Same sex marriage and free movement?

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

4 or 5 EEA countries now have same s.e.x marriages.

In theory this should allow the non-EU spouse free movement rights within the EU.

Anyone in same-sex relationship have any experience with applying (under European law) for an Irish visa or Residence Card? All straight forward? Are you legally married, and if so where was the marriage?

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

[duplicate deleted]

[walrusgumble]

4 or 5 EEA countries now have same s.e.x marriages.

In theory this should allow the non-EU spouse free movement rights within the EU.

Anyone in same-gender relationship have any experience with applying (under European law) for an Irish visa or Residence Card? All straight forward? Are you legally married, and if so where was the marriage?

My sister is a barrister, her husband (solicitor) succeed in these applications, under EU law and surprise surprise Irish domestic law involving Irish citizens.

Only if the state you wish to go to recognizes same sex marriages or civil partnerships/ de facto relationships

(Ireland does recognise same sex civil partnerships and hetrosexual de facto relationship - surely same sex ones too)

You would however, succeed on the basis of Article 3.2 of Directive or even Article 2 as Ireland does recognize civil partnership and they do recognize de facto same sex couples (but marriage itself).

So, such a couple would succeed. I would also imagine that the Minister for justice would unlikely wish to get involved in an embarrassing (for him) political and social confrontation in refusing genuine couples.

Its straight forward. Same conditions and criteria as hetrosexual cases.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Only if the state you wish to go to recognizes same gender marriages or civil partnerships/ de facto relationships

That is true for civil partnerships.

I do not think that is true for same s.e.x. marriages. I think in that case the partner would be considered a "spouse" and so there is not discretion for the member state to recognize it or not.

Extract from primary family member definitions:

(a) the spouse;

(b) the partner with whom the Union citizen has contracted a registered partnership, on the basis of the legislation of a Member State, if the legislation of the host Member State treats registered partnerships as equivalent to marriage and in accordance with the conditions laid down in the relevant legislation of the host Member State;

[walrusgumble]

Only if the state you wish to go to recognizes same gender marriages or civil partnerships/ de facto relationships

That is true for civil partnerships.

I do not think that is true for same s.e.x. marriages. I think in that case the partner would be considered a "spouse" and so there is not discretion for the member state to recognize it or not.

Extract from primary family member definitions:

(a) the spouse;

(b) the partner with whom the Union citizen has contracted a registered partnership, on the basis of the legislation of a Member State, if the legislation of the host Member State treats registered partnerships as equivalent to marriage and in accordance with the conditions laid down in the relevant legislation of the host Member State;

One would not succeed for same sex marriages basis, in Ireland.

But they could quite legitimately apply on defacto relationship (under Art 3.2). The fact that they legally lived in another EU state and can prove genuine relationship , like the marriage certificate would hammer the ball into the net.

In addition, even though the marriage in the home country would not be a "civil partnership" as its the "real deal", unless one is completely stupid, one would clearly see that the former thrumps the latter. Therefore all though they are not "a civil partnership" but a marriage, they would surely meet the "civil partnership" definition, all the same, in Article 2

[walrusgumble]

Only if the state you wish to go to recognizes same gender marriages or civil partnerships/ de facto relationships

That is true for civil partnerships.

I do not think that is true for same s.e.x. marriages. I think in that case the partner would be considered a "spouse" and so there is not discretion for the member state to recognize it or not.

Extract from primary family member definitions:

(a) the spouse;

(b) the partner with whom the Union citizen has contracted a registered partnership, on the basis of the legislation of a Member State, if the legislation of the host Member State treats registered partnerships as equivalent to marriage and in accordance with the conditions laid down in the relevant legislation of the host Member State;

Returning to marriage issue. Ireland will be entitled to plenty of leeway there, or there would be war, with countries like Poland and other "Conservative Catholic" Countries

Under Irish law, the only valid definition on marriage is hetrosexual marriage. There is no such thing, in IReland as same sex marriages. In Ireland, same sex civil partnership is nowhere in the same field as marriage (in reality similar, but not the same rights)

That however, wont stop people succeeding on other basis .

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

But in this case, there will be same-s.e.x EU+non-EU couples who have married in the Netherlands, Belgium, Norway, Spain, Portugal, Sweden, ... coming to Ireland. They do not have a "registered partnership"; they have a simple official marriage certificate.

DOJ is going to need to let them in one way or another. They have to accept their marriage certificate and issue a visa or Residence Card. However they account for it internally in DOJ, in the end the person enters Ireland like any other spouse.