Wife and Daughters Visa renewal

[gaurav.g2]

Hi All,
I am on ILR Status since November 2014 (Earlier I was on Tier 1 general). My wife is on Tier -1 general PBS dependant and renewal is due in March 2016. Her last VISA renewal was done from UK March 2013. Our daughter is born in India in October 2015. My wife is still not eligible for ILR (Not 5 years in UK)
My query is:
1. Can I apply for my daughters UK VISA and my wife's PBS dependant UK Visa renewal from India at same time?
2. Can I apply for My Wife’s PBS Visa renewal now? Around 4 months before expiry or is there 90 days renewal clause.
3. If my wife cannot apply for her visa renewal from India, then on whom my daughters VISA validity will depend?
4. Or in case my wife gets her VISA renewed from India will the validity for both the VISA will be for 2 or 3 years?
5. My Wife has been out of UK for more than 6 months on Maternity leave now and I suppose this will impact her ILR application (2 years from now- DEC 2017). So is it advisable to apply for both my wife and daughter for ILR dependant?

[geriatrix]

Were you granted settlement under long residence route or PBS route?

[gaurav.g2]

Hi sushdmehta,
I was granted settlement under PBS. from Tier-1 general (after 5 year of stay).

[geriatrix]

Apply for child's entry clearance as "child of settled person".
Get your wife and child back in UK before your wife's PBS dependant leave expires.
Apply for wife's PBS dependant leave from within UK as and when the time comes (close to expiry).
Child will be eligible for settlement when the mother is.

There no "visa renewals" from outside the UK.
If your wife remains outside UK when her current PBS dependant leave expires, she will have to apply for entry clearance as spouse of settled person to return to UK and then spend 5 years (as spouse of settled person) to become eligible for settlement.

[gaurav.g2]

Thank you sushdmehta.
one more question, My wife is out of UK for more than 6 months now. Will this impact her ILR application when time comes.
So isnt it better to apply for ILR dependant for both straight away ?

[geriatrix]

1. No.
2. No, unless you want her ILR clock reset.

[gaurav.g2]

Thanks a lot for replyig to all my queries.

[vinny]

Apply for child's entry clearance as "child of settled person".
Get your wife and child back in UK before your wife's PBS dependant leave expires.

I think child may apply for entry clearance as a PBS dependant, in line with wife's.

[geriatrix]

Yes indeed, that too!

Vinny to my rescue, as always!
Muchas gracias.

[geriatrix]

But PBS leave will be granted for only a couple of months (wife's current leave expires March 2016) and will need to be extended along with wife's, whereas as child of settled person the leave will be for 27 months to take the child right through to the time PBS dependant parent becomes eligible for settlement (Dec 2017). One application rather than two, save money?

At the time of settlement, either route will cost the same (assuming SET(F) does not cost more than SET(O) in 2017).
Under current rates:
SET(F) + SET(O) = £3000
SET(O) including 1 dependant = £3000

Any disadvantage, vinny?

[vinny]

Can child apply for a child settlement visa without mother applying for one too?

[geriatrix]

(a) one parent is present and settled in the United Kingdom or being admitted on the same occasion for settlement and the other parent is being or has been given limited leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom with a view to settlement;

Doesn't PBS dependant fall under "other parent is being or has been given limited leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom with a view to settlement"? I thought so ....?

[vinny]

I'm not sure. That may refer to spouse with settlement visa?

[gaurav.g2]

But PBS leave will be granted for only a couple of months (wife's current leave expires March 2016) and will need to be extended along with wife's, whereas as child of settled person the leave will be for 27 months to take the child right through to the time PBS dependant parent becomes eligible for settlement (Dec 2017). One application rather than two, save money?

At the time of settlement, either route will cost the same (assuming SET(F) does not cost more than SET(O) in 2017).
Under current rates:
SET(F) + SET(O) = £3000
SET(O) including 1 dependant = £3000

Any disadvantage, vinny?

Currently what i think my expenditure as explained by sushmehta earlier is:
~£1000 for child PBS dependant visa from India in December 2015
~£3500 for Child and Wife’s visa renewal from UK in March 2016
~£3000 for SET(O) application for 2 applicants in DECEMBER 2017 assuming fees remains same.

If I can apply for child Visa from India as settled persons dependant than it will save me £1750 renewal due in march 2016 along with wife. (Wife's Visa anyhow has to be renewed)

Could you confirm Sushmehta/Vinny if my child can apply for one settled parent dependant visa.. Is this possible according to rules?

[geriatrix]

I'm not sure. That may refer to spouse with settlement visa?

Imagine a born-abroad child where one parent is settled (let's say under LR route) and the other parent is a principal PBS migrant? Does that mean that the child can apply for entry clearance only as a dependant of the PBS migrant parent but not as a child of the settled parent?

Had it been Appendix FM route for the non-settled parent, IMHO, the immigration rule would have mentioned "other parent is being or has been given limited leave to enter or remain in the United Kingdom as a partner (or partner under Appendix FM)".

Won't a TIer 2 (General) migrant parent be considered as a parent with limited leave to remain with the view to settlement (Tier 2 General leads to settlement)?

[geriatrix]

Vinny, waiting for your opinion.

[vinny]

The term with a view to settlement appears in

The requirements to be met by a person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom with a view to settlement as the spouse or civil partner of a person present and settled in the United Kingdom or who is on the same occasion being admitted for settlement are that:

and

The requirements to be met by a person seeking leave to enter the United Kingdom with a view to settlement as the unmarried or same-sex partner of a person present and settled in the United Kingdom or being admitted on the same occasion for settlement, are that:

So, they may expect the other parent to have qualified under those categories? Hence, a reason for 302, the period of leave granted not exceeding 27 months, in line with 282 or 295B?

The term with a view to settlement does not appear in 319C.

[vinny]

Moreover,

(f) Paragraphs 301-303F continue to apply to applications made under this route on or after 9 July 2012, and are not subject to any additional requirement listed in (b) above, by a child of a person to whom those paragraphs relate who has been granted limited leave to enter or remain or an extension of stay following an application made before 9 July 2012,

Could this have referred to leave granted under 282 or 295B only?

[geriatrix]

A child who wishes to join or accompany a parent when the parent has limited leave to enter or remain in a category leading to settlement. (SET7.13)

Note use of "category leading to settlement".

A child may qualify for leave to enter with a view to settlement through qualifying to accompany or join a parent or parents (but not a relative) who has / have been granted limited leave to enter or remain with a view to settlement.

If "with a view to settlement" is associated only with people in UK or applying to enter UK under Appendix FM, then:
1. The statement "A child may qualify for leave to enter with a view to settlement" cannot be true, as the child is not subject to Appendix FM
2. Appendix FM is for a partner of "settled person / BC" but here it says a child can apply for leave to enter with "a view to settlement" even when both parents have limited leave to enter / remain.

Also,

Imagine a born-abroad child where one parent is settled (let's say under LR route) and the other parent is a principal PBS migrant? Does that mean that the child can apply for entry clearance only as a dependant of the PBS migrant parent but not as a child of the settled parent?

Won't this be a case of discrimination?


Hence my belief that "with a view to settlement" is not necessarily restricted to people subject to or under Appendix FM but is applicable to all people in any immigration category that leads to settlement - despite HO's selective use of the term only when referring to Appendix FM.

your thoughts?

[vinny]

I think that A277 and A280(f) may prevent 301-303F from being applicable to children, if they hadn't made an application for leave to enter or remain prior to 9 July 2012.

If a parent is subject to Appendix FM, then EC-C to D-LTRC and 298 would apply to child?

[gaurav.g2]

Thank you. In line with all above discussion I suppose I should apply my child's PBS dependent visa from India and after they travel to UK in January, apply for renewal in March 2016. (Sorry above was bit too sections and rules oriented for me.)

[geriatrix]

Yes, that's the most risk-free option.

[gaurav.g2]

Thank you for all the inputs.