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Marcel3 Junior Member Member # 7171	Posted September 21, 2003 03:10 PM I have received an approval letter from HSMP team. My concern is if the British consulate overseas require any proof of my permanent status in the country from I applied to. I recently changed my passport and this passport has no visa stamps confirming my permanent status in Canada. Will the British consulate ask me for a proof of my permanent residence in Canada while stamping HSMP visa?
Londonite Junior Member Member # 7135	Posted September 21, 2003 10:49 PM Congratulations Marcel, Cheers - Londonite [ October 17, 2003: Message edited by: Londonite ]
oracle Member Member # 7151	Posted September 22, 2003 06:24 AM HI Marcel3, Congratulations, hows long your application processing took, i have am also from Canada, and had applied by end of July and still waiting for any answer, Thanks,
Kayalami Member Member # 5984	Posted September 22, 2003 08:56 AM Marcel, As you have noted the HSMP process is two stage for applicants not present in the UK. 1. Approval of HSMP by HSMP Team of Work Permits UK. 2. Obtaining Entry Clearance/ Visa at a British Diplomatic Post. A BDP is either an embassy, High Commission or Consulate. Most BDP's will only process applications from people who are legal long term residents (i.e. not visitors) of the country the BDP is located in. The legal part is always compulsory but the long term requirement is sometimes waived where one is applying for a visitor visa e.g. A Chinese national visiting Canada may apply for a UK visa in Canada - chances of success are slim but its acceptable. However applications in a category leading to settlement in the UK which the HSMP is are only accepted from non visitors. You must submit evidence of your legal and long term Canadian immigration status as part of the application to theBritish High Commission Ottawa. As a non Canadian Citizen you should submit either: 1 Proof of Permanent Residence - Record of Landing (IMM1000)/ Confirmation of Permanent Residence or your Permanent Resident Card (Maple Leaf) 2. Work Permit - Employment Authorization 3. Student - Student Authorization You must also submit all passports held in the last year (if you have held one) where you have a new/ non endorsed passport at the time of the HSMP application. Good Luck -------------------- ---audi alteram partem---
harris Junior Member Member # 436	Posted September 22, 2003 06:25 PM It is quite surprizing for me to understand why having obtained permanent residence in Canada people are trying for HSMP. Is the job situation worst in Canada worse than the UK? harris
harris Junior Member Member # 436	Posted September 22, 2003 06:26 PM It is quite surprizing for me to understand why having obtained permanent residence in Canada people are trying for HSMP. Is the job situation in Canada worse than the UK? harris
Kayalami Member Member # 5984	Posted September 22, 2003 06:39 PM Hope not to start a tirade from any Canucks but I have lived in both countries and a quick summary of my experience has been: The UK has - higher wages (1 GBP = 2.3 CAN), more job opportunities but conversely more job seekers, better employee rights including more holiday's and notice periods as well as reasonable tax rates. Oh yeah the banking system in the UK is understandably way ahead of the Canadian system - direct debit is in its early years there. If you are into your travel the UK offers cheap and easy access to any part of the world particularly Europe. However fuel Prices are horrendous in the UK and the cities especially London are much more dirty. Canada offers more for your money i.e. bigger house, cars, cheaper fuel etc but has shocking taxation levels - 50% on any income from savings which supports their excellent medical, education and welfare systems. Its employment market especially in the professions is a nightmare to get into due to outdated regulation, powerful unions and excessive bureacracy - there are 3 layers of government so getting things done takes time. It is also a relatively more safe country and of course there is the superb scenery. Weatherwise it puts the UK to shame in terms of how cold it can get . For travellers flights are astronomical - it can cost the same price to fly from Toronto to New York as it does Toronto to London (UK) - this is partly due to less competition (Air Canada more or less has the Canadian market sewed up) and the huge size of the country. Final comparison - Canucks are extremely friendly but presumably the Brits would be said to be more reserved. All in all it depends on one's circumstances and plans. Good Luck To All [ September 22, 2003: Message edited by: Kayalami ] -------------------- ---audi alteram partem---
Cosmopol Member Member # 7165	Posted October 06, 2003 07:06 PM Hi, Kayalami! Thanks again for the nice rundown on differences between life in CA and UK. A side question I had in my mind is: if someone with Canadian PR applies for HSMP and leaves for Briatin prior to obtaining Canadian citizenship, would they still be eligible to apply after their 3-year PR anniversary, provided they've spent enough time to satisfy the residence requirement. I.e., would the fact that they've applied for an immigrant-type UK visa jeopardize their becoming a Canadian citizen? Not that I intend to go there, just curious if you have knowledge of how these technicalities work in real life...
Kayalami Member Member # 5984	Posted October 07, 2003 12:45 PM Under the current Canadian Citizenship Act a Canadian PR can apply for citizenship after being resident in Canada for 3yrs in the last 4 yrs preceeding the application i.e. if you apply for citizenship this month Oct 2003 you must have been a Canadian PR resident in Canada for three years as of Oct 1999. Under the previous Immigration Act the residence was a matter of intent - although there was a system in place which presumed you had lost your PR status after being outside Canada for more than 183 days in any 12 month period many applicants were able to rebut it by showing various ties to Canada including bank accounts, payment of taxes, having family in Canada etc. You then got into situations where people were becoming Canadian citizens without hardly ever living in Canada because they successfully argued that they were resident all along. The new Immigration Act (IRPA) effective 28 June 2002 means this anomaly is no more as it clearly states the conditions to be met for PR status to be maintained. One must physically reside in Canada for 2 yrs in every 5 yr period. If you leave Canada this month Oct 2003 you can stay out until Oct 2006. You would then have to live in Canada till Oct 2011 to go back to a fresh 5 yr period. Since a pre-requisite of Canadian Citizenship is that you are a PR then it follows that one cannot obtain citizenship if they are outside Canada for 3yrs. However the government is proposing a new Citizenship Act that will require PR's to show 3yrs of actual physical residence in Canada out of the preceeding 6 yrs on the date of citizenship application. There are elections coming up next year, there is a matter of a national identity card, biometrics etc so I see this being in the back burner for some time and unlikely to come into effect before 2006. The Canadian government is not concerned about your HSMP visa or a PR visa of any another country for that matter - all it is concerned is that you meet the 2/5 yr requirement to maintain PR status. However note that in the long term it is impossible for one to be a PR of multiple countries indefinitley because of the difficulties in maintaining the residence requirements for each country. -------------------- ---audi alteram partem---
Cosmopol Member Member # 7165	Posted October 07, 2003 03:27 PM Kayalami -- thanks again for the wonderful insight. Some areas of the law are still unclear to me. On the official Canadian site one of the questions in the "are you eligible to become a citizen?" section is "Have you lived in Canada for at least three years?". Based on that, my interpretation of the rule would be "you have to spend 3 years in Canada as a PR out of preceding 4 years", NOT "you have to spend 3 years in Canada out of preceding 4 years since becoming a PR". In other words, as long as I have spent my first 3 years in as a PR, it doesn't even matter that 4 years ago I wasn't a PR or in Canada. I realize it may be a gray area, but if you have facts to the contrary, would love to know. Also, it's very true that most countries require at least just over 50% of time annually to be spent physically on their teritory to maintain an immigration status (and justly so, I guess). When I asked about the effect of having another country's imm. visa on becoming a Canadian citizen, I meant cases when a person starts the process of moving to another country not long before their expected citizenship date, so by the time they've spent 6 months elsewhere, it no longer matters for their PR status in Canada.
Kayalami Member Member # 5984	Posted October 07, 2003 05:23 PM Yes it is ANY 3 yrs as a PR over a 4 yr period not necessarily that from the date PR is acquired. Note that half of the time period in which you are legally in Canada immediatley before you attain PR can be added to the 3 yrs requirement up to a max of 1 yr i.e. say you are in Canada in 1999-2001 as a student then get PR in Jan 2002. You would normally have to wait till Jan 2005 before applying for citizenship. However one year of the two spent as a student will be considered as part of the 3 yrs residency and you can thus apply for PR in Jan 2004. The half of legal residence allocation to a max of 1 yr means that any time in Canada over two years is not considered so no chance of speedy citizenship for those in Canada for 6yrs then acquire PR INMHO your point about timings for immigration visas for country A vis a vis citizenship application for country B depends on so many factors such as the relevant application times, the procedures that must be followed etc. For example I have friends who have had their oath appointment letters for Can and US citizenship sent to their old address which they then missed after relocating to the UK etc. You also get fingerprints no longer be valid and a fresh set being required or a background check taking yrs to process. One must also consider whether the country in question only expects the person to meet PR status on the date of application or up to the point of citizenship award e.g. UK you only need to meet the residence requirements on the date of citizenship application. After this you can travel outside the UK as long as you maintain PR without your application being affected - I could go on and on with different scenarios but I more happy with specifics. Cheers. [ October 07, 2003: Message edited by: Kayalami ] -------------------- ---audi alteram partem---
Cosmopol Member Member # 7165	Posted October 08, 2003 01:35 AM Hi ! As always, a great insight... Personally, I am not ahywhere near those choices, so a general idea is enough to satisfy my curiosity Thanks!
Cosmopol Member Member # 7165	Posted October 08, 2003 05:22 AM quote: Originally posted by Kayalami: For example I have friends who have had their oath appointment letters for Can and US citizenship sent to their old address which they then missed after relocating to the UK etc. [ October 07, 2003: Message edited by: Kayalami ] Here is another question, though: if you have friends who prefered moving to UK from US, even though they had permanent status there, would you be able to relay what factors motivated them to move? You gave a nice comparison with Canada, but US may be a tougher one to leave behind... although who knows. That's somewhat my situation: I am currently in the US, and thinking if I might be happier overall in the UK. Any thouthts, info, experience, insight is appreciated!
Kayalami Member Member # 5984	Posted October 17, 2003 10:01 AM They all had varied reasons for moving ranging from marriage, being transferred to the UK, wanting a better quality of life or just wanting to experience a different lifestyle. However my Canadian friends often comment on how much more the pay is in the UK(exchange rate driven) here and the taxes lower. Those from the US find it safer, more historic/ cultural and often comment on the Health Service which is free but can be frustrating when you get placed on the lengthy waiting lists. I have visited the US often but haven't lived there so can't make a like for like comparison with the UK. In any case tourism results in a rather glossy view of life anywhere which changes when faced with the daily chores of long term residence -------------------- ---audi alteram partem---
Cosmopol Member Member # 7165	Posted October 17, 2003 03:35 PM Thanks, Kayalami !!!!! quote: Originally posted by Kayalami: I have visited the US often but haven't lived there so can't make a like for like comparison with the UK. In any case tourism results in a rather glossy view of life anywhere which changes when faced with the daily chores of long term residence Agree with you 100%! That's why one just can't rely on any tourist publications about potential countries of choice. I looked for books on countries written by expats, but found very few. >> If you ever think of one, will appreciate a recommendation. << Also, I found that in a country with a rich social and economic "fabric", the view keeps evolving as one lives on. Cheers! [ October 17, 2003: Message edited by: Cosmopol ]