Got married abroad while separated in Ireland

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Wed May 23, 2018 2:11 am

Hi guys, i am fairly new on this board not sure if someone has ever in that situation.basically i am an irish citizen who recently got divorced in Ireland but while my divorce wasn't issued , i got married in pakistan. Is there anyone who could have had the same experience?
i would like to bring my spouse over but i am not sure if Irish law accepts my recent marriage in Pakistan. Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks

Casa · Post by **Casa** » Wed May 23, 2018 1:05 pm

jetthorse8181 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:11 am
Hi guys, i am fairly new on this board not sure if someone has ever in that situation.basically i am an irish citizen who recently got divorced in Ireland but while my divorce wasn't issued , i got married in pakistan. Is there anyone who could have had the same experience?
i would like to bring my spouse over but i am not sure if Irish law accepts my recent marriage in Pakistan. Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks

Your marriage in Pakistan won't be legally recognised.

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Wed May 23, 2018 1:30 pm

Casa wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 1:05 pm

jetthorse8181 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:11 am
Hi guys, i am fairly new on this board not sure if someone has ever in that situation.basically i am an irish citizen who recently got divorced in Ireland but while my divorce wasn't issued , i got married in pakistan. Is there anyone who could have had the same experience?
i would like to bring my spouse over but i am not sure if Irish law accepts my recent marriage in Pakistan. Any help would be really appreciated. Thanks
Your marriage in Pakistan won't be legally recognised.

thanks for replying
any idea what should i do now? i want her to join me here, but if the state doesn't recognise my marriage then its gonna be difficult.

Fanikhan15 · Post by **Fanikhan15** » Wed May 23, 2018 2:03 pm

When did u get married and what date you divorced

broli · Post by **broli** » Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm

re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea

then it will be valid

Paddy_Leprechaun · Post by **Paddy_Leprechaun** » Wed May 23, 2018 3:07 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm
re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea then it will be valid

Even if you "re-marry" , there might be complications if your residence in Ireland was sponsored as a spouse of Irish/EU national. Section 20.1 of family reunification for non EEA members

"A sponsor who is joined by a spouse/partner in Ireland will, in the event
of the termination of the marriage or civil partnership (by divorce or
dissolution), be ineligible to be joined by a further spouse or partner until
a minimum 7 years have elapsed from the date of the first spousal
permission. This 7 year waiting period will also be applied where the
sponsor was him/herself granted permission to reside in Ireland as the
non-EEA spouse/partner of an EU national exercising their rights of free
movement. Where there are reasonable grounds to suggest that the
earlier marriage or partnership was one of convenience further
permissions may be refused even where the periods set out above have
been exceeded. "

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Wed May 23, 2018 10:27 pm

Fanikhan15 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:03 pm
When did u get married and what date you divorced

i got married in jan 2018 and divorced march 2018 here in ireland.

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Wed May 23, 2018 10:31 pm

Paddy_Leprechaun wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 3:07 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm
re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea then it will be valid
Even if you "re-marry" , there might be complications if your residence in Ireland was sponsored as a spouse of Irish/EU national. Section 20.1 of family reunification for non EEA members

"A sponsor who is joined by a spouse/partner in Ireland will, in the event
of the termination of the marriage or civil partnership (by divorce or
dissolution), be ineligible to be joined by a further spouse or partner until
a minimum 7 years have elapsed from the date of the first spousal
permission. This 7 year waiting period will also be applied where the
sponsor was him/herself granted permission to reside in Ireland as the
non-EEA spouse/partner of an EU national exercising their rights of free
movement. Where there are reasonable grounds to suggest that the
earlier marriage or partnership was one of convenience further
permissions may be refused even where the periods set out above have
been exceeded. "

sorry i didn't get your point.

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Wed May 23, 2018 10:36 pm

jetthorse8181 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 10:27 pm

Fanikhan15 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:03 pm
When did u get married and what date you divorced
i got married in pakistan in jan 2018 to my 2nd wife and divorced in march 2018 here in Ireland from my 1st wife.

Paddy_Leprechaun · Post by **Paddy_Leprechaun** » Wed May 23, 2018 10:45 pm

jetthorse8181 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 10:31 pm

Paddy_Leprechaun wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 3:07 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm
re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea then it will be valid
Even if you "re-marry" , there might be complications if your residence in Ireland was sponsored as a spouse of Irish/EU national. Section 20.1 of family reunification for non EEA members

"A sponsor who is joined by a spouse/partner in Ireland will, in the event
of the termination of the marriage or civil partnership (by divorce or
dissolution), be ineligible to be joined by a further spouse or partner until
a minimum 7 years have elapsed from the date of the first spousal
permission. This 7 year waiting period will also be applied where the
sponsor was him/herself granted permission to reside in Ireland as the
non-EEA spouse/partner of an EU national exercising their rights of free
movement. Where there are reasonable grounds to suggest that the
earlier marriage or partnership was one of convenience further
permissions may be refused even where the periods set out above have
been exceeded. "
sorry i didn't get your point.

Please have a look at the policy document published by INIS for non-EU family reunification, it is accessible online at: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%2 ... cument.pdf

The section 20 in the document is relevant to your case, which says that if a person got his/her residence in Ireland based on he/she being spouse of Irish/EU national, he/she is not allowed to sponsor another spouse for a period of 7 years. So if you got your residence permit in Ireland based on your ex-spouse you won't be allowed to sponsor your next spouse for a period of 7 years from the date of separation. However, if you had your residence in Ireland based on your work permit or some other rights then you can sponsor. The document also talks about overlapping cases (polygamy).

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Thu May 24, 2018 1:36 am

Please have a look at the policy document published by INIS for non-EU family reunification, it is accessible online at: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%2 ... cument.pdf

The section 20 in the document is relevant to your case, which says that if a person got his/her residence in Ireland based on he/she being spouse of Irish/EU national, he/she is not allowed to sponsor another spouse for a period of 7 years. So if you got your residence permit in Ireland based on your ex-spouse you won't be allowed to sponsor your next spouse for a period of 7 years from the date of separation. However, if you had your residence in Ireland based on your work permit or some other rights then you can sponsor. The document also talks about overlapping cases (polygamy).
[/quote]

sorry i am not trying to be arrogant but i don't get it, does it mean if a person who has obtains an Irish citizenship by marrying irish/Eu spouse and then gets divorce but has to wait 7yrs before he/she could apply for their new spouse? whereas a divorcee,Irish national by birth doesn't have to wait 7 yrs to bring their spouse from Thailand or some other country?? Im sorry but this is a clear discrimination against Irish nationals who obtain citizenship through naturalisation.

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Thu May 24, 2018 1:38 am

Paddy_Leprechaun wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 10:45 pm

jetthorse8181 wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 10:31 pm

Paddy_Leprechaun wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 3:07 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm
re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea then it will be valid
Even if you "re-marry" , there might be complications if your residence in Ireland was sponsored as a spouse of Irish/EU national. Section 20.1 of family reunification for non EEA members

"A sponsor who is joined by a spouse/partner in Ireland will, in the event
of the termination of the marriage or civil partnership (by divorce or
dissolution), be ineligible to be joined by a further spouse or partner until
a minimum 7 years have elapsed from the date of the first spousal
permission. This 7 year waiting period will also be applied where the
sponsor was him/herself granted permission to reside in Ireland as the
non-EEA spouse/partner of an EU national exercising their rights of free
movement. Where there are reasonable grounds to suggest that the
earlier marriage or partnership was one of convenience further
permissions may be refused even where the periods set out above have
been exceeded. "
sorry i didn't get your point.
Please have a look at the policy document published by INIS for non-EU family reunification, it is accessible online at: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Family%2 ... cument.pdf

The section 20 in the document is relevant to your case, which says that if a person got his/her residence in Ireland based on he/she being spouse of Irish/EU national, he/she is not allowed to sponsor another spouse for a period of 7 years. So if you got your residence permit in Ireland based on your ex-spouse you won't be allowed to sponsor your next spouse for a period of 7 years from the date of separation. However, if you had your residence in Ireland based on your work permit or some other rights then you can sponsor. The document also talks about overlapping cases (polygamy).

sorry i am not trying to be arrogant but i don't get it, does it mean if a person who has obtains an Irish citizenship by marrying irish/Eu spouse and then gets divorce but has to wait 7yrs before he/she could apply for their new spouse? whereas a divorcee,Irish national by birth doesn't have to wait 7 yrs to bring their spouse from Thailand or some other country?? Im sorry but this is a clear discrimination against Irish nationals who obtain citizenship through naturalisation.

Paddy_Leprechaun · Post by **Paddy_Leprechaun** » Thu May 24, 2018 9:05 am

I am afraid that might be the case as per this policy. But again none of us here at the forum is a solicitor or taking decisions on behalf of INIS. All we can do is to gather maximum information and be prepared through this community forum. Try a good solicitor and be prepared that you have to prove that none of your marriages were of convenience.
On your point on discrimination, I assume it applies to Irish born as well, lets say if an Irish sponsors his wife from Thailand, he won't be allowed to bring another spouse from Vietnam for a period of 7 years. Even if as a naturalised citizen your residence in Ireland was not based on your ex-wife then you don't need to worry about this 7 year rule.
Wish you all the best and hope you manage to bring your family in Ireland.

Mal111 · Post by **Mal111** » Thu May 24, 2018 9:19 am

paddy leprechaun is correct on this

broli · Post by **broli** » Thu May 24, 2018 9:53 am

@jetthorse8181

how is it even possible to get divorce before 7 years when divorce is actually 4 years waiting time in the country .

Did you get divorce elsewhere in the EU ?

How long did you previous marriage last before separation ?

broli · Post by **broli** » Thu May 24, 2018 9:58 am

Paddy_Leprechaun wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 3:07 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Wed May 23, 2018 2:47 pm
re-marry your PK wife if you are now fully divorced just an idea then it will be valid
Even if you "re-marry" , there might be complications if your residence in Ireland was sponsored as a spouse of Irish/EU national. Section 20.1 of family reunification for non EEA members

"A sponsor who is joined by a spouse/partner in Ireland will, in the event
of the termination of the marriage or civil partnership (by divorce or
dissolution), be ineligible to be joined by a further spouse or partner until
a minimum 7 years have elapsed from the date of the first spousal
permission. This 7 year waiting period will also be applied where the
sponsor was him/herself granted permission to reside in Ireland as the
non-EEA spouse/partner of an EU national exercising their rights of free
movement. Where there are reasonable grounds to suggest that the
earlier marriage or partnership was one of convenience further
permissions may be refused even where the periods set out above have
been exceeded. "

Does this rules follows you even if you relocated in another EU country ? i mean is the rules also applied by other EU countries ?

Paddy_Leprechaun · Post by **Paddy_Leprechaun** » Thu May 24, 2018 10:08 am

Does this rules follows you even if you relocated in another EU country ? i mean is the rules also applied by other EU countries ?
[/quote]

I don't know. I just copied this text from Irish policy document for non-eu family reunification. Perhaps every country have their own rules set for such purposes.

jetthorse8181 · Post by **jetthorse8181** » Thu May 24, 2018 1:35 pm

broli wrote: ↑
Thu May 24, 2018 9:53 am
@jetthorse8181

how is it even possible to get divorce before 7 years when divorce is actually 4 years waiting time in the country .

Did you get divorce elsewhere in the EU ?

How long did you previous marriage last before separation ?

i was married for 12 years.

broli · Post by **broli** » Thu May 24, 2018 2:05 pm

then the marriage duration is good only you have to follow the 7 years rules if she have to come to ireland .

Another EU country would have been ok.

Paddy_Leprechaun · Post by **Paddy_Leprechaun** » Thu May 24, 2018 4:04 pm

@jetthorse8181

If you were married for 12 years then it won't be an issue, as the 7 year rule applies from the date of first spousal permission not the date of separation. You might be grand here. For the overlap period between separation and next marriage, you can claim it as a defacto relation. Good luck with your application.

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