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Huge_Euge
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Using ISA for financial requirement?

Post by Huge_Euge » Tue Mar 31, 2020 6:16 pm

Hello,

We are about to apply for a spouse visa from the uk and we are relying on my husbands savings held in investments. A few months ago the plan was to liquidate part of the investment into cash, but now with the significant crash of the stock market that seems unfeasible as we will be losing catastrophic amounts of money on selling shares. However he does hold the needed amount in stocks and shares ISA which seems to be listed as suitable on the official guidance. However I've come across too many refusals after using funds in an ISA to be comfortable with just going with it. I was hoping that someone could give me some advice on whether this might be ok in our situation?

So more details about the ISA: it is a certified wealth management organisation, which is not a brokerage but the difference in definitions between the two seems to be too subtle? The person managing the investments is happy to write a report for Home Office confirming all the details about the account and how easily the funds can be withdrawn if required. He is also confident that the account fully complies with all the points listed on the guidance.

An immigration lawyer I've spoken to advised against using an ISA because applications are sometimes refused on the grounds of the funds not being immediately accessible. Could someone please clarify what exactly 'immediately accessible' means? With the ISA 18k is held in cash and the rest is stocks and shares, but even the value of stocks and shares and be in my husbands bank account within 1-2 business days if we need it, and the guidance clearly says that the money doesn't have to be in cash ('The savings are held in cash (or their cash value is clear').

It's mind boggling how close I thought we were to applying and getting the visa, and yet it seems so far this at this point and I am so confused and stressed out that any information would be incredibly useful

Thank you in advance!

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seagul
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Re: Using ISA for financial requirement?

Post by seagul » Tue Mar 31, 2020 7:15 pm

If you are earning income from investment, shares etc then can consider them to come under none-employment income. For this purpose you should refer to the section 6 of Appendix FM 1.7 guidance.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

Huge_Euge
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Post by Huge_Euge » Tue Mar 31, 2020 7:21 pm

seagul wrote:
Tue Mar 31, 2020 7:15 pm
If you are earning income from investment, shares etc then can consider them to come under none-employment income. For this purpose you should refer to the section 6 of Appendix FM 1.7 guidance.
Thank you for your response. I am aware of the non-employment income side of this topic. It's probably my mistake, as I might have not made it clear in the question, but we are hoping to use the ISA as category D Savings to cover the shortfall of our employment income.

Huge_Euge
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Re: Using ISA for financial requirement?

Post by Huge_Euge » Wed Apr 01, 2020 4:14 pm

Anyone else has any info on this?

Huge_Euge
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Cash savings from Investment

Post by Huge_Euge » Fri Aug 21, 2020 6:00 pm

Hello everyone.

Is anyone experienced with cash savings taken from investments? I am so terribly confused and can’t find any information that makes sense.

We have been given wrong immigration advice a few months ago and now urgently have to top up out cash savings in the bank with liquidated cash from investment portfolio or from cash ISA.

I am, however, really confused about the 6 month requirement in relation to investments. The guidance states that it is acceptable for the funds to be held as investments for part of the 6 month period. However I am not sure whether that means that the funds have to be held as a specific and easily traceable investment (like stocks in one company purchased over 6 months ago) or does that just mean that it can’t be from new funds injected into the portfolio less that the required time period ago, or a newly opened investment account?

This portfolio I am talking about has been opened more than 4 years ago and there hasn’t been any new cash injections at all, so absolutely everything in it has been rotating for years. So is any type of liquidation from it acceptable, or do we need to track down specific stocks which have been bought more than 6 months ago and only sell them for the visa purpose?

Thank you so much in advance for any type of advice!

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seagul
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Re: Cash savings from Investment

Post by seagul » Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:52 pm

Huge_Euge wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 6:00 pm
. However I am not sure whether that means that the funds have to be held as a specific and easily traceable investment (like stocks in one company purchased over 6 months ago) or does that just mean that it can’t be from new funds injected into the portfolio less that the required time period ago, or a newly opened investment account?
Under paragraph 11A(c) funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or
both jointly at the date of application can have been transferred from investments
(including funds liquidated from a pension pot), stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds
within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
• the funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant,
their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application
• the ownership of the funds in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or
trust funds; the cash value of the funds in that form at or before the beginning
of the period of 6 months prior to the date of application; and the transfer of the
funds into cash, are evidenced by a portfolio report or other relevant
documentation from a financial institution regulated by the appropriate
regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating

• the requirements of Appendix FM-SE in respect of the cash savings held at the
date of application are met, except that the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application in paragraph 11(a) will be reduced by the amount of that period
in which the relevant funds were held in the form of investments, stocks,
shares, bonds or trust funds
• for the purposes of sub-paragraph 11A(c), ‘investments’ includes funds held in
an investment account which does not meet the requirements of paragraphs
11 and 11A(a)
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

Huge_Euge
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Posts: 13
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Re: Cash savings from Investment

Post by Huge_Euge » Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:15 pm

seagul wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:52 pm
Huge_Euge wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 6:00 pm
. However I am not sure whether that means that the funds have to be held as a specific and easily traceable investment (like stocks in one company purchased over 6 months ago) or does that just mean that it can’t be from new funds injected into the portfolio less that the required time period ago, or a newly opened investment account?
Under paragraph 11A(c) funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or
both jointly at the date of application can have been transferred from investments
(including funds liquidated from a pension pot), stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds
within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
• the funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant,
their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application
• the ownership of the funds in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or
trust funds; the cash value of the funds in that form at or before the beginning
of the period of 6 months prior to the date of application; and the transfer of the
funds into cash, are evidenced by a portfolio report or other relevant
documentation from a financial institution regulated by the appropriate
regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating

• the requirements of Appendix FM-SE in respect of the cash savings held at the
date of application are met, except that the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application in paragraph 11(a) will be reduced by the amount of that period
in which the relevant funds were held in the form of investments, stocks,
shares, bonds or trust funds
• for the purposes of sub-paragraph 11A(c), ‘investments’ includes funds held in
an investment account which does not meet the requirements of paragraphs
11 and 11A(a)
Thanks for your response! I have read the guidance over and over again, but still can’t understand whether it means that a particular asset has to be in ownership for 6 months or part of six months period or if it means actual value of asset(s)?

For example: my we have the required funds in a cash ISA, which we can withdraw to a bank account without any losses. However the funds have been held in that particular account only from July. It was not a new cash deposit however, rather it was taken from sales of stocks and shares and from portfolio income. So technically the funds have always been in the same investment portfolio, but not in the same place. Could this count towards cash savings if deposited into a bank account or not?

Huge_Euge
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Re: Cash savings from Investment

Post by Huge_Euge » Fri Aug 21, 2020 10:44 pm

More simplified, is it the total sum of funds held as an investment over the 12 month period that matters, or specific stocks/shares which are being sold for cash(or funds held in a specific isa account as a part of a larger investment)?

Manugmedia
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Re: Cash savings from Investment

Post by Manugmedia » Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:15 am

Huge_Euge wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 8:15 pm
seagul wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 7:52 pm
Huge_Euge wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 6:00 pm
. However I am not sure whether that means that the funds have to be held as a specific and easily traceable investment (like stocks in one company purchased over 6 months ago) or does that just mean that it can’t be from new funds injected into the portfolio less that the required time period ago, or a newly opened investment account?
Under paragraph 11A(c) funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or
both jointly at the date of application can have been transferred from investments
(including funds liquidated from a pension pot), stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds
within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
• the funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant,
their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application
• the ownership of the funds in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or
trust funds; the cash value of the funds in that form at or before the beginning
of the period of 6 months prior to the date of application; and the transfer of the
funds into cash, are evidenced by a portfolio report or other relevant
documentation from a financial institution regulated by the appropriate
regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating

• the requirements of Appendix FM-SE in respect of the cash savings held at the
date of application are met, except that the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application in paragraph 11(a) will be reduced by the amount of that period
in which the relevant funds were held in the form of investments, stocks,
shares, bonds or trust funds
• for the purposes of sub-paragraph 11A(c), ‘investments’ includes funds held in
an investment account which does not meet the requirements of paragraphs
11 and 11A(a)
Thanks for your response! I have read the guidance over and over again, but still can’t understand whether it means that a particular asset has to be in ownership for 6 months or part of six months period or if it means actual value of asset(s)?

For example: my we have the required funds in a cash ISA, which we can withdraw to a bank account without any losses. However the funds have been held in that particular account only from July. It was not a new cash deposit however, rather it was taken from sales of stocks and shares and from portfolio income. So technically the funds have always been in the same investment portfolio, but not in the same place. Could this count towards cash savings if deposited into a bank account or not?
within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
the funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant,
their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date
of application

You would have to provide an audit trial of any cash savings that you use on the application

Huge_Euge
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Posts: 13
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Russia

Spouse visa cash savings question (Brokerage)

Post by Huge_Euge » Mon Oct 12, 2020 10:24 pm

Hello,

I am aware that brokerage accounts don’t qualify under Category D: cash savings. I am finding it unclear in the guidance however, whether cash savings liquidated from a brokerage account can qualify as cash savings if they’ve only been held as cash in a bank account for part of a 6 month period? The funds have previously been held as stocks and shares within a wealth management company for years, which I am being told qualified as brokerage. They were held in my husbands name and he can technically control what is being done to the funds and how they are invested if he chooses to, and can liquidate any sums whenever he wishes with a slight delay.
Under paragraph 11A(c) funds held as cash savings by the applicant, their partner or both jointly at the date of application can have been transferred from investments (including funds liquidated from a pension pot), stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds within the period of 6 months prior to the date of application, provided that:
• the funds have been in the ownership and under the control of the applicant, their partner or both jointly for at least the period of 6 months prior to the date of application
• the ownership of the funds in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds; the cash value of the funds in that form at or before the beginning of the period of 6 months prior to the date of application; and the transfer of the funds into cash, are evidenced by a portfolio report or other relevant documentation from a financial institution regulated by the appropriate regulatory body for the country in which that institution is operating
• the requirements of Appendix FM-SE in respect of the cash savings held at the date of application are met, except that the period of 6 months prior to the date of application in paragraph 11(a) will be reduced by the amount of that period in which the relevant funds were held in the form of investments, stocks, shares, bonds or trust funds
• for the purposes of sub-paragraph 11A(c), ‘investments’ includes funds held in an investment account which does not meet the requirements of paragraphs 11 and 11A(a)
In our case, I don’t understand whether the guidance should be read as “savings from investment account which doesn’t meet the requirements can be liquidated into cash 6 months in advance” or “savings from account which doesn’t meet the requirements can be liquidated and held As cash for a part of 6 months period and at the time of application” ? Please help!

Huge_Euge
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Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:28 pm
Russia

Re: Spouse visa cash savings question (Brokerage)

Post by Huge_Euge » Tue Oct 13, 2020 10:31 am

Has anyone had any experience with this?

Huge_Euge
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Questions about the online application form

Post by Huge_Euge » Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:04 pm

Hello,

I'm about to submit my application and just wanted to confirm some questions I had about the form. I'm applying from within the UK as a married partner and my current expiring visa is Tier 4. I was hoping to get some advise on the form and the application in general.

1. Time lived in the UK Does this mean all the time I've lived in the UK, or just in my last stay? Because my total would be about 7 years with all the studying I've done, but it wasn't continuous as I've moved back to my home country for about 2 years. So basically my immigration history is 5 years in the Uk, 2 years away and another 2 years in the UK. Which number is best to put in as an answer to this question?

2. What amount of savings are held in this account in GBP? We are relying on savings as part of meeting the financial requirement. The funds have been held continuously for 6 months, but the account has received interest over the months, so there is slight fluctuation. I understand that the lowest balance in the period is counted towards the financial requirement, so should I put in the lowest balance that will be considered, or the balance from the most recent statement (which is insignificantly higher).

3. What is their annual income before tax for this employment in GBP (£)? Similar to the previous question. As I understand, if you have been furloughed due to COVID lockdown, 100% of your salary would be counted towards the financial requirement rather than 80%. This has been the case with us, so in this line should I put in the 6 months gross salary with 100% furlough or 80% percent and make a note in the cover letter that I have been furloughed for 3 months?

4. And finally, a question about the bank statements that need to be provided. We currently have Barclays Bank statements downloaded from online banking portal, but I am not sure if those are sufficient. Barclays branches refuse to print any statements or stamp any existing ones due to cover restrictions, and their self service machines don't print statements that are older than 2 months. Now, we have also ordered paper statements to arrive by mail, but they will take quite some time to arrive. So after the online application is submitted is it best to wait for the paper ones to arrive by post before uploading the supporting documentation, or will the online banking pdfs be sufficient?

Thank you so much in advance!

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seagul
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Re: Questions about the online application form

Post by seagul » Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:05 pm

Huge_Euge wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 6:04 pm
Hello,

I'm about to submit my application and just wanted to confirm some questions I had about the form. I'm applying from within the UK as a married partner and my current expiring visa is Tier 4. I was hoping to get some advise on the form and the application in general.

1. Time lived in the UK Does this mean all the time I've lived in the UK, or just in my last stay? Because my total would be about 7 years with all the studying I've done, but it wasn't continuous as I've moved back to my home country for about 2 years. So basically my immigration history is 5 years in the Uk, 2 years away and another 2 years in the UK. Which number is best to put in as an answer to this question?

2. What amount of savings are held in this account in GBP? We are relying on savings as part of meeting the financial requirement. The funds have been held continuously for 6 months, but the account has received interest over the months, so there is slight fluctuation. I understand that the lowest balance in the period is counted towards the financial requirement, so should I put in the lowest balance that will be considered, or the balance from the most recent statement (which is insignificantly higher).

3. What is their annual income before tax for this employment in GBP (£)? Similar to the previous question. As I understand, if you have been furloughed due to COVID lockdown, 100% of your salary would be counted towards the financial requirement rather than 80%. This has been the case with us, so in this line should I put in the 6 months gross salary with 100% furlough or 80% percent and make a note in the cover letter that I have been furloughed for 3 months?

4. And finally, a question about the bank statements that need to be provided. We currently have Barclays Bank statements downloaded from online banking portal, but I am not sure if those are sufficient. Barclays branches refuse to print any statements or stamp any existing ones due to cover restrictions, and their self service machines don't print statements that are older than 2 months. Now, we have also ordered paper statements to arrive by mail, but they will take quite some time to arrive. So after the online application is submitted is it best to wait for the paper ones to arrive by post before uploading the supporting documentation, or will the online banking pdfs be sufficient?

Thank you so much in advance!

1. 5 years
2. Give the latest closing balance whilst indicate the lowest balance figure in the covering letter.
3. Give the exact figure given by your employer in employer letter and refresh the caseworker's knowledge to consider 100% in same covering letter.
4. If the online bank statements resembles with postal statements and aren't marked as 'online' then straight can be uploaded without any stamp or waiting for the ones in transit. Keep it instilled that only apply once you get everything in hand because the documents especially financial ones are time sensitive which shouldn't be older than 28 days or be post dated from the date of application.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

sam550
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Re: Questions about the online application form

Post by sam550 » Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:49 pm

Barclays online bank statement which you can download from App or website are fine as they resemble the original you get in post, also I’ve used the same pdf formate from website for my visa and had no issues.

Huge_Euge
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Russia

Re: Questions about the online application form

Post by Huge_Euge » Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:47 pm

seagul wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:05 pm


1. 5 years
2. Give the latest closing balance whilst indicate the lowest balance figure in the covering letter.
3. Give the exact figure given by your employer in employer letter and refresh the caseworker's knowledge to consider 100% in same covering letter.
4. If the online bank statements resembles with postal statements and aren't marked as 'online' then straight can be uploaded without any stamp or waiting for the ones in transit. Keep it instilled that only apply once you get everything in hand because the documents especially financial ones are time sensitive which shouldn't be older than 28 days or be post dated from the date of application.
Thanks a lot for your reply! Will make the changes now.

I'm confused about 5 years though? I've lived in the UK for 5 years since 2011, and then left for 2 years, and then have been back in the uk for 2? So in my understanding it can either be 7 or 2?

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seagul
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Re: Questions about the online application form

Post by seagul » Thu Nov 12, 2020 4:49 am

Huge_Euge wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 9:47 pm
seagul wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:05 pm


1. 5 years
2. Give the latest closing balance whilst indicate the lowest balance figure in the covering letter.
3. Give the exact figure given by your employer in employer letter and refresh the caseworker's knowledge to consider 100% in same covering letter.
4. If the online bank statements resembles with postal statements and aren't marked as 'online' then straight can be uploaded without any stamp or waiting for the ones in transit. Keep it instilled that only apply once you get everything in hand because the documents especially financial ones are time sensitive which shouldn't be older than 28 days or be post dated from the date of application.
Thanks a lot for your reply! Will make the changes now.

I'm confused about 5 years though? I've lived in the UK for 5 years since 2011, and then left for 2 years, and then have been back in the uk for 2? So in my understanding it can either be 7 or 2?
Yes you are right. Either (7 or 2) should be fine because authorities will have all record.
The opinion expressed as above is neither a professional advice nor contesting/competing to other member's opinion/advice.

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