PR certificate before naturalisation?

[MSaxp]

Hi,

I am an EU national (Greek)and I have been in the Uk since oct-05. Studying until Sep 06 then staying with friends for 4 months and since Feb 07 in full time employment. I thought applying for naturalisation now might be difficult due to the 4 months of looking for work in 2006. So thought I'd wait until my 6 years of employment, wouldn't want to waste £851. Is it better if I get the certificate of permanent resident first and then apply for citizenship 12months later? Or just a waste of time as I am a permanent resident anyway? Does having the PR certificate make the application easier to go through?

On top of that are P60s enough to prove employment or is it better if I send pay slips as well? Thanks

[friendinneed]

The advantage of doing PR first is the fact that its free and so if there is some issue (eg you didnt have health insurance during your non-employment period) you find out without losing money.

The downside of applying for PR first is the fact it takes so long, you lose your passport for the full period and there is no way to fast track or avoid sending the passport.

Ours was slightly different as a non-EU family member with retained rights and so did the PR application so we could travel between getting PR and getting BC - having a non-EU passport with an expired family stamp but arguing you've retained rights with the guy on the border desk didnt sound fun to us.

When we applied for the BC we simply put the date of PR as per the stamp and left the whole EEA section blank on the form (was also spouse of BC by that time) and had no questions raised.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

...The downside of applying for PR first is the fact it takes so long...

Not for an EU national, should be issued as soon as possible.

[Jambo]

Assuming you are not in a rush to become BC (for EU national, it doesn't carry many benefits anyway), I would suggest applying now for PR confirmation using your employment evidence from 2007 till now. The application should take 1-2 months and you can send your national ID card instead of a passport so will not affect your travels. After 1 year from the PR confirmation, apply for BC.

You can apply earlier if you wish but this way is the simplest (although not the quickest).

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Jambo, I've a question for you. I understand that to be able to apply for BC, one has to be free from immigration control for a year (unless married to a UK national).

For an EU national, that would generally mean achieve PR. The rules for absences for PR are reasonably clear to me.

What I am not clear on are the absence rules for BC with PR.

Let's say an EU has a PR card.

(1) What absences are they allowed immediately before applying for BC? (2) Can absences prior to PR being achieved affect residence requirements for BC?

[MSaxp]

Thanks for that. With regards to documents, while the guidelines say ,including this and that, will I be OK sending just the 5 p60s and a few utilities bills/ bank statements / council tax bills for say every 6 months of the 5 years? I have everything but thought I'd rather not bury them under my paperwork

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

...a few utilities bills/ bank statements / council tax bills for say every 6 months of the 5 years...

One for each year would be fine for PR application.

[Jambo]

but thought I'd rather not bury them under my paperwork

A very reasonable approach. If I was IO, I would appreciate that (for me - your employment record already proves residence. At least as strong as your council tax bills).

[Jambo]

(1) What absences are they allowed immediately before applying for BC?

If not married to BC, absences allowed are:

* 450 days during the 5 years before the application is made.
* 90 days in the year before applying.

If married to BC:

* 270 days in the 3 years before applying.
* 90 days in the year before applying.

(2) Can absences prior to PR being achieved affect residence requirements for BC?

They could be counted as part of the 450/270 days in the 5/3 years residence period.

As EEA regulations allow up to 180 days of absence a year to achieve PR. One might achieve PR but not meet the requirement for BC.

[friendinneed]

Not for an EU national, should be issued as soon as possible.

What should and does happen can be two different things. A friend (spanish national) applied 7 months ago and still no PR

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

[A friend (spanish national) applied 7 months ago and still no PR

Then they should complain. I can assure you I know of applications that took less than four weeks.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

(1) What absences are they allowed immediately before applying for BC?

If not married to BC, absences allowed are:

* 450 days during the 5 years before the application is made.
* 90 days in the year before applying.

If married to BC:

* 270 days in the 3 years before applying.
* 90 days in the year before applying.

(2) Can absences prior to PR being achieved affect residence requirements for BC?

They could be counted as part of the 450/270 days in the 5/3 years residence period.

As EEA regulations allow up to 180 days of absence a year to achieve PR. One might achieve PR but not meet the requirement for BC.

Thanks Jambo, That's very interesting. I knew it was not as straight forward as wait an extra year, but didn't know the detail.