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Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

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Vorona
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:18 pm

polarcub wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:52 am
What is your source on that amount? How do you know this?
Reports similar to the one above.

user77
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by user77 » Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:55 am

Hi,
very informative topic but not worth of going to courts unless you are waiting more than 3 years, we should wait more to see in coming months.
going to courts now a days is not ideal as well due to Covid-19, it may take around 6 months minimum and you never know in the mean time you get approval.

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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by carr_e » Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:40 pm

user77 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:55 am
Hi,
very informative topic but not worth of going to courts unless you are waiting more than 3 years, we should wait more to see in coming months.
going to courts now a days is not ideal as well due to Covid-19, it may take around 6 months minimum and you never know in the mean time you get approval.
Can you avoid expressing an opinion about going to courts and the value one should assign to the process. This thread is intended to collect objective information vs. subjective views and speculation.

Do you have an application yourself that your drawing from experience? I find people who actually have an application don't post comments like this.

carr_e
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by carr_e » Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:40 pm

user77 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:55 am
Hi,
very informative topic but not worth of going to courts unless you are waiting more than 3 years, we should wait more to see in coming months.
going to courts now a days is not ideal as well due to Covid-19, it may take around 6 months minimum and you never know in the mean time you get approval.
Can you avoid expressing an opinion about going to courts and the value one should assign to the process. This thread is intended to collect objective information vs. subjective views and speculation.

Do you have an application yourself that your drawing from experience? I find people who actually have an application don't post comments like this.

carr_e
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by carr_e » Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:40 pm

user77 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:55 am
Hi,
very informative topic but not worth of going to courts unless you are waiting more than 3 years, we should wait more to see in coming months.
going to courts now a days is not ideal as well due to Covid-19, it may take around 6 months minimum and you never know in the mean time you get approval.
Can you avoid expressing an opinion about going to courts and the value one should assign to the process. This thread is intended to collect objective information vs. subjective views and speculation.

Do you have an application yourself that your drawing from experience? I find people who actually have an application don't post comments like this.

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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Hussein Kubadi » Mon Jan 18, 2021 3:37 am

polarcub wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:55 am
Thank you so much for sharing your experience, it is very useful for others considering their options.

What steps did you take before you proceed to court to force a decision - did you request an FOI? Did your lawyer send a letter to threaten the department?

How much time did it take from the time you initiated court proceedings, to getting a decision from the courts? and when did you file your case with the High Court?

On the 1,500 - that's the total cost I assume, including the fee for bringing your case in front of the high court?
Hi dear,
When I hired a Lawyer first He asked all the letter I that received from citizenship office. After that He asked my all documents from Citizenship devision to just review my documents. And then my lawyer said I want to send the first letter to Citizenship office to just notify them from now on I am your Lawyer. He said it will cost €500 euro. I said okay I will pay that. After one month of sending that letter my lawyer said now I want another letter but this time more serious. The Citizenship did not respond so my lawyer Said I want send another warning letter if they didn’t respond. I will take your case to High Court but if We lose You have to pay €3000. If I win only pay €700 to the Barrister plus €800 my fees.
On the 9th of November 2020 my Lawyer took my case to high court. The judge said I will submit xxxxxxx files to Department of Justice to compel the Minster to make decision. The judge Txxxx gives us date until 4th of December 2020. Thankfully I received a phone call on the 3th of December from my Lawyer. He said Congratulation We win your case you have 30 days to send your GNIB 2 Passport photos Approval letter with €900 Euro. Thank you all.
Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 7:23 pm
polarcub wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:45 am
Hi

This post is for those who applied pre-pandemic and have been waiting an excess period of time in receiving a response on their citizenship application, and are looking at what options they have to bring a resolution to their application:
- What steps did you take to force the department to make a decision?
- Did you recently make a FOI request? (how long were you waiting)
- Have you hired a lawyer to to bring a Judicial Review against the Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service in order to compel the Department to make a decision in your case? (this is done by submitting a case before the High Courts)
- How much did that cost for you?

I will state that going via a TD will only get you a standard response from the minister. It's an option to try and cross out, but that doesn't force a decision.

Url for making an FOI: http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/Fre ... nformation
Hi Dear good evening.
I applied for Naturalization August 2018 after Six months, my Documents goes to Second stage. They said you are on good Character. We will Submit Your file to the minister to review and sign soon We will send your approval letter. I was very excited and I said they send Approval letter by end of 2019.
But they didn’t so I hired a Lawyer I paid €1500 My Lawyer bring my Case to Judicial review they submit to Immigration Service to Compel the Department to make a Decision the Department of Justice give me one month to review my all Documents after that they made a Decision and it was Positive. Thank you.

polarcub
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Mon Jan 18, 2021 3:49 am

Thank you So much what you wrote below is very good information for anyone considering what options they have to compel the department to make a decision. It's very sad that people who have paid an application fee have to endure legal and financial difficulties and stress to get a decision on the very application they paid for.

It seems that despite covid the courts are still hearing these cases, and going the legal route could cost your between c.1,500 - 3,500 (depending on whether you win or lose. The whole legal process seems to take just 4 weeks from initiation to get a decision. For those who really need their citizenship for work/personal reasons and have a case (and an FOI shows that the department is being negligible in moving your application forward in the process), the legal route may be worth it. Because it seems as though that even if you lose, it forces the department to make a decision via the courts.
Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 3:37 am
polarcub wrote:
Sat Jan 16, 2021 4:55 am
Thank you so much for sharing your experience, it is very useful for others considering their options.

What steps did you take before you proceed to court to force a decision - did you request an FOI? Did your lawyer send a letter to threaten the department?

How much time did it take from the time you initiated court proceedings, to getting a decision from the courts? and when did you file your case with the High Court?

On the 1,500 - that's the total cost I assume, including the fee for bringing your case in front of the high court?
Hi dear,
When I hired a Lawyer first He asked all the letter I that received from citizenship office. After that He asked my all documents from Citizenship devision to just review my documents. And then my lawyer said I want to send the first letter to Citizenship office to just notify them from now on I am your Lawyer. He said it will cost €500 euro. I said okay I will pay that. After one month of sending that letter my lawyer said now I want another letter but this time more serious. The Citizenship did not respond so my lawyer Said I want send another warning letter if they didn’t respond. I will take your case to High Court but if We lose You have to pay €3000. If I win only pay €700 to the Barrister plus €800 my fees.
On the 9th of November 2020 my Lawyer took my case to high court. The judge said I will submit xxxxxxx files to Department of Justice to compel the Minster to make decision. The judge xxxx gives us date until 4th of December 2020. Thankfully I received a phone call on the 3th of December from my Lawyer. He said Congratulation We win your case you have 30 days to send your GNIB 2 Passport photos Approval letter with €900 Euro. Thank you all.
Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Fri Jan 15, 2021 7:23 pm
polarcub wrote:
Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:45 am
Hi

This post is for those who applied pre-pandemic and have been waiting an excess period of time in receiving a response on their citizenship application, and are looking at what options they have to bring a resolution to their application:
- What steps did you take to force the department to make a decision?
- Did you recently make a FOI request? (how long were you waiting)
- Have you hired a lawyer to to bring a Judicial Review against the Irish Naturalisation and Immigration Service in order to compel the Department to make a decision in your case? (this is done by submitting a case before the High Courts)
- How much did that cost for you?

I will state that going via a TD will only get you a standard response from the minister. It's an option to try and cross out, but that doesn't force a decision.

Url for making an FOI: http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/Fre ... nformation
Hi Dear good evening.
I applied for Naturalization August 2018 after Six months, my Documents goes to Second stage. They said you are on good Character. We will Submit Your file to the minister to review and sign soon We will send your approval letter. I was very excited and I said they send Approval letter by end of 2019.
But they didn’t so I hired a Lawyer I paid €1500 My Lawyer bring my Case to Judicial review they submit to Immigration Service to Compel the Department to make a Decision the Department of Justice give me one month to review my all Documents after that they made a Decision and it was Positive. Thank you.

polarcub
Member
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by polarcub » Mon Jan 18, 2021 4:01 am

Do you know something we don't about waiting 3 years or more? does something happen at the 3 year mark? These sort of remarks about waiting for years, is something that we hear INIS bots make, not real applicants.

According to people sharing their stories Covid has not affected the Courts hearing their cases. The whole court process is taking 1 month right now, and then people get a decision. Why do you say 6 months? What source is behind this timeframe?

Please ensure that when sharing there is fact and accurate information behind what you state. Your post is all opinion and it does not help people. If you want to wait years, you're welcome to. There is no "we" in this.
user77 wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:55 am
Hi,
very informative topic but not worth of going to courts unless you are waiting more than 3 years, we should wait more to see in coming months.
going to courts now a days is not ideal as well due to Covid-19, it may take around 6 months minimum and you never know in the mean time you get approval.

user77
Newly Registered
Posts: 15
Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2021 12:33 am
Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by user77 » Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:35 am

Dear Polarcub and Carr_e

don't mind! i didn't mean to hurt someone's feeling just sharing my opinion, everyone have choice to take decision going to court or not and FYI i am waiting from 2018 as well.

Hussein Kubadi
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Hussein Kubadi » Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:51 am

Hi everyone today news.

Some 4,000 people applying for Irish citizenship can now complete their naturalisation process through a temporary system opened by the justice minister today.

A statutory declaration of loyalty can now be signed by applicants, to be witnessed by a designated official, which will replace the requirement to attend citizenship ceremonies which were suspended during Covid-19.

Concerns about the halted system, with its significant backlog of cases, had been raised, particularly by healthcare workers.

It is expected that 4,000 applicants currently waiting on naturalisation will have had an opportunity to gain citizenship by the end of March, the Department of Justice said.

Although more than 24,000 citizenship applications have been made, approximately 4,000 are ceremony-ready or in the final processing stages.

In-person citizenship ceremonies have been provisionally scheduled to return in December.

Minister Helen McEntee said: “The granting of Irish citizenship through naturalisation is a privilege and an honour which is recognised by the thousands of people who apply every year. I am pleased that we can now bring some certainty to the people whose applications have effectively been on hold during the pandemic.

“Approximately 4,000 applicants have not been able to receive a certificate of naturalisation due to the temporary suspension of citizenship ceremonies.

johnpromise01
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by johnpromise01 » Mon Jan 18, 2021 9:53 am

user77 wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:35 am
Dear Polarcub and Carr_e

don't mind! i didn't mean to hurt someone's feeling just sharing my opinion, everyone have choice to take decision going to court or not and FYI i am waiting from 2018 as well.
You did nurt anyone and no bossy here. You are entitled to your opinion. No one can shut anyone up for sharing his/her opinion. It's your right. Just ignore any critics after sharing your opinion. No one have the right to force anything on anyone.

johnpromise01
Member
Posts: 232
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by johnpromise01 » Mon Jan 18, 2021 9:54 am

Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:51 am
Hi everyone today news.

Some 4,000 people applying for Irish citizenship can now complete their naturalisation process through a temporary system opened by the justice minister today.

A statutory declaration of loyalty can now be signed by applicants, to be witnessed by a designated official, which will replace the requirement to attend citizenship ceremonies which were suspended during Covid-19.

Concerns about the halted system, with its significant backlog of cases, had been raised, particularly by healthcare workers.

It is expected that 4,000 applicants currently waiting on naturalisation will have had an opportunity to gain citizenship by the end of March, the Department of Justice said.

Although more than 24,000 citizenship applications have been made, approximately 4,000 are ceremony-ready or in the final processing stages.

In-person citizenship ceremonies have been provisionally scheduled to return in December.

Minister Helen McEntee said: “The granting of Irish citizenship through naturalisation is a privilege and an honour which is recognised by the thousands of people who apply every year. I am pleased that we can now bring some certainty to the people whose applications have effectively been on hold during the pandemic.

“Approximately 4,000 applicants have not been able to receive a certificate of naturalisation due to the temporary suspension of citizenship ceremonies.
Great news

Emu1990
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Emu1990 » Mon Jan 18, 2021 10:27 am

Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:51 am
Hi everyone today news.

Some 4,000 people applying for Irish citizenship can now complete their naturalisation process through a temporary system opened by the justice minister today.

A statutory declaration of loyalty can now be signed by applicants, to be witnessed by a designated official, which will replace the requirement to attend citizenship ceremonies which were suspended during Covid-19.

Concerns about the halted system, with its significant backlog of cases, had been raised, particularly by healthcare workers.

It is expected that 4,000 applicants currently waiting on naturalisation will have had an opportunity to gain citizenship by the end of March, the Department of Justice said.

Although more than 24,000 citizenship applications have been made, approximately 4,000 are ceremony-ready or in the final processing stages.

In-person citizenship ceremonies have been provisionally scheduled to return in December.

Minister Helen McEntee said: “The granting of Irish citizenship through naturalisation is a privilege and an honour which is recognised by the thousands of people who apply every year. I am pleased that we can now bring some certainty to the people whose applications have effectively been on hold during the pandemic.

“Approximately 4,000 applicants have not been able to receive a certificate of naturalisation due to the temporary suspension of citizenship ceremonies.

Still no news for new approvals . Nothing gonna change for the people who are waiting for more then 2-3 years..

user77
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by user77 » Tue Jan 19, 2021 1:14 pm

I believe i was addressing to polarcub and carr e .
Where did you come from?
johnpromise01 wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 9:53 am
user77 wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:35 am
Dear Polarcub and Carr_e

don't mind! i didn't mean to hurt someone's feeling just sharing my opinion, everyone have choice to take decision going to court or not and FYI i am waiting from 2018 as well.
You did nurt anyone and no bossy here. You are entitled to your opinion. No one can shut anyone up for sharing his/her opinion. It's your right. Just ignore any critics after sharing your opinion. No one have the right to force anything on anyone.

carr_e
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by carr_e » Wed Jan 20, 2021 1:35 pm

Emu1990 wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 10:27 am
Hussein Kubadi wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:51 am
Hi everyone today news.

Some 4,000 people applying for Irish citizenship can now complete their naturalisation process through a temporary system opened by the justice minister today.

A statutory declaration of loyalty can now be signed by applicants, to be witnessed by a designated official, which will replace the requirement to attend citizenship ceremonies which were suspended during Covid-19.

Concerns about the halted system, with its significant backlog of cases, had been raised, particularly by healthcare workers.

It is expected that 4,000 applicants currently waiting on naturalisation will have had an opportunity to gain citizenship by the end of March, the Department of Justice said.

Although more than 24,000 citizenship applications have been made, approximately 4,000 are ceremony-ready or in the final processing stages.

In-person citizenship ceremonies have been provisionally scheduled to return in December.

Minister Helen McEntee said: “The granting of Irish citizenship through naturalisation is a privilege and an honour which is recognised by the thousands of people who apply every year. I am pleased that we can now bring some certainty to the people whose applications have effectively been on hold during the pandemic.

“Approximately 4,000 applicants have not been able to receive a certificate of naturalisation due to the temporary suspension of citizenship ceremonies.

Still no news for new approvals . Nothing gonna change for the people who are waiting for more then 2-3 years..
Exactly, and your observation is exactly the key focus of this thread. Applicants want to know if they are going to be approved or not. Waiting 2-3 years for what the department guides should only take 12 months is inexcusable given the sheer lack of communication offered to applicants. This is why applicants choose the judicial review.

Shelter
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:24 pm

Hi guys ..can we request FOI by email ? Just wondering

Vorona
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:41 pm

Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:24 pm
Hi guys ..can we request FOI by email ? Just wondering
Yes.

Shelter
Junior Member
Posts: 65
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm

Vorona wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:41 pm
Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:24 pm
Hi guys ..can we request FOI by email ? Just wondering
Yes.
Thanks vorona and I just got email from citizenship department .it is hard to say that its a copy paste reply or real status of my application


Dear Sir

Thank you for your email.
Please note that your application for naturalisation have being submitted
to the Minister for a decision. If further documentation and/or
clarification of any matter related to your application is required from
you, we will write to you requesting it. Otherwise, you will receive a
letter in due course informing you of the Minister’s decision on your
application.

Regards

Citizenship Helpdesk
Team 4

alhakeem
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by alhakeem » Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:38 pm

Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm
Please note that your application for naturalisation have being submitted
to the Minister for a decision. If further documentation and/or
clarification of any matter related to your application is required from
you, we will write to you requesting it. Otherwise, you will receive a
letter in due course informing you of the Minister’s decision on your
application.
This is a positive resposne Shelter, and considering posts here this is not a copy paste response and most likely you will receive a decision in a few days, or at least in the next patch, hope all the best for you

Shelter
Junior Member
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:48 pm

alhakeem wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:38 pm
Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm
Please note that your application for naturalisation have being submitted
to the Minister for a decision. If further documentation and/or
clarification of any matter related to your application is required from
you, we will write to you requesting it. Otherwise, you will receive a
letter in due course informing you of the Minister’s decision on your
application.
This is a positive resposne Shelter, and considering posts here this is not a copy paste response and most likely you will receive a decision in a few days, or at least in the next patch, hope all the best for you


Thanks alhakeem..hopefully in the next patch..

Vorona
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Vorona » Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:54 pm

Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm
Thanks vorona and I just got email from citizenship department .it is hard to say that its a copy paste reply or real status of my application
I don't take these emails seriously and never emailed them about my application.
Official letters were coming through the door and it was enough for me.

Shelter
Junior Member
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 11:32 am
Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:01 pm

Vorona wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 3:54 pm
Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm
Thanks vorona and I just got email from citizenship department .it is hard to say that its a copy paste reply or real status of my application
I don't take these emails seriously and never emailed them about my application.
Official letters were coming through the door and it was enough for me.

To be honest..I dont take their email reply seriously .. I applied for FOI today ... hopefully I will get it FOI in a month or so ..

Stanina
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Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Stanina » Fri Jan 22, 2021 7:22 pm

alhakeem wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:38 pm
Shelter wrote:
Fri Jan 22, 2021 1:48 pm
Please note that your application for naturalisation have being submitted
to the Minister for a decision. If further documentation and/or
clarification of any matter related to your application is required from
you, we will write to you requesting it. Otherwise, you will receive a
letter in due course informing you of the Minister’s decision on your
application.
This is a positive resposne Shelter, and considering posts here this is not a copy paste response and most likely you will receive a decision in a few days, or at least in the next patch, hope all the best for you
My partner got the same in summer, still no approval till now :(

Shelter
Junior Member
Posts: 65
Joined: Sun May 24, 2020 11:32 am
Pakistan

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by Shelter » Mon Jan 25, 2021 1:59 pm

Hi guys I applied for FOI on Friday and I got ref number today ..and it takes 4 to 5 weeks ..and they say they might refuse my FOI record request ..

irishman003
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Ireland

Re: Citizenship delays: FOI and an application for an Order for Mandamus via the High Courts

Post by irishman003 » Mon Jan 25, 2021 2:00 pm

Shelter wrote:
Mon Jan 25, 2021 1:59 pm
Hi guys I applied for FOI on Friday and I got ref number today ..and it takes 4 to 5 weeks ..and they say they might refuse my FOI record request ..
Why they may refuse the request?

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