Visitor Visa for spouse of UK citizen

[Borges]

Sorry, this post is a little long. I have tried to break it up and highlight important parts in bold. For a basic summary and key questions you can skip to the bottom.

I am a UK citizen married to a Chinese woman. I have lived and worked in China for the last 7 years. Last year, she applied for a visitor visa for a short-term visit to the the UK, but was refused. We are reapplying this year and I am desperate for her to be approved. As a result of the previous refusal she missed my brother's wedding. My grandma is already 98 years old and I don't know how many more opportunities there will be for my wife to meet her in person. I will explain my situation in more detail below, but I am primarily looking for advice on the following areas:

• Submitting documents related to informal work arrangements.
  Including supporting documents e.g. cover letters/support from local MP
  Any other information that will help my wife obtain her visa

Reasons for previous rejection:

"I have refused your application for a visit visa because I am not satisfied that you meet the requirements of paragraph(s) V4.2 of Appendix V: Visitor because:
You wish to visit your family in the UK for 12 days. Whilst I recognise that family visits are important, I must consider the information regarding your sponsor’s support of your visit separately in my assessment of your application. To consider whether or not I am satisfied that your intentions are as stated and that you meet the requirements of the Immigration Rules, I must assess your own personal and financial circumstances.
You state that you are self-employed and have an annual income of 120,000 CNY (£13,325.4 where £1= 9.00536 CNY as per www.Oanda.Com on the date of assessing this application) as well as an additional annual income via investments of 20,000 CNY (£2,220.9). However, the documents provided do not demonstrate your self-employment or how you derive an income. I am therefore not satisfied that your circumstances are as declared.
I note that you plan to travel to the UK with your spouse and both of your parents. The documents you have provided do not demonstrate that you have any other family in your home country or any other country aside from your mother-in-law and father-in-law who live in the UK. On the balance of probabilities, I am not satisfied that you have demonstrated that you have ties to your home country which would encourage you to leave should you be granted entry to the UK.
Your application is therefore refused under paragraph V4.2 (a) and (c) of the Immigration Rules."

To be honest, I messed up here. I assumed that obtaining a visitor visa for a spouse would be fairly easy, and wouldn't be refused without good reason. Unfortunately, I also trusted some very poor agents to 'help' with the application. However, I found both of these reasons for rejection a little odd.

For the finances, I don't understand why they need to consider it separately from sponsor's support. My parents and I had both provided extensive documents showing that we were willing and had the financial means to support my wife throughout her visit.

Anyway, the major problem here is that my wife works informally. She is a self-employed English tutor, but does not have any formal pay slips, tax records, or employment contracts. She is paid through digital payment apps like WeChat. Last time, she provided screenshots of these payments, but as stated above "the documents provided do not demonstrate your self-employment or how you derive an income." However, my concern here is that there are not any documents she could provide that would demonstrate her self-employment to the visa office. The thing is, her situation is not at all uncommon in China; there are probably at least 100 million people with similar working circumstances, so surely there must be some way to demonstrate this to the visa office.

The second reason for refusal was infuriating for two reasons; firstly, the agents - unbeknownst to me - removed information about her grandparents from the visa application form. Secondly, her parents' visas were also rejected, so the visa office must have known she would have close family remaining in her home country, but thought it was appropriate to give as a reason for rejection anyway. Seems cruel. Anyway, her parents will not apply for a visa this time around so I hope that this will not be given as a reason for refusal.

For this year's application, I would sum-up the strengths and weaknesses as follows:

Strengths:

• Strong family ties to China (two parents plus both maternal grandmothers)
  Sufficient funds in her bank account
  Sponsorship from myself and my parents with proof of sufficient funds
  Invitation letter from my parents stating they will provide accommodation
  I also have good reasons for returning to China - decent job (documents provided), two dogs etc.
  Letter of support from Local MP

Weaknesses:

• Limited evidence related to my wife's work/earnings
  Two previous rejections (one for UK, one for Australia)

Questions

• How damaging are these weaknesses likely to be to my wife's case? How can I overcome them?
  I would like to include a cover letter explaining the reasons for previous rejection and making a case for our new application. Is this worth it? Will they actually read it? What should/shouldn't be included?
  How important is having a return ticket when you apply for the visa?
  How best to incorporate support from local MP?

[Ticktack]

Sorry, this post is a little long. I have tried to break it up and highlight important parts in bold. For a basic summary and key questions you can skip to the bottom.

I am a UK citizen married to a Chinese woman. I have lived and worked in China for the last 7 years. Seems you still live in China Last year, she applied for a visitor visa for a short-term visit to the the UK, but was refused. It happens We are reapplying this year and I am desperate for her to be approved. As a result of the previous refusal she missed my brother's wedding. My grandma is already 98 years old and I don't know how many more opportunities there will be for my wife to meet her in person. I will explain my situation in more detail below, but I am primarily looking for advice on the following areas:

• Submitting documents related to informal work arrangements.
  Including supporting documents e.g. cover letters/support from local MP That wouldn't hold water for a visit visa
  Any other information that will help my wife obtain her visa

Reasons for previous rejection:

"I have refused your application for a visit visa because I am not satisfied that you meet the requirements of paragraph(s) V4.2 of Appendix V: Visitor because:
You wish to visit your family in the UK for 12 days. Whilst I recognise that family visits are important, I must consider the information regarding your sponsor’s support of your visit separately in my assessment of your application. To consider whether or not I am satisfied that your intentions are as stated and that you meet the requirements of the Immigration Rules, I must assess your own personal and financial circumstances.
You state that you are self-employed and have an annual income of 120,000 CNY (£13,325.4 where £1= 9.00536 CNY as per www.Oanda.Com on the date of assessing this application) as well as an additional annual income via investments of 20,000 CNY (£2,220.9). However, the documents provided Screenshots aren't documents.do not demonstrate your self-employment or how you derive an income.I agree, where are the contract documents? Everything must be verifiable. I am therefore not satisfied that your circumstances are as declared.
I note that you plan to travel to the UK with your spouse and both of your parents Not a good move. The documents you have provided do not demonstrate that you have any other family Outcome would still have been the same regardless in your home country or any other country aside from your mother-in-law and father-in-law who live in the UK. On the balance of probabilities, I am not satisfied that you have demonstrated that you have ties to your home country which would encourage you to leave should you be granted entry to the UK.
Your application is therefore refused under paragraph V4.2 (a) and (c) of the Immigration Rules."

To be honest, I messed up here. I assumed that obtaining a visitor visa for a spouse would be fairly easy Nothing is ever easy, and wouldn't be refused without good reason One good reason is that she might have no reason to go back. there's nothing she couldn't leave behind in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, I also trusted some very poor agents usual mistakes to 'help' with the application. However, I found both of these reasons for rejection a little odd.hmmm

For the finances, I don't understand why they need to consider it separately from sponsor's support. How much did you personally show in your account?? My parents Your parents don't count. Accomodation yes, anything else, nah! and I had both provided extensive documents showing that we were willing and had the financial means to support my wife throughout her visit.

Anyway, the major problem here is that my wife works informally What about you? What do you do. What's your income like? Is your job steady? Have you savings? Just being British isn't enough!. She is a self-employed English tutor, but does not have any formal pay slips, tax records, or employment contracts. She is paid through digital payment apps like WeChat. Last time, she provided screenshots of these payments, but as stated above "the documents provided do not demonstrate your self-employment or how you derive an income." However, my concern here is that there are not any documents she could provide that would demonstrate her self-employment to the visa office.At this point, it's treated as if your spouse doesn't work, so the onus is on you to cover all the bases. The thing is, her situation is not at all uncommon in China Well the UK thinks differently - paperwork!; there are probably at least 100 million people with similar working circumstances, so surely there must be some way to demonstrate this to the visa office.

The second reason for refusal was infuriating for two reasons; firstly, the agents - unbeknownst to me - removed information about her grandparents from the visa application form. Secondly, her parents' visas were also rejected, so the visa office must have known she would have close family remaining in her home country, but thought it was appropriate to give as a reason for rejection anyway. Seems cruel. Anyway, her parents will not apply for a visa this time around so I hope that this will not be given as a reason for refusal.

For this year's application, I would sum-up the strengths and weaknesses as follows:

Strengths:

• Strong family ties to China (two parents plus both maternal grandmothers)
  Sufficient funds in her bank account and yours.
  Sponsorship from myself and my parents with proof of sufficient funds Majorly from you
  Invitation letter from my parents stating they will provide accommodation
  I also have good reasons for returning to China - decent job (documents provided), two dogs etc.
  Letter of support from Local MP

Weaknesses:

• Limited evidence related to my wife's work/earnings
  Two previous rejections (one for UK, one for Australia)

Not good, but not the end of the world

Questions

• How damaging are these weaknesses likely to be to my wife's case? How can I overcome them?
  I would like to include a cover letter explaining the reasons for previous rejection and making a case for our new application. Is this worth it? Yes it isWill they actually read it?They will What should/shouldn't be included?
  How important is having a return ticket when you apply for the visa? Not required, no one needs that, and it proves nothing
  How best to incorporate support from local MP?

Treat this application like you're going to a foreign country with your spouse. Not home, but a visa application for say Spain.

Include all documents that shows that you have a good standing where you're living at. Not that you have dogs, cats or some singing parrot (No pun intended).
If you had kids, that would be strength, as they know you'd definitely go back to them.
If one of you has a fantastic job, now you're talking.

Home Office mindset is, what stops you from bringing her to the UK and start claiming benefit? What stops you from saying "why don't we just sit back". You're already familiar with the terrain. Afterall, she might be able to teach the English remotely.

Previous travel experience with her to a different country shows a holidaying culture.

In a funny way, you being British isn't a positive. A different national in your shoes might have a better outcome. You have to work 3 times harder to convince them.

[Borges]

First of all I would like to say a massive thank you for looking over my case and giving useful feedback. I really, really appreciate it.

This advice is a bit of a contrast from what I was told on another forum, they said:

"Sounds like before, and now, you're focusing way too much on having a sponsor.

The sponsor means very little.

The MPs letter will mean very little.

You need to focus on accurately demonstrating her personal and financial circumstances in China, and providing evidence to back everything she claims up.

Truly, minimise what you think you and your parents bring, it's not worth as much as you think.

The application has to be all about your wife."

However, having spoken to someone who was in a similar position and successfully obtained a visa for their partner through the sponsorship route, I definitely lean more towards trusting the advice you have given here.

You are right that I am still living in China. As for my work/financial situation, I have a steady job (close to three years with my current company) that pays a decent salary (£40,000 annual pre-tax). I would probably need a job making at least £60,000 in the UK to enjoy a similar standard of living, so I really have very little economic incentive to return to the UK currently, although proving this to the visa office may be tricky. I have around £10,000 in savings, split between a Chinese and a uk bank account.

Is this level of salary/saving sufficient for the visa office? Would having savings in the UK help or hinder my application for a visitor visa?

Again, thanks a lot for helping out a stranger.

[Ticktack]

First of all I would like to say a massive thank you for looking over my case and giving useful feedback. I really, really appreciate it. You're very welcome!

This advice is a bit of a contrast from what I was told on another forum, they said:

"Sounds like before, and now, you're focusing way too much on having a sponsor. I agree

The sponsor means very little. If it's your spouse, then it's different

The MPs letter will mean very little. I agree

You need to focus on accurately demonstrating her personal and financial circumstances in China, and providing evidence to back everything she claims up. Socio-economic for her is fine. It is what it is at this point. But you need to show bills and commitments in your names. Get a letter from your HR stating that you'd be visiting the UK for X amount of time. That shows intent to return. Add your letter of employment, it would show you're happy and content with things as they stand.

Truly, minimise what you think you and your parents bring, it's not worth as much as you think. Just accommodation, no extras.

The application has to be all about your wife." True, but because you're legally married, you can fully sponsor your spouse. Some spouse don't work and live comfortably off their partners incomes.

However, having spoken to someone who was in a similar position and successfully obtained a visa for their partner through the sponsorship route, I definitely lean more towards trusting the advice you have given here.

You are right that I am still living in China. As for my work/financial situation, I have a steady job (close to three years with my current company) that pays a decent salary (£40,000 annual pre-tax). I would probably need a job making at least £60,000 in the UK to enjoy a similar standard of living, so I really have very little economic incentive to return to the UK currently, although proving this to the visa office may be tricky As above.. I have around £10,000 in savings, split between a Chinese and a uk bank account.

Is this level of salary/saving sufficient for the visa office?In my opinion, that should be fine. Add your 6 months payslip and 6 months bank account to the application. Also include your UK bank account. Would having savings in the UK help or hinder my application for a visitor visa? That would help. They don't need to convert that amount. They can easily picture how far that money would take you.

Again, thanks a lot for helping out a stranger. That's what we do here.

If you have further questions, just drop it on this thread. Goodluck!

[Borges]

Have spoken to a couple of other people who found themselves in a very similar situation to my own (UK citizen, long-term Chinese partner/wife paid via WeChat - no official record, applying for visitor visa).

The first couple put on the application form that the applicant was an English tutor with an income of around £10,000 a year, but then did not provide any financial documents related to this work. Instead they provided a bank record with (the equivalent of) a few thousand pounds in which was a transfer from the UK citizen. Their visa was granted. I can't believe that stating a job and income on the application form and not providing any evidence for it would be a good route to take, so I guess it was granted on the strength of the sponsor. The UK partner is this case has a very well-paying job and extensive savings, as well as a house in the UK. Although if anything I would have thought this would make them more of a risk of settling in the UK (he could find the same job in the UK), but maybe he's at the level where the visa office isn't too worried if they did.

The second couple just put down on the application form that the wife was a housewife, and that the trip would be sponsored by the husband (with accommodation provided by husband's parents). Their visa was also granted.

Thinking about the implications for my own application. I'm considering two approaches. The first approach would be trying as best as possible to provide documents that might prove my wife's circumstances (e.g. signed letters from the parents of her students, including their name and Chinese ID number, to show that she has taught some of these students for many years). The second approach would be to state that she is a housewife, and is supported by myself and her parents. Of course, I want to be honest, but given the nature of my wife's circumstances and the difficulty proving them, I don't want to complicate her application.

Whichever one of these approaches I take though, I will still focus on making a strong case that I also have deep ties to China and that I am capable of sponsoring her trip.

[Ticktack]

Whichever one of these approaches I take though, I will still focus on making a strong case that I also have deep ties to China and that I am capable of sponsoring her trip.

This is the mindset that would work. You showing that you also have a strong tie to China and would be happy to leave after the holidays. Don't get me wrong, you've got the absolute right to stay, but you get my drift.

Also every application is different and judged on it's own merit.

You stated 2 scenarios, but you don't know their travel histories, you don't know how much the British spouse had sitting in the account, you don't know if they have kids, and you don't know how long they've been married.

There are multiple things/factors that are looked at before decision are made. Like I said before, your spouse really doesn't have to work. But if you say she works, then you have to evidence it thoroughly.

2 quick scenarios that I know of,;
1. Fella applies for a visa from Africa, 6 months statement of account as requested, put in all the necessary paperwork, Visa rejected.
2. Fella applies from Canada (not Canadian), couldn't be bothered with stressing himself too much, adds just 2 months pay slip and bank account. Visa granted in less that a week. He didn't pay for fast track.

Difference in the 2 scenarios is, the Canadian resident doesn't have to come to the UK. Every application is looked at based on it's merit.

And yes, they do make mistakes with their judgements sometimes. However, if you make a strong application, and it's rejected, then you challenge it and you just might get that rejection overturned.