What is classified as an over stay???

[AJ2011]

Hello people,

I am apying for a PSW visa and on the application form it asks whether I have ever overstayed in the UK.

A brief summary of my situation is as follows and I am wondering if you can tell whether it is classified as an overstay or not for the purpose of the visa.

In Feb 2011 I applied for student visa extention before the visa expiry date but I forgot to answer one question on form where I asked whether I have ever lived in northern Ireland or not. And because of that my apications was declared invalid and returned. By that time the rules had changed and now a CAS letter was needed rather than a vusa letter. Not knowing, I filled in the section which was left blank on the same form and returned without the CAS letter and my apications wa refused in May. This refusal said that I had no right to appeal but I could make a new application if additional evidence had become available which was not there before. So through a solicitor I made a fresh application with a CAS letter and I got the visa in August 2011. On the subject of the letter the solicitor said 'Out of time application'. This made me even more concerned. Please advise mr whether this is classed as an overstay or the fact that I got my visa, it would e considered as part of the application process??

Regards
AJ2011

[vinny]

Making an 'Out of time application' with no right of appeal would imply that you had overstayed.

[AJ2011]

Thank you for such a prompt reply. So what should I do? If I click yes then what explanation do I give, if any?

And secondly having overstayed would be on my file permanently. Eventually I would like to apply for the permanent settlement under the 10 year rule and I have heard that for that you need to have never overstayed?

What is the best possible plan of action going forward?

Regards
AJ2011

[ouflak1]

Thank you for such a prompt reply. So what should I do? If I click yes then what explanation do I give, if any?

The explanation you have given is quite good. I'd probably go with that one.

And secondly having overstayed would be on my file permanently. Eventually I would like to apply for the permanent settlement under the 10 year rule and I have heard that for that you need to have never overstayed?

What is the best possible plan of action going forward?

Regards
AJ2011

Technically yes, the 10 year qualification is for continuous lawful residence of any kind. Since you were willing to go that far, would 4 more years be too much of stretch for you plans? I don't know if there is much (if any) discretion for consideration of the ten year route. Maybe search the ILR forum to see if anybody has ever gotten such discretion.

[geriatrix]

When did you receive refusal of first application?
When did you submit the second application?
When did you received refusal of the second application?
When did you submit the out-of-time application?
When did your Tier 4 / student leave (that was valid in Feb. when you applied for extension) expire?

[AJ2011]

@ouflak1: I am thinking on a long term basis and dont want to make a decision that works now and then doesn't work in the log run. Ultimately the aim is to settle here and yes I am willing to stay four more years but if this overstay will ruin the chances of that and there is no hope to settlement then I would have to reconsider my options. I would appreciate if anyone knows a way that it could work.

@sushdmehta: please find the dates below:
first Tier 4 expiry date: 28-02-2010
First application made: 11-02-2010
Declared invalid and returned due to being incomplete: 20-03-2010
Resubmitted application: 02-04-2010
Refused with noright to appeal but option to make a fresh apiation on: 10-06-2010
New application with CAS letter submitted: 03-07-2010
Tier 4 visa granted on: 05-08-2010

I must also mention that since my stay everything has been light and I have always done everything according to the laws. But this unfortunate incident has made things difficult for me.

I just want to put this think behind me and not have to worry about it on every appellation. And if I have to mention then what do I need to mention precisely so it doesnt get rejected.

Thank you

[geriatrix]

As per the information given, it appears that you were an overstayer (with no legal permission to remain in the UK) between 20-Mar-10 and 05-Aug-10.

That your second out-of-time application (10-Jun-10) was subsequently approved doesn't make your illegal stay legal.

[Greenie]

As per the information given, it appears that you were an overstayer (with no legal permission to remain in the UK) between 20-Mar-10 and 05-Aug-10.

That your second out-of-time application (10-Jun-10) was subsequently approved doesn't make your illegal stay legal.

I would say that the overstay was from 28/02/2010 as this was when the OP's Tier 4 visa expired. His application was declared invalid and therefore treated as if it was never made.

[AJ2011]

What you both have said makes sense. I appreciate your help. Thank you. So making an application for PSW should I just fill in the form and attach a cover letter explaining thing as they are??

[geriatrix]

As per the information given, it appears that you were an overstayer (with no legal permission to remain in the UK) between 20-Mar-10 and 05-Aug-10.

That your second out-of-time application (10-Jun-10) was subsequently approved doesn't make your illegal stay legal.

I would say that the overstay was from 28/02/2010 as this was when the OP's Tier 4 visa expired. His application was declared invalid and therefore treated as if it was never made.

Agree! Missed the point (invalid application - though was submitted in-time).

[geriatrix]

1. A covering letter to explain the facts clearly will help.
2. In terms of your aim to apply for settlement under long residence, I am afraid that the ILR clock reset and (re)started from 05-Aug-10. Plan your future accordingly.

[lboro]

2. In terms of your aim to apply for settlement under long residence, I am afraid that the ILR clock reset and (re)started from 05-Aug-10. Plan your future accordingly.

I think you can aim for 14 year rule if you are planning for long residence concession. Though this category is likely to change in a very near future so have a back up plan as well!

[ouflak1]

1. A covering letter to explain the facts clearly will help.
2. In terms of your aim to apply for settlement under long residence, I am afraid that the ILR clock reset and (re)started from 05-Aug-10. Plan your future accordingly.

I would have thought that for the 14 year option, any combination of legal and illegal stay would count? From his description, he can certainly demonstrate that he was in-country during the period in question.

[geriatrix]

My response was in reference to the above statement from the OP mentioning "10 year" long residence. Should have made it clear, apologies!

Eventually I would like to apply for the permanent settlement under the 10 year rule and I have heard that for that you need to have never overstayed?

[AJ2011]

I was going back to my documentation and I think that when the solicitor made the application in July 2010 after the refusal, in that form we selected 'No' when asked if I had ever overstayed. I am not sure....