Renew of EU 4 Fam Visa

[Matt148]

Hi all,
Apologies for the wall of text, what started with a simple question ended up being a whole rant about the Visa renewal system.

TL;DR: Facing chaos and lack of information to renew a EU 4 Fam Visa. Currently requested to submit a EU 3 Visa application for unclear reasons.


So, me (Italian) and my wife (Japanese nationality) got married in 2019, and she got the EU4Fam Visa.
We're well-established with both working in Dublin, and now that is time to renew her Visa, we're facing chaos.

The first application she sent online about a month ago, has been first put on hold for a missing document (got two weeks to send a Letter of Confirmation of IRP, which we did the same day of the communication), and then declined abruptly a few days after, saying there were missing documents. They want a New letter of Confirmation, which is what we should be getting at the end of the renewal process, not sure how they can ask for it now :/
Reaching out via phone or email for further information ended up being really pointless: we've got poor and limited information throughout the whole process, with the person at the phone getting even upset when my wife asked where to get a new letter ("I can't tell you" was the main answer the operator kept repeating), and the limitations of the website were the cherry on top (unable to show you the pictures of which document/file you attached on the forms, making everything more confused).

After the renewal application was refused today, we reached out again on the given email address, and we were told to fill and submit an EU3 Form, and a temporary EU 4 Visa will be given while the application is reviewed... I find this totally unrelated to a EU 4 Fam renewal, and this other application requires lots of information that should be available in Revenue and Welfare systems, but forces us to produces tons of documents, some of which we would need to recover from employees who are no more and former landlords we though we were through with them... we'll be doing it anyway give the lack of information, but I feel we're going in the wrong direction at the moment.

Of course my wife is stressing out about the whole situation, and while I'm keeping calm (there's still time to complete the IRP renewal, and she can still work for 8 weeks after expiration if the application has been sent) I can totally relate with her, so many unanswered questions:
1. Why the whole process is not as smooth as it should?
2. Why an EU 5 Fam Visa takes so much documentation and struggle to be renewed?
3. if the basis of approving it in the first place were our marriage and economical stability, if this isn't changed, why it's so hard to just approve the renewal?
4. Why we need to produce so many documents that should be available in the system already? I get that some part of the system cannot access personal documents due to GDPR limitations, but can't we just sign some document approving the retrieval of these info in relation of this application?

Sorry for venting out with you all, but I hope this message would A) open the eyes of the public on the situation, and prompt everyone to submit their applications in a timely manner, to give space for any mishap, B) hope that this feedback may change something in the future, to make the whole process smoother, and finally C) invite you all to share analogue stories and eventually how you fixed the situation from your side.

I'm sure we'll get on top in the end, but damn if the whole journey isn't messy!

[Angel99]

Hi,
I think you made a mistake somewhere.
EUTR 4 is for review (if your application has been refused)

If your spouse has completed 5 years stay in ireland, she has to apply with EUTR 3 for 10 years permanent residence card. Unless you lack some documentations (The EU citizen was not working for a long time or you were a burden to the state) then you can still extend with EUTR1 for another 5 years card. However regardless of the type, your spouse can apply for Irish citizenship immediately.

You need to apply for EUTR3 exactly like how you applied for EUTR1 but with a couple of added documents(Prove the EU citizen has been in the state for 5 years/ has been employed all this while/ excercising treaty rights, prove the applicant has also been in the state for 5 years uninterrupted)

After your application is approved or given temporary permission letter you will use that plus few docs to apply for renewal via the online portal.


*** The letter of confirmation for an IRP should be the new permission letter you will receive from ISD EUTR.

[Matt148]

Thanks for your reply!
When I said we were supposed to submit EU3 application, I was referring to EUTR 3, thanks for correcting me.
I also was referring to Stamp 4 EUFAM when I talked about EU 4 Fam.
We never applied for EUTR 1, so EUTR 3 application seems quite new for us.

What leaves me baffled is that nowhere in the whole process we were told this is the right procedure, and everything suggested the opposite actually.
There's even a website to request renewal of Stamp 4 EUFAM, so it seems natural whoever has this Visa would go for it... but as said before, the whole process isn't clear and when questions are raised, the answers are really dry and often not really precise.

Thanks also for specifying the new Letter of confirmation for the IRP will come from ISD EUTR after applied to EUTR 3 (that's what you meant, right?).

[Matt148]

Finally got a proper reply!

We indeed need to apply for EUTR 3 as they need to confirm the last 5 years we were living together (in short).
After that, we'll be able to apply for the IRP renewal using the new Letter of Confirmation.
I just hope we'll be in time to do everything at this point, her Visa expires in 1 month

[Angel99]

Finally got a proper reply!

We indeed need to apply for EUTR 3 as they need to confirm the last 5 years we were living together (in short).
After that, we'll be able to apply for the IRP renewal using the new Letter of Confirmation.
I just hope we'll be in time to do everything at this point, her Visa expires in 1 month

Not just confirm 5 years living together but also 5 years exercising EU treaty rights (Employment/Studies/Self sufficient);

**P60s or Employment Detail Summary for the last five years (or as applicable)

It can take a few days - couple of months to receive temporary permission.

[Sumeeet]

Hi,

This is regarding my EU 4 Fam visa
I applied for my application on 2nd October, and received parcel from Dpt of Justice on 18th October.
But unfortunately I was not present to collect it as I was travelling. I contacted the An Post for collection of my documents but they had sent it back to Dpt of Justice.

I wanted to ask if anyone can guide me over next steps? I have put in a query for the same to the Dpt of Justice, is there anything else I need to do? Has anyone encountered similar problem before?

[Angel99]

Hi,

This is regarding my EU 4 Fam visa
I applied for my application on 2nd October, and received parcel from Dpt of Justice on 18th October.
But unfortunately I was not present to collect it as I was travelling. I contacted the An Post for collection of my documents but they had sent it back to Dpt of Justice.

I wanted to ask if anyone can guide me over next steps? I have put in a query for the same to the Dpt of Justice, is there anything else I need to do? Has anyone encountered similar problem before?

Hi,

How long were you away? Did you receive a slip to collect it at An post sorting office and did you check with the sorting office?. An post normally sends undelivered registered post to your nearest sorting office. They hold it there for about 7 days then send it back if no one comes for it.

If the sorting office confirmed they sent it back, only option is contact ISD EUTR Unit. It's possible they will resend it but they can delay.

Next time if you won't be around, subscribe to An post MailMinder, Rent a post box or buy An post delivery box.

[Angel99]

Go to the immigration website below and create an account. You will be able to view your application status and send queries.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... ty-rights/

https://portal.irishimmigration.ie/en/

[Sumeeet]

Hi,

This is regarding my EU 4 Fam visa
I applied for my application on 2nd October, and received parcel from Dpt of Justice on 18th October.
But unfortunately I was not present to collect it as I was travelling. I contacted the An Post for collection of my documents but they had sent it back to Dpt of Justice.

I wanted to ask if anyone can guide me over next steps? I have put in a query for the same to the Dpt of Justice, is there anything else I need to do? Has anyone encountered similar problem before?

Hi,

How long were you away? Did you receive a slip to collect it at An post sorting office and did you check with the sorting office?. An post normally sends undelivered registered post to your nearest sorting office. They hold it there for about 7 days then send it back if no one comes for it.

If the sorting office confirmed they sent it back, only option is contact ISD EUTR Unit. It's possible they will resend it but they can delay.

Next time if you won't be around, subscribe to An post MailMinder, Rent a post box or buy An post delivery box.

Hi,
Thank you for such a quick reply and help on this. I was away for 10 days, the post came on 18th but as I couldn't receive it. They took it back to An post office, I called them yesterday only to know they have mailed it back to sender which is Dpt of Justice.
Next time I will follow the steps you mentioned.
I believe now I need to contact the ISD EUTR unit.

[Sumeeet]

Go to the immigration website below and create an account. You will be able to view your application status and send queries.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... ty-rights/

https://portal.irishimmigration.ie/en/

Wow, this is such a great help. I didn't even know this existed. I have created account and checked for the file status.
They had sent a document for additional requirements.
I have raised a query and now I need to wait? or should I write them an email?


Thank you so much for the help

[Angel99]

Go to the immigration website below and create an account. You will be able to view your application status and send queries.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... ty-rights/

https://portal.irishimmigration.ie/en/

Wow, this is such a great help. I didn't even know this existed. I have created account and checked for the file status.
They had sent a document for additional requirements.
I have raised a query and now I need to wait? or should I write them an email?


Thank you so much for the help

You can wait for the reply but you can also email EUTR Unit since sometimes there is a time frame to submit requested documents or else they will put your application aside. If the letter was a registered one, thus An post gave you a collection slip, i suspected it also had your temporary stamp 4 registration letter.

Since you missed your acknowledgement letter with your application number, Provide them with your name, your spouse name, your date of birth and address. The subject should be "Missed delivery"

eutreatyrights@justice.ie

[Sumeeet]

Go to the immigration website below and create an account. You will be able to view your application status and send queries.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... ty-rights/

https://portal.irishimmigration.ie/en/

Wow, this is such a great help. I didn't even know this existed. I have created account and checked for the file status.
They had sent a document for additional requirements.
I have raised a query and now I need to wait? or should I write them an email?


Thank you so much for the help

You can wait for the reply but you can also email EUTR Unit since sometimes there is a time frame to submit requested documents or else they will put your application aside. If the letter was a registered one, thus An post gave you a collection slip, i suspected it also had your temporary stamp 4 registration letter.

Since you missed your acknowledgement letter with your application number, Provide them with your name, your spouse name, your date of birth and address. The subject should be "Missed delivery"

eutreatyrights@justice.ie

Thank you again, I have sent them an email. Awaiting response from them.
Thank you for the help I really appreciate it.

[Momojirou]

Hi, any updates?

[My123]

Any updates, we received a letter asking for COVID19 layoff time. Does anyone else asked to provide documents for COVID 19 Layoff as I was temporarily laidoff but still employed what documents should I add for that any help. Thanks

[My123]

Go to the immigration website below and create an account. You will be able to view your application status and send queries.

https://www.irishimmigration.ie/coming- ... ty-rights/

https://portal.irishimmigration.ie/en/

Wow, this is such a great help. I didn't even know this existed. I have created account and checked for the file status.
They had sent a document for additional requirements.
I have raised a query and now I need to wait? or should I write them an email?


Thank you so much for the help

You can wait for the reply but you can also email EUTR Unit since sometimes there is a time frame to submit requested documents or else they will put your application aside. If the letter was a registered one, thus An post gave you a collection slip, i suspected it also had your temporary stamp 4 registration letter.

Since you missed your acknowledgement letter with your application number, Provide them with your name, your spouse name, your date of birth and address. The subject should be "Missed delivery"

eutreatyrights@justice.ie

Thank you again, I have sent them an email. Awaiting response from them.
Thank you for the help I really appreciate it.

Hi, have got any update?

[Angel99]

Any updates, we received a letter asking for COVID19 layoff time. Does anyone else asked to provide documents for COVID 19 Layoff as I was temporarily laidoff but still employed what documents should I add for that any help. Thanks

Hi,

If you were layed off but still employed either you were paid or not, it should reflect on your "My revenue account online". You can print out your Employment Detail Summary" for the relevant year and use it as evidence.

[My123]

Any updates, we received a letter asking for COVID19 layoff time. Does anyone else asked to provide documents for COVID 19 Layoff as I was temporarily laidoff but still employed what documents should I add for that any help. Thanks

Hi,

If you were layed off but still employed either you were paid or not, it should reflect on your "My revenue account online". You can print out your Employment Detail Summary" for the relevant year and use it as evidence.

Thanks Angel, I provided then EDS for 5 years but received a letter that I have worked 38 weeks in 2020 and they are looking for information for remaining weeks not sure what else I can provide I have sent them a statement from welfare let's see if that will be enough, if someone received similar letter please reply what documents to add. Thanks

[Koolflame]

Any updates, we received a letter asking for COVID19 layoff time. Does anyone else asked to provide documents for COVID 19 Layoff as I was temporarily laidoff but still employed what documents should I add for that any help. Thanks

Hi, EU Treaty Rights Unit requested welfare statement for 2020, as there were only 11 weeks on the employment detail summary for that year and an explanation for the low amount of weeks in employment for 2020 was required.

Along with welfare statement, we also submitted social insurance record from mywelfare which showed 52 contributions for 2020. Approval received.

The requested documents can be submitted over email. ATVB

[Marto01]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application.
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

[Marto01]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application ??
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

[Angel99]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application.
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

Hi,

Yes permanent residence card has a limit of 10 years. However since you have already spent 5 years with Stamp 4EUFam, you can apply for naturalisation to become Irish citizen. If you don't want citizenship, you are free to reapply online again for another 10 years permanent residence 12 weeks to October 2028.

[Marto01]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application.
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

Hi,

Yes permanent residence card has a limit of 10 years. However since you have already spent 5 years with Stamp 4EUFam, you can apply for naturalisation to become Irish citizen. If you don't want citizenship, you are free to reapply online again for another 10 years permanent residence 12 weeks to October 2028.

Thanks angel for your reply.
My citizenship application is in its 3 year wait...
But just on case i have to renew for another ten years, do i have to fill another EU3 form ?
Or use the old one letter of approval?
Because I found this online .
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/r ... dex_en.htm
Where it says that renewal is automatic without any condition .

[Angel99]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application.
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

Hi,

Yes permanent residence card has a limit of 10 years. However since you have already spent 5 years with Stamp 4EUFam, you can apply for naturalisation to become Irish citizen. If you don't want citizenship, you are free to reapply online again for another 10 years permanent residence 12 weeks to October 2028.

Thanks angel for your reply.
My citizenship application is in its 3 year wait...
But just on case i have to renew for another ten years, do i have to fill another EU3 form ?
Or use the old one letter of approval?
Because I found this online .
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/r ... dex_en.htm
Where it says that renewal is automatic without any condition .

No you don't have to submit another EUTR 3 form. You just renew online by submitting a copy of your permanent residence card (front and back), and proof of address. You might also need to add the old permission letter.

[Marto01]

Hi everyone .
I need help understanding my situation.
I was granted a 10 year stamp 4 eufam based on eu3 form permanent residency in October 2018 ., my passport expired so I got a new passport expiring in 2034 so applied to renew my irp card which expires in march 2025 , so i was issued with a new irp card expiring in October 2028 .
So that's the 10 year duration I think
What's the next step for me another eu3 application.
is it not permanent residency ?
I would really appreciate anybody that can help.
Thanks in advance

Hi,

Yes permanent residence card has a limit of 10 years. However since you have already spent 5 years with Stamp 4EUFam, you can apply for naturalisation to become Irish citizen. If you don't want citizenship, you are free to reapply online again for another 10 years permanent residence 12 weeks to October 2028.

Thanks angel for your reply.
My citizenship application is in its 3 year wait...
But just on case i have to renew for another ten years, do i have to fill another EU3 form ?
Or use the old one letter of approval?
Because I found this online .
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/r ... dex_en.htm
Where it says that renewal is automatic without any condition .

No you don't have to submit another EUTR 3 form. You just renew online by submitting a copy of your permanent residence card (front and back), and proof of address. You might also need to add the old permission letter.

Thanks Yiu so much for answering my questions.. you're always helpful.
Cheers