Marrying a non EU citizen

[timbowen]

Hi, my girlfriend and I met online at the start of this year. She's from Australia and we met up a number of times over the summer. In September one of her friends got a job in Europe so she travelled over with them and has been living with them so she can visit me more easily. We have spent a lot of time together and have decided we want to make a real go of it.

She is going to come over in January and we plan on living together. As far as I am aware she would then have to leave after 6 months. Is there any way that she wouldn't have to leave? I have a good job and can support us both easily, we just want to be together and not have to spend any time apart.

For example if we were to get married or engaged would she be able to stay?

If she does have to go back to Australia how long would it be for?

Any help is appreciated,

Thanks.

[ppron747]

Have a look at the UK Ancestry Visa and Working Holiday Visa for starters....

[timbowen]

Cheers, from what I can gather I don't think she'll qualify for either of those. Are there any other options available?

[John]

For example if we were to get married or engaged would she be able to stay?

If marriage is on the cards then do appreciate that she will need to obtain a suitable visa before she leaves Australia. She cannot just turn up as a visitor and get 6 months permission to stay.

So where might the marriage take place? If outside the UK, get married first and then she would apply for a spouse visa. If the marriage is to happen in the UK, she should apply for a fiancée visa, and then travel to the UK, and then get married during the 6-month validity of the fiancée visa.

Suggest you go to this webpage and then download the VAF2 application form and the INF 4 Guidance Notes (and don't be put off my the title of those notes ... they is a section on fiancé(e) applications.

You will appreciate that lots of supporting evidence needed for a spouse or fiancée visa application.

If she does come here as a mere visitor it will not be possible to marry, and she would need to return to Australia to apply for the fiancée visa, or maybe you both would fly there, get married there, and then she would apply for a spouse visa.

[timbowen]

OK, so your basically saying that there's no way that she won't have to go back at some point? Is there nothing she can do while she's here for 6 months to enable her to stay longer?

The thing is she's already left Austalia because she travelled to Europe to stay with the friend so she could visit here more easily. She is planning on coming over from Europe in January and we were planning on living together.

How long does application for these visas take?

We are serious about getting married and it would be what we both want, it's not just to enable her to stay. If we were to marry here, basically she could come for 6 months, we would spend that time together (which would help as evidence needed) then she would return to Australia apply for the fiancee visa then return and we'd get married. How long would this take?

This is really annoying, all we want to do is be together.

[John]

OK, so your basically saying that there's no way that she won't have to go back at some point? Is there nothing she can do while she's here for 6 months to enable her to stay longer?

Nothing? Well nothing you would really want to hear! For example if she breaks a leg near the end of her 6 months, and thus is medically unable to travel, she probably would succeed in getting an extension in the UK. Apart from that sort of thing, no. And all that would do is delay the return to Australia.

So she will need to return to Australia to apply for .... well something. Sounds like that is either going to be a fiancee visa .... so that she can return to the UK and get married here .... or alternatively the two of you get married, either in Australia, or somewhere on-route such as Thailand, and then she applies in Australia for a spouse visa.

[timbowen]

OK cheers. So it looks like we live here for 6 months and then she goes back and applies for a fiancee visa. I assume the 6 months living together will be beneficial for the application. I take it you don't know how long this would take? Is it possible to say, start the application while she is here (I see you can apply online) so she just has to go back to complete the paperwork.

Would there be any benefit in getting married abroad and doing the spouse visa as opposed to the fiancee one?

It's just I work full time. If I work late and make up hours I could probably get 4 weeks off in July so would be able to go over with her then.

Thanks for all your help.

[Wanderer]

OK cheers. So it looks like we live here for 6 months and then she goes back and applies for a fiancee visa. I assume the 6 months living together will be beneficial for the application. I take it you don't know how long this would take? Is it possible to say, start the application while she is here (I see you can apply online) so she just has to go back to complete the paperwork.

Would there be any benefit in getting married abroad and doing the spouse visa as opposed to the fiancee one?

It's just I work full time. If I work late and make up hours I could probably get 4 weeks off in July so would be able to go over with her then.

Thanks for all your help.

I would also be wary of the ramifications of treating a VV as a settlement visa. Maybe just use three months of it?

I say this because my gf got her wrists slapped for spending three months here on a six month visa, and the next one was nearly refused. She's a visa national tho.

Visitors Visas are just that, for visits, not for trial marriages - wrong visa and our Gov doesn't like folks being here on the wrong visa!

Just my opinion and experience of one case!

Steve

[John]

Sorry I neglected your "how long" question. I think in Australia the best indication is "a week or two". So if your holiday time is limited, and you get married in Australia, certainly don't plan to travel back together.

Getting married and applying for a spouse visa .... compared to ... applying for a fiancée visa? Well it does reduce the number of visa applications by one, and thus cuts out the cost and hassle of making that application. It also means that as soon as she arrives back with her spouse visa, she is legally entitled to work, whereas if she comes on a fiancée visa, no work is permitted until after the marriage and the conversion of the fiancée visa into a spouse visa in the UK.

If you want to get married and then apply for a spouse visa, but your holiday time is limited, do consider getting legally married in Thailand, and then you could have the honeymoon there, after which you would fly back to the UK to resume work, and she would fly on to Australia and apply for the visa.

I make that suggestion because although there is a procedure to go through, there is no minimum time to spend in Thailand before being able to get legally married ... unlike in many other countries. It is quite possible to be legally married 4 or 5 days after arriving in the country.

If this suggestion is worth pursuing, just let me know and I shall post links to the relevant webpages on the British Embassy and Australian Embassy websites in Bangkok, both of which give more information.

[timbowen]

OK cheers. So it looks like we live here for 6 months and then she goes back and applies for a fiancee visa. I assume the 6 months living together will be beneficial for the application. I take it you don't know how long this would take? Is it possible to say, start the application while she is here (I see you can apply online) so she just has to go back to complete the paperwork.

Would there be any benefit in getting married abroad and doing the spouse visa as opposed to the fiancee one?

It's just I work full time. If I work late and make up hours I could probably get 4 weeks off in July so would be able to go over with her then.

Thanks for all your help.

I would also be wary of the ramifications of treating a VV as a settlement visa. Maybe just use three months of it?

I say this because my gf got her wrists slapped for spending three months here on a six month visa, and the next one was nearly refused. She's a visa national tho.

Visitors Visas are just that, for visits, not for trial marriages - wrong visa and our Gov doesn't like folks being here on the wrong visa!

Just my opinion and experience of one case!

Steve

Hmm OK, I'll bear that in mind. Not sure I understand why it's the wrong visa. She'd be visiting me for 6 months. She's not wanting to work or anything, just for us to be together. If we applied for a fiancee visa now, I don't know if we'd have spent enough time together for her to get one.
This all seems crazy to me, I mean Australia is even part of the commonwealth.

[Dawie]

OK cheers. So it looks like we live here for 6 months and then she goes back and applies for a fiancee visa. I assume the 6 months living together will be beneficial for the application. I take it you don't know how long this would take? Is it possible to say, start the application while she is here (I see you can apply online) so she just has to go back to complete the paperwork.

Would there be any benefit in getting married abroad and doing the spouse visa as opposed to the fiancee one?

It's just I work full time. If I work late and make up hours I could probably get 4 weeks off in July so would be able to go over with her then.

Thanks for all your help.

I would also be wary of the ramifications of treating a VV as a settlement visa. Maybe just use three months of it?

I say this because my gf got her wrists slapped for spending three months here on a six month visa, and the next one was nearly refused. She's a visa national tho.

Visitors Visas are just that, for visits, not for trial marriages - wrong visa and our Gov doesn't like folks being here on the wrong visa!

Just my opinion and experience of one case!

Steve

Hmm OK, I'll bear that in mind. Not sure I understand why it's the wrong visa. She'd be visiting me for 6 months. She's not wanting to work or anything, just for us to be together. If we applied for a fiancee visa now, I don't know if we'd have spent enough time together for her to get one.
This all seems crazy to me, I mean Australia is even part of the commonwealth.

I think the point about your girlfriend staying in the UK for 6 months as a visitor is that it will look rather suspicious to immigration officials. It is inevitable that questions would be raised in the future by curious immigration officials about how she managed to support herself for so long without employment. The natural deduction would be that she must have been engaged in illegal employment in the UK to support herself for so long. So after living in the UK as a visitor for 6 months and then going back to Australia to obtain a fiance visa she's more than likely going to run into some trouble at the British Embassy there about what she had been doing in the UK for the preceding 6 months.

[timbowen]

OK cheers. So it looks like we live here for 6 months and then she goes back and applies for a fiancee visa. I assume the 6 months living together will be beneficial for the application. I take it you don't know how long this would take? Is it possible to say, start the application while she is here (I see you can apply online) so she just has to go back to complete the paperwork.

Would there be any benefit in getting married abroad and doing the spouse visa as opposed to the fiancee one?

It's just I work full time. If I work late and make up hours I could probably get 4 weeks off in July so would be able to go over with her then.

Thanks for all your help.

I would also be wary of the ramifications of treating a VV as a settlement visa. Maybe just use three months of it?

I say this because my gf got her wrists slapped for spending three months here on a six month visa, and the next one was nearly refused. She's a visa national tho.

Visitors Visas are just that, for visits, not for trial marriages - wrong visa and our Gov doesn't like folks being here on the wrong visa!

Just my opinion and experience of one case!

Steve

Hmm OK, I'll bear that in mind. Not sure I understand why it's the wrong visa. She'd be visiting me for 6 months. She's not wanting to work or anything, just for us to be together. If we applied for a fiancee visa now, I don't know if we'd have spent enough time together for her to get one.
This all seems crazy to me, I mean Australia is even part of the commonwealth.

I think the point about your girlfriend staying in the UK for 6 months as a visitor is that it will look rather suspicious to immigration officials. It is inevitable that questions would be raised in the future by curious immigration officials about how she managed to support herself for so long without employment. The natural deduction would be that she must have been engaged in illegal employment in the UK to support herself for so long. So after living in the UK as a visitor for 6 months and then going back to Australia to obtain a fiance visa she's more than likely going to run into some trouble at the British Embassy there about what she had been doing in the UK for the preceding 6 months.

Ah OK, well, she has savings and I earn enough to support us both anyway. She would be staying with me so wouldn't pay rent or anything of course.
If they raise questions and we explain this. Surely they shouldn't base a decision on assumptions. If I show what I earn and they know she has savings and has been living with me then surely that would be OK.
I don't get why they put a 6 month limit on the visitor visa if they frown upon you using it for that long.

[John]

timbowen, a number of points here. Firstly don't just assume that your fiancée will get 6 months permission to stay in the UK, when she arrives at the UK Port of Entry. Indeed it is not even safe to assume that she will be allowed in at all! OK she probably will get in but if you are looking for a 100% guarantee, sorry it is not possible to give that.

Quite a number of non-Visa Nationals, intending to visit, do get sent straight back from whence they came.

And 6 months is the maximum and again it should not be assumed that the Immigration Officer will grant that length of time.

Having said all that, I don't share the concern of others about staying as a visitor for 6 months. I don't think it will cause a problem when the application is made for a fiancée visa or spouse visa in Australia. What would cause a problem is multiple lengthy periods of time in the UK. That could well be problematic. But that is not what is proposed.

What is imperative is that she does not overstay her visitor visa ... however long it is.