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Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Only for UK Student Visas, formerly known as Tier 4 (General) student visa

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tanz.88
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Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by tanz.88 » Fri Jan 13, 2023 2:32 pm

Hi, I currently have a Tier4 general student visa and am planning to apply for a Graduate visa in January. However, due to family situation I need to go back home (Pakistan).
Is it possible to apply for Graduate visa and leave UK such that visa arrives at the address provided? I am currently in Pakistan and will be travelling to UK in January.

Regards

AmazonianX
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by AmazonianX » Fri Jan 13, 2023 2:52 pm

Previous posts indicated you got ILR years ago.

tanz.88
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by tanz.88 » Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:27 pm

Apologies, should have prefaced the question that this is for a friend who is too shy to ask question on this forum and I offered to help since I already had an account on this forum.

Appreciate any guidance on the original question. Thanks

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CR001
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by CR001 » Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:30 pm

They cannot leave the uk if they have a pending application with ukvi. The application will be considered withdrawn if they do and they lose the fee paid.
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tanz.88
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by tanz.88 » Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:38 pm

This https://www.gov.uk/graduate-visa states:

Getting a decision
Once you’ve applied online, proved your identity and provided your documents, you’ll usually get a decision on your visa within 8 weeks.

You can stay in the UK while you wait for a decision.

We thought "can" mean, my friend can decide to not stay here and go back. Based on above comment, think that is wrong understanding then?

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CR001
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by CR001 » Fri Jan 13, 2023 6:51 pm

Your understanding is wrong.

Can stay in this sense means if previous visa has expired, you can stay while you wait for a decision.
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sah10406
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by sah10406 » Sat Jan 14, 2023 11:09 am

They do have an additional option if their Student visa remains valid beyond the dates of the proposed travel.

As advised above, travelling outside the Common Travel Area will withdraw the pending Graduate application. However if the applicant can still travel and return to the UK before the expiry of their Student visa, they can return to the UK on that visa and apply again under the Graduate route. It's a new application with a new fee and new IHS. The fees paid for the previous withdrawn application cannot be offset against the fees for the new application, but they will be eventually refunded.

Before you ask, there is no other workaround, no way to juggle the two different statuses for a different outcome.
I do not give immigration advice. I refer you to Immigration Rules, guidance, other online content and to your sponsor.

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Ticktack
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by Ticktack » Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:24 pm

sah10406 wrote:
Sat Jan 14, 2023 11:09 am
They do have an additional option if their Student visa remains valid beyond the dates of the proposed travel.

As advised above, travelling outside the Common Travel Area will withdraw the pending Graduate application. However if the applicant can still travel and return to the UK before the expiry of their Student visa, they can return to the UK on that visa and apply again under the Graduate route. It's a new application with a new fee and new IHS. The fees paid for the previous withdrawn application cannot be offset against the fees for the new application, but they will be eventually refunded.

Before you ask, there is no other workaround, no way to juggle the two different statuses for a different outcome.
There's always that 20% chance that one can get stopped at the POE and returned back to where they've come from. The student visa is no longer valid as technically the person no longer attends school and isn't a student anymore. Always advisable to regularise your stay before one leaves the UK.
A valid visa isn't a guarantee to be let into the country. It allows you to get to the border and seek permission to be let into the country.
No sin in failing, you just have to try and try again!

sah10406
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by sah10406 » Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:01 am

Ticktack wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:24 pm
There's always that 20% chance that one can get stopped at the POE and returned back to where they've come from.
Where are you getting this statistic that only 4 out of 5 Students are allowed to re-enter the UK during the wrap-up period? Link? I'm afraid you have been misinformed.
Ticktack wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:24 pm
The student visa is no longer valid as technically the person no longer attends school and isn't a student anymore.
Again, what is your source of this statement? It is absolutely wrong. A visa is valid until its expiry date, including a Student visa. The Student route caseworker guidance for their own staff is crystal clear (page 90) on this specific point about re-entry:

Students are able to travel outside of, and re-enter, the UK whilst they hold valid permission as a Student, including in the period after they have completed their course and still hold permission under the route.


https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... dent-route
I do not give immigration advice. I refer you to Immigration Rules, guidance, other online content and to your sponsor.

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Ticktack
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by Ticktack » Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:46 pm

sah10406 wrote:
Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:01 am
Ticktack wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:24 pm
There's always that 20% chance that one can get stopped at the POE and returned back to where they've come from.
Where are you getting this statistic that only 4 out of 5 Students are allowed to re-enter the UK during the wrap-up period? Link? I'm afraid you have been misinformed.The keyword there is can, not will. All kinds of questions can be asked at the POE. You always have to satisfy the immigration officer before he lets you in. Always nice to know you leave no stones unturned.
Ticktack wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:24 pm
The student visa is no longer valid as technically the person no longer attends school and isn't a student anymore.
Again, what is your source of this statement? It is absolutely wrong. A visa is valid until its expiry date, including a Student visa. The Student route caseworker guidance for their own staff is crystal clear (page 90) on this specific point about re-entry:

Students are able to travel outside of, and re-enter, the UK whilst they hold valid permission as a Student, including in the period after they have completed their course and still hold permission under the route.
Pray you never see the ugly side of immigration. Your right is to seek entry as a student, so you have to explain satisfactorily. If it sounds nice they let you go, if not, they don't. My friend on a spouse visa (wife British) was asked at POE where the wife was, and why she wasn't travelling with him. If the stories don't align, they take you to the waiting area. It could easily escalate from there if the checks don't sound good.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... dent-route
Some life events don't have statistics, it's just what has happened. At the end of the day, these are just advices, everyone is free to do what they like.
Personally, I'd like to be warned than to find out the hard way.
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Ticktack
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by Ticktack » Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:55 pm

If your programme has finished, and you have no future studies in the UK, we advise you to avoid travelling in and out of the UK if possible and to not attempt to re-enter the UK on your Student visa during the extra time after the end of your programme. While the visa itself has not expired, it is important to understand that a Student visa only allows you to enter the UK for the purpose of starting or continuing your studies sponsored by University of Birmingham.

Every time you enter the UK, a Border Force Official (BFO) is required to check that you have the correct visa for your purpose.

So if your programme has now formally ended, a BFO may correctly refuse to allow you to re-enter the UK on a Student visa.

It is possible that a BFO may accept that you are indeed returning for reasons connected to your studies, for example if you have not yet received your exam results or you are returning to attend your graduation ceremony. However, this is at your own risk. If you are returning to the UK before your graduation, we advise you to carry a graduation letter as evidence of this.
https://intranet.birmingham.ac.uk/stude ... nt%20visa.

Quick search would show you this.

Better safe than sorry.
No sin in failing, you just have to try and try again!

sah10406
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Re: Travel between Tier4 to Graduate visa conversion

Post by sah10406 » Wed Jan 18, 2023 10:53 pm

Ticktack wrote:
Wed Jan 18, 2023 12:55 pm
So if your programme has now formally ended, a BFO may correctly refuse to allow you to re-enter the UK on a Student visa.

It is possible that a BFO may accept that you are indeed returning for reasons connected to your studies, for example if you have not yet received your exam results or you are returning to attend your graduation ceremony. However, this is at your own risk. If you are returning to the UK before your graduation, we advise you to carry a graduation letter as evidence of this.
This quoted information is not reliable. It is from a very out of date university intranet webpage, 2+ years overdue for updating. It is about how re-entry could sometimes be a problem under the old Tier 4 visa system, pre 5 October 2020.

The new Student visa system, the associated immigration rules and the relevant guidance were all overhauled in October 2020, almost two and a half years ago now. The position on re-entry during the wrap-up period is now totally different from before, including for existing Tier 4 visas, and is as I quoted above from the Home Office's own current guidance to their own staff working at the border.

Not since 5 October 2020 has someone with a valid Student visa been stopped from entering the UK simply because their course has finished. Moreover, even under the previous system it didn't happen often anyway. I work with thousands of students at a large London university, and while re-entry during the wrap-up period was sometimes a problem in the old days, it is no longer an issue.

Being refused entry because you are suspected of not meeting the requirements of your visa anyway, like a person suspected on not being a genuine spouse, is a completely different matter and Border Force Officers are always on the lookout for that.
I do not give immigration advice. I refer you to Immigration Rules, guidance, other online content and to your sponsor.

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