UK Entrepreneur new rules for old applicants

[challenge84]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

[mszafar]

It ll not affect you as you applied before change. Also, funds in UK could be in third party account.

[RizKCB]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

Nothing changed in this regard. It is already mentioned in policy that if third party is based in uk then the funds must be transferred in your bank account with a letter from third party. If funds are in overseas then no transfer is required, only third party's letter would be enough with the bank statement of third party and confirmation of bank about the account holder.

[rajm2012]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

Nothing changed in this regard. It is already mentioned in policy that if third party is based in uk then the funds must be transferred in your bank account with a letter from third party. If funds are in overseas then no transfer is required, only third party's letter would be enough with the bank statement of third party and confirmation of bank about the account holder.

Where does it say that the funds must be transferred to the applicant's bank account if the third party is based in the UK? Please provide the weblink.

[RizKCB]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

Nothing changed in this regard. It is already mentioned in policy that if third party is based in uk then the funds must be transferred in your bank account with a letter from third party. If funds are in overseas then no transfer is required, only third party's letter would be enough with the bank statement of third party and confirmation of bank about the account holder.

Where does it say that the funds must be transferred to the applicant's bank account if the third party is based in the UK? Please provide the weblink.

Follow this link, it is guidance policy. I have done copy/paste from it for quick reference. It is important to read all of it especially in red colour. If you found its meaning some what else then please share back.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dance1.pdf

Then:

Evidence of the amount of money available to invest
97.You should use this evidence of funds available to invest for your initial application under
sections a; b; c and d (see the attributes table for initial applicants).
98.You must provide one or more of the following documents
• A letter from a financial institution;
• For money held in the UK only, an account statement;
• For money from a Venture capital firm, seed funding competition or UK
Government Department only, a letter from an authorised accountant.

100. For money held in the UK only, a recent personal bank or building society statement from
the UK financial institution holding the funds, which confirms the amount of money available
to you or your entrepreneurial team.
The total amount of available money must be either at least £200,000; or at least £50,000, as
applicable. If the money is held in several financial institutions, you must supply a statement from
each institution.
• The statements must be original documents and not a copy.
• The bank or building society holding the money must be based in the UK and regulated by
the FSA;
• The money must be in cash in the account. We will not accept ISA accounts or assets
such as stocks and shares;
• The account must be in your own name only (or both names for an entrepreneurial team)
only. Accounts in the name of a business or third party will not be accepted;
• Each bank or building society statement must be on the institution’s official stationary and
confirm each of the following details:
o Your name; or your name and your entrepreneurial team member’s name,
o The account number
o The date of the statement
o The financial institution’s name and logo;

[rajm2012]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

Nothing changed in this regard. It is already mentioned in policy that if third party is based in uk then the funds must be transferred in your bank account with a letter from third party. If funds are in overseas then no transfer is required, only third party's letter would be enough with the bank statement of third party and confirmation of bank about the account holder.

Where does it say that the funds must be transferred to the applicant's bank account if the third party is based in the UK? Please provide the weblink.

Follow this link, it is guidance policy. I have done copy/paste from it for quick reference. It is important to read all of it especially in red colour. If you found its meaning some what else then please share back.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dance1.pdf

Then:

Evidence of the amount of money available to invest
97.You should use this evidence of funds available to invest for your initial application under
sections a; b; c and d (see the attributes table for initial applicants).
98.You must provide one or more of the following documents
• A letter from a financial institution;
• For money held in the UK only, an account statement;
• For money from a Venture capital firm, seed funding competition or UK
Government Department only, a letter from an authorised accountant.

100. For money held in the UK only, a recent personal bank or building society statement from
the UK financial institution holding the funds, which confirms the amount of money available
to you or your entrepreneurial team.
The total amount of available money must be either at least £200,000; or at least £50,000, as
applicable. If the money is held in several financial institutions, you must supply a statement from
each institution.
• The statements must be original documents and not a copy.
• The bank or building society holding the money must be based in the UK and regulated by
the FSA;
• The money must be in cash in the account. We will not accept ISA accounts or assets
such as stocks and shares;
• The account must be in your own name only (or both names for an entrepreneurial team)
only. Accounts in the name of a business or third party will not be accepted;
• Each bank or building society statement must be on the institution’s official stationary and
confirm each of the following details:
o Your name; or your name and your entrepreneurial team member’s name,
o The account number
o The date of the statement
o The financial institution’s name and logo;

What my understanding is from this is that if you're showing money in a third party account in the UK, you have to get a declaration from your third party AND a letter from third party's bank. It doesn't say anywhere that the third party in the UK has to transfer the money to your account.

So if a friend or a relative is helping you out by transferring £50K to your personal account, you don't have to show any third party declaration or a letter from their bank. All you need to show in this case is your personal bank statement.

[RizKCB]

Hello All,
I have an enquiry regarding new rules of UK Entrepreneur visa
I applied through PSW route on 13th august, money was held in my uncle's account, now I heard that people applying for this category cannot show funds in third party account in UK. Will this affect people who already applied in august or its for those who will be applying after the rules were announced, mean who applied in setember or october.
plz reply of anybody knows.
i applied and recieved following communication:
applied on 13/08/2012
Biometrics 25/08/2012
acknowldgement 28/08/2012
After that no communication recieved.[/u]

Nothing changed in this regard. It is already mentioned in policy that if third party is based in uk then the funds must be transferred in your bank account with a letter from third party. If funds are in overseas then no transfer is required, only third party's letter would be enough with the bank statement of third party and confirmation of bank about the account holder.

Where does it say that the funds must be transferred to the applicant's bank account if the third party is based in the UK? Please provide the weblink.

Follow this link, it is guidance policy. I have done copy/paste from it for quick reference. It is important to read all of it especially in red colour. If you found its meaning some what else then please share back.

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/sitec ... dance1.pdf

Then:

Evidence of the amount of money available to invest
97.You should use this evidence of funds available to invest for your initial application under
sections a; b; c and d (see the attributes table for initial applicants).
98.You must provide one or more of the following documents
• A letter from a financial institution;
• For money held in the UK only, an account statement;
• For money from a Venture capital firm, seed funding competition or UK
Government Department only, a letter from an authorised accountant.

100. For money held in the UK only, a recent personal bank or building society statement from
the UK financial institution holding the funds, which confirms the amount of money available
to you or your entrepreneurial team.
The total amount of available money must be either at least £200,000; or at least £50,000, as
applicable. If the money is held in several financial institutions, you must supply a statement from
each institution.
• The statements must be original documents and not a copy.
• The bank or building society holding the money must be based in the UK and regulated by
the FSA;
• The money must be in cash in the account. We will not accept ISA accounts or assets
such as stocks and shares;
• The account must be in your own name only (or both names for an entrepreneurial team)
only. Accounts in the name of a business or third party will not be accepted;
• Each bank or building society statement must be on the institution’s official stationary and
confirm each of the following details:
o Your name; or your name and your entrepreneurial team member’s name,
o The account number
o The date of the statement
o The financial institution’s name and logo;

Point 98 of policy states:

98.You must provide one or more of the following documents
(Second point under it states)
For money held in the UK only, an account statement;

Now come to point 100:
100. For money held in the UK only, a recent personal bank or building society statement from
the UK financial institution holding the funds, which confirms the amount of money available
to you or your entrepreneurial team.
(Fourth point under it states)
The account must be in your own name only (or both names for an entrepreneurial team)
only. Accounts in the name of a business or third party will not be accepted;

For your correction, Friends and Family members are also included in third party. Point 103 is as follow:
103.Third parties (other contributors of money) may include family members, as well as other
investors or corporate bodies.
In any of the above cases you need letter from them and also to satisfy point 98 and 100.
Now I am summarizing it as follow:

Uncle is residing in UK and he has funds for you (He is third party). To satisfy point 98, a bank statement is needed because money is held in UK only.
BUT the question is whose statement?
Now answer is in point 100 which states that account must be in your name, not in third party or business name. To satisfy this point, the money from uncle's account must be transferred in your account with your name. Also a letter from Uncle must be attached that he has given you this money. In this way you dont need letter from bank.

I think it is very clear. And dont be a victim of money maker immigration consultants who arrange only a letter from third party without transferring money in applicants account. It is a big debate now a days. If you have any visa granted without money transfer then please share. Money transfer clause is only for the money held in UK. It is not for overseas third parties. Overseas third parties can only give statement and declaration with bank letters.

[Celina]

hello everyone ?

Please if anyone can help me to solve my query , i am really confused .
My question is same as that of Tier1 entrepreneur , in my case also part of my money is held with my husband in joint account . I am main applicant and he is dependant .So is he a third party as well ? and do i need a declaration letter from him as well ? if yes how does it work ? does it needs to be attested and where is the declaration form format ? please if anyone can help me out with this , it will be highly appreciated .

Waiting for reply eagerly ,
thanks
Celina.

[rajm2012]

RizKCB, thanks a lot for breaking this down for me. It makes sense now. I was completely missing the "Accounts in the name of a business or third party will not be accepted" part.

Okay, I'm confused now. My uncle has already transferred about £40K into my account. He'll be transferring the remaining 10K next week. So now if I send my personal bank account statement with a balance of £50,000, I wouldn't need to provide anything else, would I? I mean I don't need to provide any third party declaration, legal representative letter, etc...is that right?

[RizKCB]

Celina follow the link:
Www.immigrationboards.com/viewtopic.php?t=107917


The link could help you to solve your problem

[RizKCB]

Rajm2012: because your uncle is third party so get declaration letter certified through approved solicitor and attach it with your account statement where your Uncle transferred money. It doesn't matter in how many instalments. You don't need a letter from bank about your Uncle's money and availability of this money to you because it is already in your account. Neither any bank would provide such letter.

[MILI]

Hi ,
According to my understanding if 50,000k is in my personal account in UK I don't have to show any third party declaration since the money is already available to me to do any business I want…UKBA is not asking anywhere to show the source of fund..
It is clearly written in point
39. You can include money made available by other people (known as ‘a third party or parties’) but you must also provide a declaration that the money is available to you or the business that you are running, from each contributor of funds, together with confirmation that the declarations are valid. If you are relying on [b]money held[/b] by your husband, wife or partner, they will be regarded as a third party.

Friends and Family members are also included in third party but only if you are showing money in their account….

Correct me if I am wrong

[rajm2012]

Rajm2012: because your uncle is third party so get declaration letter certified through approved solicitor and attach it with your account statement where your Uncle transferred money. It doesn't matter in how many instalments. You don't need a letter from bank about your Uncle's money and availability of this money to you because it is already in your account. Neither any bank would provide such letter.

RizKCB, please read the following:

Hi ,
According to my understanding if 50,000k is in my personal account in UK I don't have to show any third party declaration since the money is already available to me to do any business I want…UKBA is not asking anywhere to show the source of fund..
It is clearly written in point
39. You can include money made available by other people (known as ‘a third party or parties’) but you must also provide a declaration that the money is available to you or the business that you are running, from each contributor of funds, together with confirmation that the declarations are valid. If you are relying on money held by your husband, wife or partner, they will be regarded as a third party.

Friends and Family members are also included in third party but only if you are showing money in their account….

Correct me if I am wrong

This is where I am getting confused. If I have all the money in my account, why do I need to get a third party declaration? In my understanding, a third party declaration would be needed if the third party has promised to make the money available to me but the Agency needs a solid proof in writing and that's where this declaration comes into play. However, if the money is already in my account, why would I still get the third party to write me a declaration? And if I do that, how would I prove that the money in my account has been transferred by my uncle and not someone else? To prove this, I will need to submit my uncle's statements as well. I'm so confused now.

[RizKCB]

I have read all listings by you, the clause on which I am insisting is "FOR MONEY HELD IN UK". If somebody is giving you money from inside the UK; both things MONEY TRANSFER and DECLARATION are important. Detail of transaction will automatically appear in your statement when your Uncle will transfer that money. In this way you will be able to satisfy point 98 and 100 of guidance policy. In point 39 it is not mentioned that money is held in UK or not.

If your Uncle is in overseas and he has account in overseas bank then he doesn't need to transfer that money. In that case he will only provide declaration with his own statement and bank letter. In this scenario point 39 works. It is confusion but just follow and stick to policy itself rather than own sense and findings.

I have also heard that HO doesn't verify source. But I am also confused at the word SOURCE. In your case, your Uncle is Source of money so he would not be verified how he got money but you are applicant and could be verified from every aspect. If you follow application form, you will sign and give consent to HO to verify your documents including bank as well.

[saeedusman]

To me it look like there is no need of any other documentation except your personal statement if you are applying within UK (because there is no other option now anyway after recent changes).

If all money is in your own account, there is no sense for third person because you are claiming that money as your own money. So just to avoid any confusion and make it more confusing for the case worker, why not you just get funds in your own account and just attach your statement showing that YOU have the money required.

I don't think so we need to make things complicated by making our own assumptions.

When you have money in YOUR OWN account, that mean that is YOUR. Just forget about third party and complete the documentation by keeping in mind that you have got the money to apply.

Cheers

[RizKCB]

It would be good if HO also takes it what you described. It will go in my favour as well. I have just followed point 98 and 100 of guidance policy.

Because I am applying as an entrepreneur team. So both of us team members have taken money from third parties in our personal accounts. Then transferred that money in our joint account to make 50000. Every transaction in our joint account is from each of our personal accounts. In that way we eliminated the concept of third party declaration. Because if we put money from third party in our joint account directly then we need to show declaration from third party as well. Because big transactions overnight to make 50000 could be big question mark. Also with each transaction, statement shows the source of money. HO wouldn't go for to verify how that third party earned that money but they may/may not (up to case worker) ask us in what capacity we received huge money in our account.
In this way we tried to satisfy point 98 and 100. Nothing is assumed by ourselves, just point 98 and 100. In discussion it seems to be complicated but in practical very straight and simple.

[saeedusman]

It would be good if HO also takes it what you described. It will go in my favour as well. I have just followed point 98 and 100 of guidance policy.

Because I am applying as an entrepreneur team. So both of us team members have taken money from third parties in our personal accounts. Then transferred that money in our joint account to make 50000. Every transaction in our joint account is from each of our personal accounts. In that way we eliminated the concept of third party declaration. Because if we put money from third party in our joint account directly then we need to show declaration from third party as well. Because big transactions overnight to make 50000 could be big question mark. Also with each transaction, statement shows the source of money. HO wouldn't go for to verify how that third party earned that money but they may/may not (up to case worker) ask us in what capacity we received huge money in our account.
In this way we tried to satisfy point 98 and 100. Nothing is assumed by ourselves, just point 98 and 100. In discussion it seems to be complicated but in practical very straight and simple.

I am in the same boat though and will get the bank letter for the current balance instead of getting the statement. Just get the letter and you are OK. You don't need full statements.

So by getting the bank letter for current balance on your name or joint account names, you should be totally safe. Thats my personal opinion. HO is not bothered for the source, they want money to spend in next 3 years. Thats it.

Thats is better that you transferred in your other and then transferred in yours, so still should be no problem.

Even in worst case scenario, if they ask you, you can send it written that its your own money. And you got this money of MR ABC who actually owed this money to you from your home country or blahh blahh. Now you was in need so you requested him/her to return your borrowed money. So you are OK again. But the third person who gave you the money, then should be able to defend his source of money which I think should be no problem because he/she gave you and even transferred online. So there should must be solid back ground.

Whats the biggest transfer you did online from one account to other account? Someone told me the bank will cease the account if you do continously 2-3 transactions more than £2000-£3000 in a row. Did anyone had this problem?

Regards,

[nickb]

It would be good if HO also takes it what you described. It will go in my favour as well. I have just followed point 98 and 100 of guidance policy.

Because I am applying as an entrepreneur team. So both of us team members have taken money from third parties in our personal accounts. Then transferred that money in our joint account to make 50000. Every transaction in our joint account is from each of our personal accounts. In that way we eliminated the concept of third party declaration. Because if we put money from third party in our joint account directly then we need to show declaration from third party as well. Because big transactions overnight to make 50000 could be big question mark. Also with each transaction, statement shows the source of money. HO wouldn't go for to verify how that third party earned that money but they may/may not (up to case worker) ask us in what capacity we received huge money in our account.
In this way we tried to satisfy point 98 and 100. Nothing is assumed by ourselves, just point 98 and 100. In discussion it seems to be complicated but in practical very straight and simple.

I am in the same boat though and will get the bank letter for the current balance instead of getting the statement. Just get the letter and you are OK. You don't need full statements.

So by getting the bank letter for current balance on your name or joint account names, you should be totally safe. Thats my personal opinion. HO is not bothered for the source, they want money to spend in next 3 years. Thats it.

Thats is better that you transferred in your other and then transferred in yours, so still should be no problem.

Even in worst case scenario, if they ask you, you can send it written that its your own money. And you got this money of MR ABC who actually owed this money to you from your home country or blahh blahh. Now you was in need so you requested him/her to return your borrowed money. So you are OK again. But the third person who gave you the money, then should be able to defend his source of money which I think should be no problem because he/she gave you and even transferred online. So there should must be solid back ground.

Whats the biggest transfer you did online from one account to other account? Someone told me the bank will cease the account if you do continously 2-3 transactions more than £2000-£3000 in a row. Did anyone had this problem?

Regards,

If its an international transfer then yes the bank will block the transfer as it will be reviewed for money laundering. For transfers within the UK accounts there is no such problem.

[saeedusman]

If its an international transfer then yes the bank will block the transfer as it will be reviewed for money laundering. For transfers within the UK accounts there is no such problem.

Thanks

[crazy_ram]

Hi,
Let me add a bit for the above conversation. There would not be any problem as long as the both accounts (receiver & giver ) are legitimate. But, there will be a problem some times. Since the banks are introduced electronic fraud detection systems, those systems will automatically identifies the accounts where there is sudden increase of number of transactions or amount of money moving.
Once those systems picked a bank account, then bank will simply blocks the account with out any intimation and sends a letter to bring the different forms of identity and address proofs (passport, driving licence, council tax bills, utility bills ans so on... ). If we are able to produce the documents they have asked, they will release the blocks... otherwise they will simply close the account.
It may be challengeble from customer's side, but why taking risk when there is other options like paying by cheque or some amount by cash & some by transfer.

I hope this helps,

RAM

[saeedusman]

Hi,
Let me add a bit for the above conversation. There would not be any problem as long as the both accounts (receiver & giver ) are legitimate. But, there will be a problem some times. Since the banks are introduced electronic fraud detection systems, those systems will automatically identifies the accounts where there is sudden increase of number of transactions or amount of money moving.
Once those systems picked a bank account, then bank will simply blocks the account with out any intimation and sends a letter to bring the different forms of identity and address proofs (passport, driving licence, council tax bills, utility bills ans so on... ). If we are able to produce the documents they have asked, they will release the blocks... otherwise they will simply close the account.
It may be challengeble from customer's side, but why taking risk when there is other options like paying by cheque or some amount by cash & some by transfer.

I hope this helps,

RAM

But I was told by some competent person that paying too much cash can also create problems.

Can all of you please suggest me if I have about £30K cash, then how to accommodate that. Whether should I make it in one account or in multiple accounts. I already have 3 personal accounts in different banks and I have maintained 90 days statements in 2 of them. 3rd one is free to use.

1) Is it possible to distribute funds in all three of them and use the same for 90 days maintenance funds as well?

2) I am worried if I use one of the maintenance bank for part of investment funds as well, then the case worker might get confused or just because of some misunderstandings, he/she can reject or make some other objection?

3) My wife (dependent) has her own account, it is possible that she can add me on her account so that it become shared account and I can add some funds in there and get letter from her that I have access to the money?

I think distribution of (by paying cash/transfer) should be OK for upto £15K per account?

All the comments will be appreciated and hope so will be helpful for other members as well.

Regards,

[usemobile]

Hello Senior member

I am appplying for Entrepreneur visa of 200k from India to my cousins. But i have opened the UK ltd company on their names as overseas directors and also Business bank account.

Trasnfered funds to that business bank account. Now i am submitting

1) Company House certificate
2) Share holders certficate showing 100% shares owned by them (applicants)
3) Business bank statement showing 200k in the account
4) Business plan what they are going to do here in the UK after

Offcourse this as to be done within six months after coming to UK but i am doing now before application so that they dont need thrid party letter and legal representative letters. bcoz funds are already in their business bank account and they are the directors and shareholders of that company.

Any advice for me....what questions could they rise in India

Look forward for you kind advice

Regards
Kumar