove that you are
financially dependent on your sponsor. I would expect to see substantial evidence of
this over a prolonged period, considering the length of time your sponsor has been
resident in the United Kingdom.

I have shown 1.5yrs of transactions amounting to 750GBP a month on average
I don't have any other document on my brother's name as I was sending this money to my mother for my brother because she could collect from Bank in cash while the brother was working. At that time it was easier that way

Could somebody suggest to me what to do in this case? 1.5yrs of proof isn't enough for them?

3. I would also expect to see evidence which fully details yours and your family’s
circumstances. Your income, expenditure and evidence of your financial position which
would prove that without the financial support of your sponsor your essential living
needs could not be met.

I have shown major expenses of my brother especially driven by 2x special needs kids.

Could somebody suggest to me what to do in this case? 1.5yrs of proof isn't enough for them?

I therefore refuse your EEA Family Permit application because I am not satisfied that
you meet all of the requirements of regulation 12 (see ECGs EUN2.23) of the
Immigration (European Economic Area) Regulations 2016.

Any help ?

Hello

You have 2 issues here.

1 - They don't accept he is your brother.

Not all countries have the same standard when it comes to paperwork. But you need to get as much documents from local authorities to show you have the same parents. Ideally, documents registered at your birth even if issued later.

You may overcome this with some work.


2 - You didn't show he is dependent.

This is more difficult to recover from than point 1.

The money you sent to your mother, is for your mother. It hard to make it believable that it was for your brother in a context of an immigration application. They won't accept your word for it and they don't have to. So only in the months leading to the application, that you started sending money to your brother. Before, the money was going to your mother.

In your case, I guess you are also applying for a his kids and his wife too. So it's an entire extended family you would like to bring to the UK. I anticipate some resistance from the Home Office. You can only face it an overwhelming quantity of evidence.

Zerubbabel wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:00 pm

Hello

You have 2 issues here.

1 - They don't accept he is your brother.

Not all countries have the same standard when it comes to paperwork. But you need to get as much documents from local authorities to show you have the same parents. Ideally, documents registered at your birth even if issued later.

You may overcome this with some work.


2 - You didn't show he is dependent.

This is more difficult to recover from than point 1.

The money you sent to your mother, is for your mother. It hard to make it believable that it was for your brother in a context of an immigration application. They won't accept your word for it and they don't have to. So only in the months leading to the application, that you started sending money to your brother. Before, the money was going to your mother.

In your case, I guess you are also applying for a his kids and his wife too. So it's an entire extended family you would like to bring to the UK. I anticipate some resistance from the Home Office. You can only face it an overwhelming quantity of evidence.

Thanks for responding.

1. I think I can prove it with DNA and multiple different documents.
- They mentioned in refusal letter that I didn't explain to them why I and my brother registered 30yrs later. --- I provided in a letter to them a complete set of the reasoning behind it. In Belgium, they always wanted recently issued birth certificate so every time they wanted a new and original document which they kept. So, I had to get a new certificate for this exercise. hence the reason of new certificate. together with an old Birth certificate that was issued in 2004 which according to Pakistan standard is not valid because all such documents were digitalized after 2004 in around 2010 onward.


2. I found payment slip to my brother as of Mar, 2019 onward. In march, 2020 it will account for 2years even if I ignore what I sent through my mother to him. However in the evidence i only provided them evidence from May, 2019 onward up to Nov, 2020 = 18months of fund transfer detail. Contrary to the statement they mentioned that all money was transferred in last 12 months. that wasn't the case.
--- to your point. No I have only applied for my brother and after getting his settled status (or switching to work permit), he will invite his family.

3. what do you think about point 3?

SHM201 wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:14 pm

Zerubbabel wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 06, 2021 8:00 pm

Hello

You have 2 issues here.

1 - They don't accept he is your brother.

Not all countries have the same standard when it comes to paperwork. But you need to get as much documents from local authorities to show you have the same parents. Ideally, documents registered at your birth even if issued later.

You may overcome this with some work.


2 - You didn't show he is dependent.

This is more difficult to recover from than point 1.

The money you sent to your mother, is for your mother. It hard to make it believable that it was for your brother in a context of an immigration application. They won't accept your word for it and they don't have to. So only in the months leading to the application, that you started sending money to your brother. Before, the money was going to your mother.

In your case, I guess you are also applying for a his kids and his wife too. So it's an entire extended family you would like to bring to the UK. I anticipate some resistance from the Home Office. You can only face it an overwhelming quantity of evidence.

Thanks for responding.

1. I think I can prove it with DNA and multiple different documents.
- They mentioned in refusal letter that I didn't explain to them why I and my brother registered 30yrs later. --- I provided in a letter to them a complete set of the reasoning behind it. In Belgium, they always wanted recently issued birth certificate so every time they wanted a new and original document which they kept. So, I had to get a new certificate for this exercise. hence the reason of new certificate. together with an old Birth certificate that was issued in 2004 which according to Pakistan standard is not valid because all such documents were digitalized after 2004 in around 2010 onward.


2. I found payment slip to my brother as of Mar, 2019 onward. In march, 2020 it will account for 2years even if I ignore what I sent through my mother to him. However in the evidence i only provided them evidence from May, 2019 onward up to Nov, 2020 = 18months of fund transfer detail. Contrary to the statement they mentioned that all money was transferred in last 12 months. that wasn't the case.
--- to your point. No I have only applied for my brother and after getting his settled status (or switching to work permit), he will invite his family.

3. what do you think about point 3?

The only option is appeal, i saw alot of weak cases who have been successful. Even my brother case is very strong, still they refused him and i am sure he will get it in review .

Could you show me your rejection letter?
thanks for the groups on facebook. I have joined a few. I am not sure if you referred to any specific one.

SHM201 wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 07, 2021 8:43 am

Could you show me your rejection letter?
thanks for the groups on facebook. I have joined a few. I am not sure if you referred to any specific one.

It's called xxxxxxxx (xxxx is admin ) join this group . In our refusal is only point of circumstances and family circumstances. So we made his School fee receipt and letter from school that he is full time student. My solicitor said you have high chance on appeal.

3. I would also expect to see evidence which fully details yours and your family’s
circumstances. Your income, expenditure and evidence of your financial position which
would prove that without the financial support of your sponsor your essential living
needs could not be met.

I have shown major expenses of my brother especially driven by 2x special needs kids.

Could somebody suggest to me what to do in this case? 1.5yrs of proof isn't enough for them?

Your income, expenditure and evidence of your financial position -> They want to see the detail of his financial situation. It's not enough to show that you send him money.

Just to give you an example: my uncle sent to my brother £30'000 during the last few years. It's all documented. Can this be used by my uncle to sponsor my brother? Taken in isolation, no. Actually, my uncle is building a house back home and my brother manages the project for him. The money goes to pay the builders and buy building material. My brother works, owns his home and has comfortable earning. So he is not dependent despite the proof that he receives money from abroad.

So just money receipts alone are not enough. Your brother needs to show is full financial situation and where the money you send him fits. Does he work? How much does he earn? What are his expenses?... etc. You need to show them the full picture.

kamoe wrote: ↑

Tue Dec 22, 2020 8:00 am

As long as he's issued a family permit he'll be treated as close family member.

There is a provision to treat people that sucessfully apply for EEA permits before Dec 31st and get them after Dec 31st as if these had been issued just before Dec 31st.

Can you please define "provision" and "successfully apply" ?
I know of a provision to extend the deadline for non-EEA, unmarried partners to apply for EEA FP till June 2021.

Many people (incl. lawyers) told me last year that online submission date is what counts not the biometrics and the 1st email from UKVI.
My partner applied on 18/12/2020 but haven't done the biometrics yet. I am still worried if that extension also covers applying for a pre-settled status.

geezerpl wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 08, 2021 2:04 am

Can you please define "provision" and "successfully apply" ?

See this post.

Many people (incl. lawyers) told me last year that online submission date is what counts not the biometrics and the 1st email from UKVI.

Yes, that is my understanding.

I am still worried if that extension also covers applying for a pre-settled status.

Not sure what your question is here. The deadline for applying to the Settlement Scheme, including EUSS FP, is June 30th 2021, it has never been December 31st 2020.

kamoe wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 08, 2021 8:47 am

Not sure what your question is here. The deadline for applying to the Settlement Scheme, including EUSS FP, is June 30th 2021, it has never been December 31st 2020.

There was a post in December (which you just quoted) saying that ONLY THOSE WHO APPLIED FOR THE EEA FP BEFORE 31 DEC WILL BE REGARDED AS CLOSE FAMILY MEMBERS (when relationship with EU national began before 31 Dec) AND ELIGIBLE TO APPLY FOR EU PRE-SETTLED TILL 30 JUN 2021...

What about the EEA family permit issued after 31 Dec based on an application submitted by a durable partner after 31 Dec ?
Will such person be only able to visit the UK without the eligibility to apply for EU pre-settled status ????

geezerpl wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 08, 2021 9:10 pm

kamoe wrote: ↑

Mon Feb 08, 2021 8:47 am

Not sure what your question is here. The deadline for applying to the Settlement Scheme, including EUSS FP, is June 30th 2021, it has never been December 31st 2020.

There was a post in December (which you just quoted) saying that ONLY THOSE WHO APPLIED FOR THE EEA FP BEFORE 31 DEC WILL BE REGARDED AS CLOSE FAMILY MEMBERS (when relationship with EU national began before 31 Dec) AND ELIGIBLE TO APPLY FOR EU PRE-SETTLED TILL 30 JUN 2021...

What about the EEA family permit issued after 31 Dec based on an application submitted by a durable partner after 31 Dec ?
Will such person be only able to visit the UK without the eligibility to apply for EU pre-settled status ????

The Home Office has been updating it message and modifying its pages since the beginning of the year. Up until December 2020 it was largely assumed that all EEA applications would be shut by December 31st. That did not happen.

Early in January it was clear that EEA Family Permits was a route that remained open (see this post), and therefore, as it has been said in recent weeks, it appears that EEA FP applications still continue to be an avenue for unmarried partners (and only unmarried partners, not for other extended family members). This includes, of course the ability to apply for the Settlement Scheme.

Zerubbabel wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 07, 2021 6:09 pm

3. I would also expect to see evidence which fully details yours and your family’s
circumstances. Your income, expenditure and evidence of your financial position which
would prove that without the financial support of your sponsor your essential living
needs could not be met.

I have shown major expenses of my brother especially driven by 2x special needs kids.

Could somebody suggest to me what to do in this case? 1.5yrs of proof isn't enough for them?

Your income, expenditure and evidence of your financial position -> They want to see the detail of his financial situation. It's not enough to show that you send him money.

Just to give you an example: my uncle sent to my brother £30'000 during the last few years. It's all documented. Can this be used by my uncle to sponsor my brother? Taken in isolation, no. Actually, my uncle is building a house back home and my brother manages the project for him. The money goes to pay the builders and buy building material. My brother works, owns his home and has comfortable earning. So he is not dependent despite the proof that he receives money from abroad.

So just money receipts alone are not enough. Your brother needs to show is full financial situation and where the money you send him fits. Does he work? How much does he earn? What are his expenses?... etc. You need to show them the full picture.

Thank you. Yes I understand what you are explaining. Thats the plan we will explain in detail the expenses and get documents/invoices etc to explain them that the need is genuine.

He works. His salary only covers 50% of his monthly expenses. hence I support.

Hi,

My sister was granted an EEA Family permit on the 15th December 2020 to join me in the UK. She arrived in the UK on the 26th January 2021.

She already has an appointment to apply to the pre-settle status.

I'd like to know which documents we should submit on the gov.uk site?

Thanks,