Pregnant Portuguese national moving to the UK

[Nalwoir]

Hello,

I am a British national who has been residing in South Korea for a year on a 1 year working contract. While here, I have married an American woman who is now pregnant. Her father was Portuguese so we have recently applied for her Portuguese passport so that she is free to enter and remain in the UK without restriction (rather than fulfill the rather weighty spouse visa requirements).

My questions is, when we return to the UK in August, she will be heavily pregnant. I understand that the NHS will have to assess her case and review whether she intends to remain in the UK as an ordinary resident to be eligible for free healthcare. However, would she have any difficulty entering the country on her Portuguese passport? Would her pregnancy be considered a pre existing condition or something?

In short, as an American with a Portuguese passport and pregnant, is it possible that she will have difficulties being admitted to the country to give birth?

Thank you for your help.

Nalwoir.

[Jambo]

She is not American with with a Portuguese passport but rather a dual national - American/Portuguese with a passport.

She should have no problem to enter the UK as a Portuguese.

[MPH80]

To be honest - I'd be more worried about whether the airline will let her on the plane - and that all depends HOW pregnant she is at that point.

[Nalwoir]

She is indeed a dual citizen. I just wanted it clear that she was initially an American and is now both American and Portuguese.



She will be approximately 31 weeks pregnant when we intend on flying. Most airlines these days look at that as the point when they require a doctors note in advance that clears her as unlikely to go into labour and to not having a complicated pregnancy. So far she has had a perfect pregnancy, and so we think the airlines should be fine with taking her as long as we secure the note in advance.

It is good to know she will have no issues going into the country. So just to clarify, the British immigration services will not look at her pregnancy as grounds to refuse her entry on medical reasons?

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

She can be refused entry, but only on three possible grounds:
(1) she is a direct and ongoing threat to British national security
(2) she is a direct and ongoing threat to public policy
(3) she has a serious WHO listed contagious disease.

Being pregnant falls into non of these categories.

When she gets to the UK, she should go to the local doctor's surgery and immediately register with them. As long as she is not planning to be in the UK for a few weeks, and then leave, she is entitled to NHS coverage. They will start prenatal support work, and will arrange for the local midwife to get in touch with her.

It is a big long move for a pregnant person to make. My wife would never have done it at that stage. Expect the transition will not be as smooth as it might be in fully optimal situation.

Is she already Portugese and she is just simply applying for a passport?
Where were you born? In the UK? Are you a British citizen or a British national?

[Nalwoir]

Is she already Portugese and she is just simply applying for a passport?
Where were you born? In the UK? Are you a British citizen or a British national?

She was born in America to a Portuguese family. She has already claimed her Portuguese nationality and is in the process of awaiting her Passport.

I was born in the UK, in Kent, to two English parents. I am not sure if this qualifies me as a British citizen or a British national.

We are aware the situation is not ideal, but in our minds having the baby in South Korea where the doctors are efficient but do not speak the best English is not the optimal situation for giving birth. There are a variety of other factors involved as well, but being in the UK gives us family support, and then allows me to return to University to get my PGCE which is the whole reason I came to South Korea in the first place (teach in South Korea to get experience for the PGCE).

My main worry at this point is the NHS. To be eligible we need to supply evidence that we intend to remain in the UK or we can end up paying for the birth. We can afford to pay, but the money would be much more useful ensuring we can survive until I find a job. I have written to the hospital I would want her to have the birth, and asked them what they think of the matter, and if they would be willing to accept her in this particular situation.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

My main worry at this point is the NHS. To be eligible we need to supply evidence that we intend to remain in the UK or we can end up paying for the birth. We can afford to pay, but the money would be much more useful ensuring we can survive until I find a job. I have written to the hospital I would want her to have the birth, and asked them what they think of the matter, and if they would be willing to accept her in this particular situation.

You do not normally need to supply such evidence. You normally need to go to your Doctor's office and register. Actually, they give you a form, you fill it in, and then you return it in the future. Very simple and straight forward.

http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/1087.aspx?C ... goryID=162

NHS hospital treatment in England

If you move to the UK, you will not be charged for NHS hospital treatment from the date that you arrive, as long as:
you intend to live permanently in the UK, and
you’re legally entitled to live here on a permanent basis
[...]
If you’re not entitled to live in the UK permanently but you’ve applied to the Home Office to enter or stay, you’ll be charged for hospital treatment until:
your application is granted, or
you have 12 months’ lawful residence in the UK

Note the final clause. It tells people who are not entitled to live in the UK permanently that they will be charged for the first year. But both you and your wife are entitled to remain forever and ever.

This is actually a very stupid and misleading page, designed it seems to cause confusion.

But I think you will find you have no problem when you arrive.

Is she already Portugese and she is just simply applying for a passport?
Where were you born? In the UK? Are you a British citizen or a British national?

She was born in America to a Portuguese family. She has already claimed her Portuguese nationality and is in the process of awaiting her Passport.

I was born in the UK, in Kent, to two English parents. I am not sure if this qualifies me as a British citizen or a British national

You are a British citizen "other than by decent". So the baby will be British no matter where it is born. The baby is also likely to be Portugese (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portuguese ... ese_parent). I would urge you to get several extra copies of the long form birth certificate when you register the baby. Cheap and easy to do early.


What documents does your wife have that prove she is Portugese? You could both move today as long as she has some sort of documentation that says she is Portugese. Passport is not needed.

[Nalwoir]

She has her identity card, do you think she can use it to enter the country? We could fly back on her American passport, and on arrival use the card as proof of her eligibility to remain in the country.

Are there any monetary requirements for her upon arrival at immigration? Such as proving her ability to remain in the UK without recourse to public funds?

With regards to the NHS, apparently intention to remain is not as easy to prove as one might hope. They ask for documents to show you have things set up in the country that prove you are living there longterm, such as housing agreements, job contracts and other permanent documentation. I was thinking about what would happen if they charged us, we took out a payment plan over a longtime and then appealed later when it is proven that we have remained in the UK for a sufficient amount of time. This is not optimal, and I wish they would just lay out the regulatonss allow us to know what might happen.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

She has her identity card, do you think she can use it to enter the country? We could fly back on her American passport, and on arrival use the card as proof of her eligibility to remain in the country.

She 100% does NOT need a passport for entry into the UK. An Portuguese ID card is explicitly allowed as a way of identifying herself. You can fly tomorrow!

Are there any monetary requirements for her upon arrival at immigration? Such as proving her ability to remain in the UK without recourse to public funds?

Absolutely none. The border guards are in fact prohibited by an ECJ case from requiring answers to any questions about that she will be doing in the UK or about funds.

With regards to the NHS, apparently intention to remain is not as easy to prove as one might hope. They ask for documents to show you have things set up in the country that prove you are living there longterm, such as housing agreements, job contracts and other permanent documentation. I was thinking about what would happen if they charged us, we took out a payment plan over a longtime and then appealed later when it is proven that we have remained in the UK for a sufficient amount of time. This is not optimal, and I wish they would just lay out the regulatonss allow us to know what might happen.

I have registered twice times with the NHS. I have never had to prove my intent. And think about it: how do you prove intent?

You will in any case get full service from the NHS from day 0. And believe me, they can not and will not charge either you or your wife. Unless, that is, you have a clear intent to leave the UK shortly after getting medical services, though it does not sound like that is the case.

[Nalwoir]

Hmm interesting. Does the ID card cover her to fly as well, or would she require a passport? I am only wondering because if she flies to the UK using her American passport and then shows her Portuguese ID at immigration I don't want it to cause issues. If she can use the ID card for the whole process it removes any uncertainty in that respect.

Can you provide any links to that ECJ case? We have money but since it will mainly be here in korea, and then transfered back to the UK before we leave it is a pain trying to send it back early, then have a bank statement mailed out here as proof of our finances.

We fully intend on remaining in the UK for a long good while. My wife and I have both now worked as teachers and want to go back to the UK to teach in the south east. You are helping to ease my worries here dude, thanks so much.

[Jambo]

Hmm interesting. Does the ID card cover her to fly as well, or would she require a passport? I am only wondering because if she flies to the UK using her American passport and then shows her Portuguese ID at immigration I don't want it to cause issues. If she can use the ID card for the whole process it removes any uncertainty in that respect.

.

She can only use the ID on flights within the EU. However, she can show her US passport in Korea (when exiting the county and at the check in desk) and the Portuguese ID when entering the UK. This is accepted practice for dual nationals and she will have no issues do so. In fact, sometimes it is the only possible practice as some countries (the US for example) requires you to enter and exit using their passport if you are a citizen.

Can you provide any links to that ECJ case? We have money but since it will mainly be here in korea, and then transfered back to the UK before we leave it is a pain trying to send it back early, then have a bank statement mailed out here as proof of our finances.

You worry too much about this part. She would just need to show her ID to get examined and two seconds later (no questions asked) be allowed to enter.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Hmm interesting. Does the ID card cover her to fly as well, or would she require a passport? I am only wondering because if she flies to the UK using her American passport and then shows her Portuguese ID at immigration I don't want it to cause issues. If she can use the ID card for the whole process it removes any uncertainty in that respect.

.

She can only use the ID on flights within the EU. However, she can show her US passport in Korea (when exiting the county and at the check in desk) and the Portuguese ID when entering the UK. This is accepted practice for dual nationals and she will have no issues do so. In fact, sometimes it is the only possible practice as some countries (the US for example) requires you to enter and exit using their passport if you are a citizen.

Can you provide any links to that ECJ case? We have money but since it will mainly be here in korea, and then transfered back to the UK before we leave it is a pain trying to send it back early, then have a bank statement mailed out here as proof of our finances.

You worry too much about this part. She would just need to show her ID to get examined and two seconds later (no questions asked) be allowed to enter.

I agree with all of this. Entering the UK with the Portugese ID is normal and day-to-day. Germans do it. French do it. And for a few months British citizens could do it for entry into other EU member states, before the ID card was eliminated.

As EU citizens, you each have the right to enter all the other EU member states. She has exactly the same rights as you do. I personally have NEVER been asked whether I have enough money with me when I enter France or Germany or Italy or Norway or Spain or Portugal or the Netherlands or Belgium or Ireland or Austria or Slovenia or Czech Republic.

If you are curious I will give you the link to the case. But be 100% sure that it is not relevant to your actual entry into the UK. For fun reading at home only! http://eumovement.wordpress.com/law-ecj ... ands-1991/

[Nalwoir]

You guys are all great. Many worries and fears are eased. Just gotta get working on finishing up work here in SK and moving on home. Thanks for all your help!

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

The child will likely also be a US citizen, depending on exactly when your wife resided in the US: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... es_citizen

Again: If you are in the UK, purchase 2 or so extra long form birth certificates when you register the baby's birth. Roughly £5 each. Short firm are not worth the paper they are printed on

[cmd]

Hello!
I just wanted to add another voice and personal experience to reassure you that registering at your local GP in order to use NHS services is VERY simple. Just as mentioned before, you fill in a form basically just asking for your contact details and off you go. My husband is Mauritanian and even not being from the EU no questions were asked (he is legally entitled to be here I hasten to add!).
I can empathise with you and your wife: I'm a British citizen and taught in Portugal for several years where I met my husband. We're now in the UK expecting our first child in a couple of months Came back here for similar reasons eg. family support and NHS care, though we did move just before I got pregnant. Glad your wife is keeping well and I wish you both the very best for the move. Good luck!!