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British PassportFather + Working Visa Mum + Baby on the Way

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CeliaCheetham
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British PassportFather + Working Visa Mum + Baby on the Way

Post by CeliaCheetham » Thu Mar 16, 2006 3:48 pm

Hi.
I am sorry to have to clog up this fantastic forum with these sorts of issues, but anyone who has been in my position knows that it is pretty tough to easily find out information on this subject. Especially from the Australian High Commission!
The facts are:
My husband and I are living in the UK and working.
My husband is Australian, but also holds a British Passport (his father also holds a British passport).
I am Australian, and hold a working holiday visa.
I am 7 months pregnant, and we plan to have the baby here in the UK.
The question/s:
Could the baby be eligible for a British passport?
Where do I find such information/how do I apply?
We will be heading home to Australia about 2 months after the baby is born. Is the baby an Australian citizen by birth (we are both Australian)?
Do we have to get an Australian passport for the child - or can it travel on my passport?
If only this were simpler!
Thank you in advance for your time in answering my queries.
Celia

mhunjn
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Re: British PassportFather + Working Visa Mum + Baby on the

Post by mhunjn » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:10 pm

Seem to remember from somewhere that mothers cannot have babies on their passport anymore... so your kid would have to have his/her own passport. This seems to be true for pretty much all the countries now.

I am sure there will be replies about other queries soon...

CeliaCheetham wrote: Do we have to get an Australian passport for the child - or can it travel on my passport?
Celia

Smit
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Location: London

Post by Smit » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:11 pm

Celia,

Your questions have all been covered in this forum, you just need to do some "legwork". A good starter would be to search for posts by JAJ.

S

CeliaCheetham
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Post by CeliaCheetham » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:18 pm

Thanks Smit. Fairly new to this sort of thing and no idea. Have found a few other posts regarding this sort of topic and noone seems to give a definite answer. Not as simple a search topic as ILR + baby or 'working holiday visa' etc.

ppron747
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Post by ppron747 » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:29 pm

I can't answer the Australian questions definitively, but if you're married to your husband and your husband is a British citizen, then your child will certainly be a British citizen, and eligible for a passport immediately he/she emerges. See www.ukps.gov.uk for how to apply.

I think you will also be able to register the baby's birth with the Australian High Commission in London, which will also give him/her Australian citizenship.

Best of luck!
|| paul R.I.P, January, 2007
Want a 2nd opinion? One will be along shortly....

John
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United Kingdom

Post by John » Thu Mar 16, 2006 4:31 pm

The answers are probably buried somewhere on this board, but to get you started, and numbering your questions. :-
  1. Could the baby be eligible for a British passport?
  2. Where do I find such information/how do I apply?
  3. We will be heading home to Australia about 2 months after the baby is born. Is the baby an Australian citizen by birth (we are both Australian)?
  4. Do we have to get an Australian passport for the child - or can it travel on my passport?
  1. Yes, the baby will automatically be British from birth, through its father.
  2. Go to any Post Office .. pick up a child passport application form ... have fun trying to get a pic of the child that complies with the requirements.
  3. I think the answer is "yes" but check with the Australian High Commission in London.
  4. Again check with the Australian High Commission in London but I think the answer should be "yes", the child will need an Australian passport if it is indeed intended to live in Australia for years. Or put it another way, arriving on a British passport when there is an intention to stay for years, rather than just a short visit, might well cause problems on arrival in Australia.
Hope that helps.
John

CeliaCheetham
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Post by CeliaCheetham » Thu Mar 16, 2006 6:05 pm

Thanks John and Paul for your help. John, I don't know if you've tried to find any information on the Aust Commission website, but it is evil, and circular in its logic. They even have a phone number that you can ring that tells you that you can find all information on its website!
Very good start though, and through my searching previous posts (at least recent ones) it seems that the baby WONT be automatically granted Australian citizenship, and I must apply. Sheesh!

JAJ
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Australia

Post by JAJ » Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:43 pm

CeliaCheetham wrote:Thanks John and Paul for your help. John, I don't know if you've tried to find any information on the Aust Commission website, but it is evil, and circular in its logic. They even have a phone number that you can ring that tells you that you can find all information on its website!
Very good start though, and through my searching previous posts (at least recent ones) it seems that the baby WONT be automatically granted Australian citizenship, and I must apply. Sheesh!

Australian citizenship by descent must always be applied for (there should be a note to this effect on the back of your Australian passport).

However - once the application is made, it *will* be granted if the requirements are met. Form 118 is what you need:
http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/pdf/118.pdf

Once the child is an Australian citizen, it must travel to Australia on an Australian passport.



For any future children that you have born in Australia, the situation is:

- child is automatically Australian, being born in Australia with Australian parents. Form 119 can be used to get a citizenship cert (for those born from 20 Aug 1986, birth cert in Australia does not prove citizenship): http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/pdf/119.pdf

- however as your husband is British 'by descent' then the child won't automatically be British, as it would also be born outside the UK. How long has your husband lived in the UK? - this might enable the child to be registered as British.

CeliaCheetham
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Post by CeliaCheetham » Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:34 pm

Many thanks JAJ, very helpful news. My husband has lived here on and off for years (since he was 3) - possibly 10 years all up, but not in a straight run (his parents were roving doctors) so not really sure whee that places us for future spawning.
Funny though, I finally got through to someone with a non-mechanical voice at the British Passports Office, who turned out to be VERY helpful, and also was able to give me some information on the Australian passport situation. The world really is upsidedown.

basis

Post by basis » Fri Mar 17, 2006 5:47 pm

CeliaCheetham wrote:Many thanks JAJ, very helpful news. My husband has lived here on and off for years (since he was 3) - possibly 10 years all up, but not in a straight run (his parents were roving doctors) so not really sure whee that places us for future spawning.
Funny though, I finally got through to someone with a non-mechanical voice at the British Passports Office, who turned out to be VERY helpful, and also was able to give me some information on the Australian passport situation. The world really is upsidedown.
Good to know that.

Would you be able to share the info that you got from him if it is not too personal. In the spirit of these forums i.e share - take and give - info....help each other......

ppron747
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Post by ppron747 » Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:35 pm

CeliaCheetham wrote:....My husband has lived here on and off for years (since he was 3) - possibly 10 years all up, but not in a straight run (his parents were roving doctors) so not really sure whee that places us for future spawning.....
Future children born outside UK should be eligible to be registered as British citizens under section 3(2) of the British Nationality Act 1981 - have a look at Section B of Guide MN1, on this page of the IND website.

The requirements are that
- - the child must have a parent who is a British citizen by descent;
- - the BC parent must have lived in the UK for at least a three year period at any time before the child's birth, and
- - the BC parent must have a parent who is a BC "otherwise than by descent" (eg, born in UK)

The application would need to be made through the British High Commission before the child's first birthday.

It might be worth bearing in mind that this would result in the child's becoming a British citizen by descent, and he/she would not be able to transmit British citizenship to a further generation born outside UK. If you have a child born child in Australia and you're thinking of returning to UK with the family to live, it would be worht considering delaying the child's registration until you return here, because registration under Section C in the Guide would result in the child's being a British citizen "otherwise than by descent".
|| paul R.I.P, January, 2007
Want a 2nd opinion? One will be along shortly....

JAJ
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Australia

Post by JAJ » Sat Mar 18, 2006 6:29 pm

ppron747 wrote: Future children born outside UK should be eligible to be registered as British citizens under section 3(2) of the British Nationality Act 1981 - have a look at Section B of Guide MN1, on this page of the IND website.

The requirements are that
- - the child must have a parent who is a British citizen by descent;
- - the BC parent must have lived in the UK for at least a three year period at any time before the child's birth, and
- - the BC parent must have a parent who is a BC "otherwise than by descent" (eg, born in UK)

The application would need to be made through the British High Commission before the child's first birthday.

Three points to add to what Paul has posted:

- the three year period has to be continuous (allowing for short gaps, no more than 270 days in total)
- for children born since 21 May 2002, parental residence in any of the current British Overseas Territories (other than the Sovereign Base Areas) counts. The Isle of Man and Channel Islands are considered part of the UK regardless of when child was born.
- many people miss the deadline of the first birthday

It might be worth bearing in mind that this would result in the child's becoming a British citizen by descent, and he/she would not be able to transmit British citizenship to a further generation born outside UK. If you have a child born child in Australia and you're thinking of returning to UK with the family to live, it would be worht considering delaying the child's registration until you return here, because registration under Section C in the Guide would result in the child's being a British citizen "otherwise than by descent".
Registration under Section C (section 3(5) of the Act) requires three years residence in the United Kingdom (or a "qualifying territory" if child was born on or afer 21.05.2002). And to come to the UK, the child would need a UK settlement visa on his or her Australian passport.

A further point to note, is that if the family plan to do this, but subseqently change their minds and stay in Australia, then they cannot normally make a "late" application for section 3(2) registration. Unless the change in circumstances was caused for specific reasons.

One further option in this case, would be for the original poster & her husband to delay plans to return to Australia for a while and instead get the mother UK Indefinite Leave to Remain and subsequently British citizenship. As a naturalised British citizen the mother would be British "otherwise than by descent" and hence any Australia born children would be automatically British citizens (by descent), even if the father was British by descent.

The original poster in this case is on a Working Holiday Visa, but has a British husband - it's not clear why someone would want this status rather than that of a spouse visa.

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