Schengen visa for family member of EU citizen (German)

[evil_grrrl666]

Hi Everyone!
I'm a German citizen, married to an Indian citizen and we have been living in the UK for over 4 years now. Things used to be pretty straightforward the last time we got a Schengen visa for my husband from the German embassy in London - simply applied by post with the simple 2 page form (and the difficult questions such as finance etc. weren't required for family members of EU citizens). A few days later they would send us the visa, no questions asked and without charge.

So now that his passport has been renewed and he needs a new Schengen visa I was unpleasantly surprised to find that the German embassy has outsourced their visa processing to VFS Global, and applications are now supposedly taking 2 weeks minimum. Not only that, it seems they insist on charging their admin fees even to family members of EU citizens even though under the EU directive it should be free of charge? In fact this annoyed us so much that we decided to just travel without a visa in August because we didn't have 2 weeks after he had finally received his new passport. However we'd like to get this sorted just to save time having to argue with border control people who might not be completely clued in on European law.

Have the rules been changed drastically since the last time we applied for a visa and we just never realised? Is this enforceable? It seems they are no longer concerned about speedy and free visa applications for EU citizens' families exercising their right to free movement?

Is there any scope in arguing about this or should we just count ourselves lucky we only have to pay a service charge and not the visa fee as well?

Thanks for your help.
L.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

http://www.london.diplo.de/Vertretung/l ... tment.html

Postal Applications

Spouses of EU and German nationals and certain categories of travellers can also apply by post. Please note that from 31 August 2012 postal applications need to be sent to Manchester:

Joint Visa Application Centre

40 Princess Street
Manchester
M1 6DE

Further information can be found on the VFS website:
http://www.vfsglobal.com/germany/uk/allaboutvisas.html
Please note that no postal applications can be sent to the Embassy anymore. Postal applications that are addressed to the Embassy will be returned to the sender without being processed!!!

[evil_grrrl666]

Yes indeed I saw that, thanks for the comment though.

And then I clicked through to the information on the VFS site and saw regarding charges the following text:
"All Postal applications must enclose a postal order addressed to ‘the German Visa Application centre’ for the amount of (visa fee £48 + service fee £16 + status updates £ 1.20) total = £65.20 (when applying as EU spouse, service charge of £16.00 is still applicable). "


My question is, isn't it against the directive to charge this silly service charge for something that is meant to be free?

[sum1]

According to Article 17 in the Visa Code a service fee is possible but I would understand point 5 therein that the visa application can still be done directly with the embassy (and that's independent of the Directive).

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

Definitely do not pay the service fee. Raise a stink! They are way out of line.

Note that the schengen documents are http://eumovement.wordpress.com/other-schengen/

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Concur that service fee should be avoidable. Complain.

[evil_grrrl666]

Thanks for the advice I've emailed VFS stating that I expect my application to be accepted without paying them the service fee. And if they refuse I'll complain to the embassy directly that they should accept my application without involving VFS in accordance with EU regulations.
Let's see what they say.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Thanks for the advice :) I've emailed VFS stating that I expect my application to be accepted without paying them the service fee. And if they refuse I'll complain to the embassy directly that they should accept my application without involving VFS in accordance with EU regulations.
Let's see what they say.

Good for you, please post back when you have this resolved.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

I'm a German citizen, married to an Indian citizen and we have been living in the UK for over 4 years now.

An another topic, does your spouse not have any UK-issued residence documents? If he had a residence card for example, he would not need a visa in the first instance.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

For future reference, it is also worth being aware of: http://eumovement.wordpress.com/2010/08 ... to-travel/

This works well on ferry and train journeys. And german border guards at the airport are quite aware of it, though it is hard to get to the german airport in the first place if you do not have the required visa.

[pinkpanter]

I had faced same problem:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=93499

Now I am wondering how and where to complain. I dont want to complain to vfs as they are third party.

[evil_grrrl666]

Hi everyone, I've got an update (though in my opinion the matter is far from resolved).
I had a response from the German Embassy in which they state that of course family members of EU citizens can get their visa free of charge by making an appointment directly with them and handing in their application in person.
To this I wrote back saying that due to our jobs it is not feasible to take a whole day off and we've applied successfully by post in the past. The gist of the EU regulations I had sent to them previously is that applications of this nature are to be made easy for the applicant and coming in person is not easy, when clearly there was a proper alternative in the past. I also told them that if the documents we were to present were anyway the same, passports and marriage certificate, why can't we just send them by post as usual.
To this they responded saying of course you can send it by post, please send to VFS however this process is NOT free.

So here we are, back to square one. They refuse to offer a free option to apply by post. They seem to be fairly certain that this approach is in accordance with relevant laws and regulations because there is a free alternative (making an appointment to come in person). I disagree. They took a brilliant system and messed it up by involving VFS.

And also, yes I do know he is entitled to visa free travel (he has a residence card), we did it just a few weeks ago because of discovering this fee and processing time issue for postal applications. I told myself then that it was best to argue at the border because we didn't have much time before our trip and I didn't want to risk the visa coming back late.

But arguing isn't ideal either; they gave me a fairly lengthy lecture upon arrival in Germany that the rules are a bit vague since I am a German national and not any other EU national in their opinion, but "they'll let us in this time while no explicit guidance has been issued to prevent them from doing so". And also I cannot be sure that we will always travel together. I was rather hoping they would just give us a multiple entry visa with a few years validity as they had done in the past, I don't understand why I have to accept a more difficult or costly procedure all of a sudden.

I'm now torn whether to just pay up and send the application to VFS and then argue on matter of principle once we've got the visa and can at least plan our next holiday properly, or involve Solvit right now.

Many thanks for any further insights,
L

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

They took a brilliant system and messed it up by involving VFS.

You are not the only one to have come to this conclusion.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

But arguing isn't ideal either; they gave me a fairly lengthy lecture upon arrival in Germany that the rules are a bit vague since I am a German national and not any other EU national

What exactly have you been doing in the UK? Once freedom of movement applies, it can be used to return to your home country. It may depend on how your country implements this rule, but the principle is there.

[evil_grrrl666]

I've been working in the UK. So yes i know in theory they should not complain when we want to visit Germany for a holiday but i suppose Germany may be one if those places where they are not really happy applying freedom of movement for family members of their own citizens even if they live permanently in another eu country.
In any case, would it be worth complaining to solvit or am i just being petty And do you guys agree that simply offering the less convenient option of applying in person without fee is good enough to satisfy the rules?

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

In any case, would it be worth complaining to solvit or am i just being petty And do you guys agree that simply offering the less convenient option of applying in person without fee is good enough to satisfy the rules?

Yes yes yes.
You should complain to everyone you possibly can.
Solvit may or may not help. But you should complain.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

I've been working in the UK. So yes i know in theory they should not complain when we want to visit Germany for a holiday

Correct, they shouldn't, but you don't have to "give in" either.

(If arguments are not your thing and you don't want to apply for a visa, you could enter via another Schengen state - just an option to consider).

[evil_grrrl666]

I've been working in the UK. So yes i know in theory they should not complain when we want to visit Germany for a holiday but i suppose Germany may be one if those places where they are not really happy applying freedom of movement for family members of their own citizens even if they live permanently in another eu country.
In any case, would it be worth complaining to solvit or am i just being petty And do you guys agree that simply offering the less convenient option of applying in person without fee is good enough to satisfy the rules?

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Whether happy or not, they must obey the rules.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

There may be some information of interest in this document (page 18).

http://ec.europa.eu/justice/doc_centre/ ... ort_en.pdf

[evil_grrrl666]

Thanks for the link, I'll have a good read through it now.

Just to give a quick update. I just spent the best part of 2 hours reading through German versions of the various regulations so I could quote the relevant bits to the woman I'm arguing with in the German Embassy. Just for fun I also had a look at the appointment booking system they employ, apparently there are no applications available during all of October and November and don't accept bookings for December.
This means that their supposed "free alternative" does not actually exist because there are no appointments.

In my latest email to the German Embassy I am of course pointing this out and quoting the ever popular
"Member States shall grant [family members covered by the Directive] every facility to obtain the necessary visas. Such visas must be issued free of charge as soon as possible and on the basis of an accelerated procedure."
In the German version the wording uses a verb that means "to make easy" which of course I specifically refer to; their behaviour is far removed from making things easier for us. Especially now that it turns out there are no appointments available.
I don't know if the lack of appointments is due to some system malfunction though, but I didn't have any other way of checking because their normal phone number only refers to a premium number for appointments (or the online system). And of course I am not shelling out for a premium phone number from my mobile either if I'm already complaining about unjust fees.

Let's see what they say. I've also complained here https://ec.europa.eu/citizensrights/

I'm not hopeful but I'm too stubborn to pay up.

[Directive/2004/38/EC]

I'm not hopeful but I'm too stubborn to pay up.

Good for you. Make it into a game! Enjoy the process. And complain like hell.

[tina79]

Hi guys,

i seem to facing the same problem and tired of arguing with people on embassy!!!

well here is the story! Im from Slovakia my husband is Turkish. I used to live in UK and when he came to visit my family first time i lived in UK but my prem res was and still is in SVK. So we called the embassy re schengen visa and they told us the followings:
- copy of wife ID
- my husband's passport
- 2 photo
- airticket
- marrige certificate.

they told us is free of charge and they have done it for him within 30 min on the embassy.

Now his visa expired in July this year as he has got it for 7 month. I just contacted my embassy where the lady told me that, becuase I now live in Turkey ( but my per res is still in SKV) we have to pay for his schengen visa and have to provide all the doc that is required for other people, such as : work contract, insurance, bank statement, ect.....

as far as I know and we were informed the first time when he asked for it, they said, whenever he needs to renue it he will get it based on our marrige and will need only the docs that i menationed first time above.

When i emailed to the lady, she had no understanding and she told me does not matter he is my husband, rules applies....

my question is, can someone help me with this? we are living in Turkey now, but i will be going home earlier then my husband for xmas. he will joing me and as i said, my perm res is still registered in Slovakia...

so how does it works?

thanks.

[EUsmileWEallsmile]

Hi guys,

i seem to facing the same problem and tired of arguing with people on embassy!!!

You don't mention which embassy, but freedom of movement does not depend on where one applies. It applies or it doesn't.

[tina79]

sorry. we live in Turkey and we are applying for im in my embassy - Slovak.

my perm res is still in Slovakia.