EU1 application or GNIB registration first?

[evilmf]

Hi!

My sister-in-law is in Ireland since Friday with a EU Treaty rights - Multiple Journeys - Long stay (6 months) VISA.
At the airport they made a mess and confused her EUTR visa with a visit visa, luckily I gave her a letter with my phone number (as she doesn't speak english) and I was able to clear the matter with the immigration officer at the phone... but they were about to refuse her because she didn't have a return ticket (!!)...

Anyway, I have a query about how to proceed now. She will file an EU1 application as my (EU citizen, working in Ireland) family member.

I am not sure if she need to register first at the GNIB or if she has to file the EU1 application and then register at the GNIB once she receive the confirmation for the EU1 application.

Could someone clarify what's the correct procedure?

Thanks in advance,
Marco

[Ben]

Hi Marco,

Your sister-in-law has a right to reside in Ireland for up to three months, without any conditions or any formalities other than the requirement to hold a valid identity card or passport. This is, of course, assuming that your sister-in-law is a person described in Article 2(2) or Article 3(2) of Directive 2004/38/EC.

Without any conditions or any formalities means that no, she is not required to register with the GNIB.

Simply submit her EU1 application to the Department of Justice, within three months of her arrival in Ireland.

The EU1 application will be processed within 6 months of submission. However, a certificate of application will be issued immediately (in about a week or so). This certificate of application is useful, because your sister-in-law may take it to your local GNIB office in order to obtain a Stamp 4 card with 6 months validity (i.e., to cover her until the EU1 application is processed).

The temporary Stamp 4 card is a good way of confirming her existing rights to reside, to work and to study in Ireland.

Once the EU1 application is processed, a letter confirming cause to issue a Residence Card will be sent to your sister-in-law. With this letter, she returns to the GNIB in order to receive her Stamp 4 EUFam Residence Card. Effectively the same as the Stamp 4 card, for employment and study purposes in Ireland, but specifically states that the holder is resident in Ireland as the family member of an EEA national who is exercising Treaty rights in Ireland. The Stamp 4 EUFam Residence Card will be valid for 5 years. After 5 years residence in Ireland, your sister-in-law will have automatically acquired Permanent Residence.

[evilmf]

Hi benifa,

thanks a lot for your really comprehensive reply - you've been very helpful!

Your sister-in-law has a right to reside in Ireland for up to three months, without any conditions or any formalities other than the requirement to hold a valid identity card or passport. This is, of course, assuming that your sister-in-law is a person described in Article 2(2) or Article 3(2) of Directive 2004/38/EC.

She was granted a EUTR visa on the basis of Article 3(2), so we should be ok. I hope that the huge amount of documentation they already requested for the VISA will also be sufficient for the EU1 application...

Without any conditions or any formalities means that no, she is not required to register with the GNIB.
Simply submit her EU1 application to the Department of Justice, within three months of her arrival in Ireland.

I was in doubt because at the airport they gave her a card with instructions to register at the GNIB as soon as possible. They have also taken photos and fingerprints... I can't complain too much anyway because my country (Italy) is even worse

The EU1 application will be processed within 6 months of submission. However, a certificate of application will be issued immediately (in about a week or so). This certificate of application is useful, because your sister-in-law may take it to your local GNIB office in order to obtain a Stamp 4 card with 6 months validity (i.e., to cover her until the EU1 application is processed).

Great! I hope to be with her in Bourgh quay tomorrow for the EU1 application.

Cheers,
Marco

[Ben]

Hi benifa,

thanks a lot for your really comprehensive reply - you've been very helpful!

Pleasure.

Your sister-in-law has a right to reside in Ireland for up to three months, without any conditions or any formalities other than the requirement to hold a valid identity card or passport. This is, of course, assuming that your sister-in-law is a person described in Article 2(2) or Article 3(2) of Directive 2004/38/EC.

She was granted a EUTR visa on the basis of Article 3(2), so we should be ok. I hope that the huge amount of documentation they already requested for the VISA will also be sufficient for the EU1 application...

To be honest, I very much doubt it. That would mean two Irish governmental departments actually talking to each other. You're joking, right?

Without any conditions or any formalities means that no, she is not required to register with the GNIB.
Simply submit her EU1 application to the Department of Justice, within three months of her arrival in Ireland.

I was in doubt because at the airport they gave her a card with instructions to register at the GNIB as soon as possible. They have also taken photos and fingerprints... I can't complain too much anyway because my country (Italy) is even worse

The GNIB officers in the airports are not as familiar with the rules as they should be. They probably thought, "non-EEA = registration with the GNIB", period. In the case of family members of an EEA national, this is not the case.

The fingerprinting I am aware of, but photographing is news to me. I'm uncertain as to whether either of these practises are compatible with Articles 5, 6 and 24 of the Directive. I must query this with the European Commission.

The EU1 application will be processed within 6 months of submission. However, a certificate of application will be issued immediately (in about a week or so). This certificate of application is useful, because your sister-in-law may take it to your local GNIB office in order to obtain a Stamp 4 card with 6 months validity (i.e., to cover her until the EU1 application is processed).

Great! I hope to be with her in Bourgh quay tomorrow for the EU1 application.

To be honest, I'm not sure whether or not they accept in-person applications. I have always used registered post. But then, I'm not in Dublin. Do let us know.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

The temporary Stamp 4 card is a good way of confirming her existing rights to reside, to work and to study in Ireland.

Is that sufficient to indicate that somebody can work freely in Ireland?

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

evilmf

What sort of documentation did your sister in law have to provide the embassy for the visa to be issued? Was the embassy helpful or difficult? Anything interesting come out of the whole process? Did she have to pay a fee of any sort?

[Ben]

The temporary Stamp 4 card is a good way of confirming her existing rights to reside, to work and to study in Ireland.

Is that sufficient to indicate that somebody can work freely in Ireland?

Yes, Stamp 4 means that the holder can work in Ireland without a work permit.

[evilmf]

evilmf

What sort of documentation did your sister in law have to provide the embassy for the visa to be issued? Was the embassy helpful or difficult? Anything interesting come out of the whole process? Did she have to pay a fee of any sort?

I started the whole process in October 2008, through the Italian embassy. They didn't have a clue about the EU Treaty rights visa and suggested to ask some information directly to the VISA office of the DoJ in Dublin.

I sent a mail and the first answer was "we cannot help you, please ask the EU Treaty rights section". As I expected, the EU Treaty rights section told me that they handled only residence applications, and that for the VISAs I should have been able to get information from the VISA office (I copied them the answer I got from the VISA office).
So I sent another mail to the VISA office, this times copying the mail from the EU Treaty rights section, and the answer I got was brilliant, with a step by step procedure and a list of documents needed for the VISA.

At the time the Italian embassy was not enabled to process online application forms, so we sent all documentation together with a printed copy of all the correspondence with the DoJ in Dublin. I've got a few calls from the embassy requesting other info or documents (at the end, she had to send all the identity documents she had, including the italian pemit to stay, basically remaining without any document for more than 2 months ).
Unfortunately in January the italian embassy switched to the online application form processing system, and requested me to file a new application using this system. This added two months of delay for our application, and I wasn't happy about that!

Finally I've got a few other calls from the DoJ in Dublin, requesting other additional documents certifying my job here and my sister-in-law status in Italy... They were anyway very friendly and I was able to send documents via fax.

At the end, it was long and complex but the people I've dealt with have been nice. Now I am just scared to begin all this again for the EU1 application, but at least we should have all the documents ready...

Regarding fees, we haven't paid anything. The only expenses were for the documents exchanges via registered post and for the courier fee for delivering the passport with the VISA and all the document we had sent.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

I am very impressed and very happy that you have had such good luck. For the most part the embassies are not nearly so responsive or communicative.

I have a write up about Beneficiaries, http://eumovement.wordpress.com/2008/04 ... ficiaries/ but there are very few examples on this list of real people who have exercised these rights in the Directive.

So I sent another mail to the VISA office, this times copying the mail from the EU Treaty rights section, and the answer I got was brilliant, with a step by step procedure and a list of documents needed for the VISA.

Any chance you can post the contents of this email, with personally identifying details YYYed out?