UK Residence card, can I work in Ireland?

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 7:57 pm

I have Residence Card issued in the UK as a family member of EEA National...Can I work in Ireland for temporary period? If I want to work for long, then would I need to get Residence Card in Ireland? if so then what would happen to my UK residence card? Any advice? I might be offered a job in Ireland so I want know in advance..thanks

Ben · Post by **Ben** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:33 pm

Hi Adnan,

If you're planning on working in Ireland alone, you would need permission (usually by way of a work permit). However, if your EU national family member is with you, you may have an entitlement to work under EC law.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:53 pm

Thanks for reply.

I would move with my wife and daughter both EEA national. But I found out that I can work upto 90 days. Does it mean I would need to exit and enter again? if I do apply Residence Card in Ireland with my wife then would would happen to EEA Residence card issued in the UK? I want to visit UK as well because my wife's mother and relatives lives here so we would visit as a family but I also found out with Residence card issued in Ireland does not allow you to enter UK? confused!!

Also if I do work using UK RC then how things work out in Ireland, like income tax, NI number etc....

Ben · Post by **Ben** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 9:57 pm

Once your wife ceases to live in the UK, your right of residence in the UK ceases and your UK residence card is invalidated.

If moving to Ireland with your wife, you have the right of residence (and employment) immediately, unconditionally, for up to three months.

After three months, you will continue to have these rights if your wife is employed, self-employed, engaged in a course of study or financially self-sufficient.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Thu Dec 06, 2012 10:16 pm

Thanks Ben.

Does it mean I would need to go through the whole process again? I would need to get registration certificate for my wife with one category in Ireland and then apply for residence card for myself?

Is it possible that we exit Ireland within 3 months and come back? even weekend or few more days? Would it be appropriate and within immigration law guidelines?

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Tue Dec 11, 2012 8:59 pm

I have been offered a job...problem is that initially my wife can just go with me but she wont be able to live with me in ireland because she has studies to complete which will be completed by May '13...I will need to join company by end of Jan '13.....Can I initially enter Ireland with my wife and exit Ireland on basis of 90 days restriction and enter again to continue work for another 90 days? and once my wife join me in Ireland permanently then I apply for Residence Card in Ireland?

Can we enter Ireland and as she will be self sufficient because I will be working...would it mean we won't need to get anything or my wife would still need to get Registration certificate in Ireland?...Please advice..

nobodysperfect · Post by **nobodysperfect** » Wed Dec 12, 2012 2:35 pm

adnan01 wrote:Can I initially enter Ireland with my wife and exit Ireland on basis of 90 days restriction and enter again to continue work for another 90 days? and once my wife join me in Ireland permanently then I apply for Residence Card in Ireland?

I am sure your employer wants you to get paid in Ireland and deal with the Irish taxing so you will need to register yourself with your wife in the town hall to get a PPS (equivalent to NI) number. Once you have the PPS you can open a bank account and be taxed in Ireland. If you do not apply for the residence card within the 90 days you will still have the rights to work and live in Ireland however your employer would want you to get a document to confirm your rights.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:01 am

Thanks Ben,

Does it mean my wife would need to get some sort of registration after 3 months as a self sufficient? like in the UK we had to get registration certificate using EEA1. Is it the same in Ireland? Or we can just apply for residence card for me straight after 3 months with evidence that we are self sufficient.

Also I want to know whether I will be issued PPS with EEA residence card issued in the UK? I believe it shouldn't be a problem as I am eligible to work once enter Ireland with my wife and daughter.

I would appreciate clarification and advice.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:38 am

I sent an email to GNIB to get information and they says that I can enter Ireland without visa, but that will not be allowed to work.

From: GNIB_DV (GNIB_DV@garda.ie)
Sent: 17 December 2012 11:21:34
To: Adnan

Can can visit Ireland with out need for a visa if you hold a residence card issued under the directive 2004/38/EC.

This does not entitle you to work. If you wish to work you will need to obtain a work permit before you enter Ireland or you must obtain a reside visa and then apply for EU Treaty Rights in Ireland (this will take 6 months to be issued)

Regards,
Garda National Immigration Bureau
13/14 Burgh Quay
Dublin 2
Ireland
Tel: +353 (0)1 666 91 01
Fax: +353 (0) 1 666 9141

SO CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

nobodysperfect · Post by **nobodysperfect** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:39 pm

adnan01 wrote:I sent an email to GNIB to get information and they says that I can enter Ireland without visa, but that will not be allowed to work.

From: GNIB_DV (GNIB_DV@garda.ie)
Sent: 17 December 2012 11:21:34
To: Adnan

Can can visit Ireland with out need for a visa if you hold a residence card issued under the directive 2004/38/EC.

This does not entitle you to work. If you wish to work you will need to obtain a work permit before you enter Ireland or you must obtain a reside visa and then apply for EU Treaty Rights in Ireland (this will take 6 months to be issued)

Regards,
Garda National Immigration Bureau
13/14 Burgh Quay
Dublin 2
Ireland
Tel: +353 (0)1 666 91 01
Fax: +353 (0) 1 666 9141

SO CONFUSED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They will never give you a straight forward answer that you were expecting. We had the same issues in Ireland where GNIB refused to confirm my rights to work along side CAB confirming GNIB was right. If you employer is happy to employ you before getting the EU FAM then there should not be an issue. You do not have to apply for EU FAM for up to 90 days and you can still legally work if you do not apply after the 90 days window. The EU FAM( RC) does not give you the right to work but only confirms your rights.
Regarding PPS- You will need your and your EU spouse`s passport, Marriage certificate and proof of residence in Ireland. Your UK issued EEA card does not play any role for your PPS.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:21 pm

Thanks for your comment.

PPS done than it should all be ok. I will apply for RC within 3 months.

Well I had mentioned my immigrations status to the company during interview and they said it is not an issue. I would be happy to have any legislative evidence that I could refer to the company. Irish citizen advice website says that EEA family member have the same rights as EEA national when enter Ireland together. So I hope it will be ok.

Irrelevant to topic, Is it worth relocating to Cork-Ireland from London? I got Residence card issued just few months ago in the UK. My daughter is going to Nursery here in London but I am currently unemployed and the opportunity is very good. Company is paying for relocation and salary is good. In London almost 60-70% goes in rent and you are left with nothing. I searched properties in Cork and rents are still much cheaper as compared to London. I am fine with slow life or other things...

Would I need to convert my UK drivers Licence or I can drive with UK license?

Latintraveller · Post by **Latintraveller** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:54 pm

When I moved to Ireland 15 years ago the legal situation was that I had to change my driving licence to an Irish one within a year. Despite getting two penalty points for speeding I was still using the UK licence five years later. Perhaps the situation has changed now, but defiantly a few years ago changing your licence was not an issue in practice.

By the way; most insurance companies treat UK licence holders on a par with Irish licence holders. Although car insurance is a bit more expensive in Ireland that will keep the cost down a bit.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Mon Jan 07, 2013 11:03 pm

Thanks for everyone's reply.

I have been offered a job and definitely going to Ireland.

Can anyone guide me how to get things done? Let's say I entered Ireland then what should I do? Would I need to get Immigration Certificate of Registration from GNIB?

Or is it just enter Ireland, start work as it would be legal and apply for PPS as soon as I have documents ready and then apply for Residence Card in Ireland? or Do I need any other thing that I don't know.

Kindly advice as I feel worried because its important job for me and I am going all the way leaving UK to Ireland with wife and daughter.

Thanks

nobodysperfect · Post by **nobodysperfect** » Tue Jan 08, 2013 12:39 pm

Here is what you should do -

1. Get to Ireland and try their Guinness first thing first.
2. You can start working without any prior formalities. You have right to work up to 90 days without any formalities.
3. Get your PPS number sorted- you will need your lease agreement or a letter from the landlord if its a sub let or friends address.
4.Once you get the PPS you can apply for Bank account + give the PPS to your employer for sorting out your tax code.
5. Once you have all the relevant document apply for the EU Fam.

Good luck.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Tue Jan 08, 2013 9:36 pm

Thank you so much for guidance.

Also, if my wife temporarily exit Ireland and come to the UK on a regular basis, would it be an issue?

there are several obstacles but most important one is my daughter's passport that has expired. She is Latvian National but she was born in the UK and now she is nearly 4 years old. But as far as I found out we can't travel with my daughter until she has valid passport so we have applied for passport to be renewed. So we might leave our daughter here for few days with my mother-in-law and then my wife comes back to UK so that when our daughter's passport is issued she come back to Ireland with her.

Would it be possible and legal?

I'm trying to extend the start date but if it wont be possible then I will need to join on advised date.

nobodysperfect · Post by **nobodysperfect** » Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:16 pm

adnan01 wrote:
Would it be possible and legal?

Of course it is possible and legal as long as your wife is gone away temporarily. The couple does not have to be together for 365 days of the year. As per the EU law the allowed temporary absence can be up to 6 months after which the residency breaks. So as long as your wife is coming back in short time there will be no issues.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:56 pm

Thanks for your reply.

I feel much better

. One last thing hopefully, what if I exit Ireland for a weekend to come to the UK and go back to Ireland, would I need my wife to be with me again or how does it work out?

I'm asking about it because my wife may need to stay in UK for couple of weeks and early 9th feb is my daughter's birthday and I would like to come to the UK since she won't be able to go to Ireland because of passport. Can I come to the UK and then go back Ireland alone or I will need to ask my wife again to enter Ireland with me and then exit again to wait for our daughter's passport to be done? I know its complicated. Any advise or ideas would be highly appreciated.

Many thanks,

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 12:35 pm

Ben wrote:Once your wife ceases to live in the UK, your right of residence in the UK ceases and your UK residence card is invalidated.

Once the EU citizen permanently leaves the UK, or if they have been gone for more than 6 months, then the residence ends.

But if they spouse, for example, intends to return to the UK if things do not work out, and maybe leaves some of their possessions in the UK, then it is hard to see how they will loose their residence.

nobodysperfect · Post by **nobodysperfect** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:51 pm

adnan01 wrote:what if I exit Ireland for a weekend to come to the UK and go back to Ireland, would I need my wife to be with me again or how does it work out?

If your wife is not in the Ireland while you re-entering and you haven`t made your EU Fam application the immigration will ask you to prove that your wife is joining you. There might not be any issue however if you are unlucky this can cause you some grief. They wont be able to deport you or anything however you will have to be very assertive with the immigration on your arrival while claiming your rights to enter as per the directive.

I have done this before without an issue however I would n`t recommend it. Good luck anyways.

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Thu Jan 10, 2013 2:58 pm

And always be careful to carry your marriage certificate and a copy of your wife's passport

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 12:29 pm

Hi Thanks everyone for replies.

I am in Cork Ireland now and I would like to share my experience and ask few important things.

I traveled using Air Lingus and at Heathrow Airport they were just not convinced initially that I can enter Ireland. Even though I showed them Email confirmation from GNIB, they still said NO you cant enter Ireland with UK Residence Card. I waited for 40 min because they told me they need to confirm it with Irish Authorities. I couldn't be more patient after 40 min and felt no one is bothered and asked them to do something as this is really not fair. There was a guy he straight away phone somewhere and they said if I'm traveling with spouse and have Marriage certificate then it is fine and he said ok you can enter Ireland.

When I got to Cork, Garda asked me why you are here. I said honestly that I have been offered a job and we wish to exercise our free right of movement within EU under Directive 2004/38/EC. He asked me to show him offer letter that I handed over to him. But immigration officer said you can enter Ireland but you CANT WORK. I showed him information as I had hard copy that I can enter and work according to Law and work. He said its up to my Discretion whether I allow you 1 day entry or 3 months entry and even with entry you will not be eligible to work. It got to the stage when he said I KNOW MY JOB AND YOU DONT NEED TO TELL ME WHAT IS LAW......and he stamped my passport with 2 MONTHS LIMIT AND ITS MENTION NO UNAUTHORISED WORK ALLOWED.....

WHAT DO I NEED TO DO? IM HERE TO WORK!!!! I mean I know by law I'm eligible...But stamp says NO...shall I stay quite if company is not bothered and apply for residence card as soon as it become possible for me?????I will be able to apply by March and thats when this stamp expires...Also I heard that I will face same issue when I apply for PPS number so what do I do? Do I need to go to GNIB and get GNIB CARD????? PLEASE ADVICE!!!!!

Company has given me 2 weeks accommodation and flight so I'm not dying if nothing works out as I can go back to the UK but the job opportunity is very good and I don't wish to loose it.

ANY SUGGESTIONS WOULD BE HIGHLY APPRECIATED!!! THANKS GUYS

Post by **Directive/2004/38/EC** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:34 pm

adnan01 wrote:When I got to Cork, Garda asked me why you are here. I said honestly that I have been offered a job and we wish to exercise our free right of movement within EU under Directive 2004/38/EC. He asked me to show him offer letter that I handed over to him. But immigration officer said you can enter Ireland but you CANT WORK. I showed him information as I had hard copy that I can enter and work according to Law and work. He said its up to my Discretion whether I allow you 1 day entry or 3 months entry and even with entry you will not be eligible to work. It got to the stage when he said I KNOW MY JOB AND YOU DONT NEED TO TELL ME WHAT IS LAW......and he stamped my passport with 2 MONTHS LIMIT AND ITS MENTION NO UNAUTHORISED WORK ALLOWED.....

Who exactly stamped this in your passport? Somebody at Cork airport, or somebody else?

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:36 pm

It was stamped by an Immigration officer at Cork Airport

Post by **EUsmileWEallsmile** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:12 pm

adnan01 wrote:they still said NO you cant enter Ireland with UK Residence Card. I waited for 40 min because they told me they need to confirm it with Irish Authorities. I couldn't be more patient after 40 min and felt no one is bothered and asked them to do something as this is really not fair. There was a guy he straight away phone somewhere and they said if I'm traveling with spouse and have Marriage certificate then it is fine and he said ok you can enter Ireland

The Irish law is actually pretty good, holder of an article 10 residence card (of which the UK's residence card is) can enter Ireland without a visa.

adnan01 · Post by **adnan01** » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:18 pm

The Irish law is actually pretty good, holder of an article 10 residence card (of which the UK's residence card is) can enter Ireland without a visa.

But can I work without any prior formalities? As far as I know..YES....but how do I deal with my situation??? Advice!!! please

Immigrationboards.com: Immigration, work visa and work permit discussion board

UK Residence card, can I work in Ireland?

UK Residence card, can I work in Ireland?