Can I apply from inside the UK? Please help....

[darkcloud20]

Hmm . If I call my university (where I have withdrawn from) and ask them to know about my curtailment, can they know my NEW expiry date from the HO immediately ?

[vinny]

tier4curtailments@homeoffice.gsi.gov.uk appears to be the correct email address. Perhaps you may also post a letter to them?

[darkcloud20]

ohh thanks. Do you know- If I call my university (where I have withdrawn from) and ask them to know about my curtailment, can they know my NEW expiry date from the HO immediately ?

If I send HO a letter by post, how long they will take to reply me? I don't have any clue

[vinny]

If the UKVI haven't issued you with a curtailment notice, then there is no way for anyone to know.

[noajthan]

ohh thanks. Do you know- If I call my university (where I have withdrawn from) and ask them to know about my curtailment, can they know my NEW expiry date from the HO immediately ?

If I send HO a letter by post, how long they will take to reply me? I don't have any clue

darkcloud, this is obviously a concern for you but you need to try and relax a bit - then get on and do some of the heavy lifting instead of fretting over every detail.

Make the call.Write that letter.
Wait and see,

You can't rush the HO and they won't work around you.

We don't work for them and don't know how long they will take. It's not set in stone and it's not predicable.
For example, its half-term week so maybe all the caseworkers with kids have gone off to Benidorm. Who knows.

And seriously, make a Plan B too.

[darkcloud20]

@noajthan. Hmm i have to make a plan B as well. Do you have any idea whether my issue of withdrawn will be raised while applying to another country?

My old university AT LEAST can know from the HO that whether my visa is curtailed or not, Right?

[keysersoze22]

Contact your old Universities Tier 4 Compliance Team , and if you don't have one, the International Student Advice Service granting them permission to discuss your case with UKVI and to enquire about your curtailment. They should have their own license account manager who these queries can be raised to.

[noajthan]

@noajthan. Hmm i have to make a plan B as well. Do you have any idea whether my issue of withdrawn will be raised while applying to another country?

There is no universal clearing system or databanks to my knowledge.
An institution will no doubt be interested in your academic history when it comes to interview.

Checkout somewhere like The Netherlands - applications/registration is still possible even for this coming academic year.

[darkcloud20]

Contact your old Universities Tier 4 Compliance Team , and if you don't have one, the International Student Advice Service granting them permission to discuss your case with UKVI and to enquire about your curtailment. They should have their own license account manager who these queries can be raised to.

Thank you so much keysersoze22. You mean License account manager in the university? what is license account manager?

[darkcloud20]

An institution will no doubt be interested in your academic history when it comes to interview.

Sorry did Not get it...

[Casa]

An institution will no doubt be interested in your academic history when it comes to interview.

Sorry did Not get it...

They will be interested in what you have achieved during your studies and your attendance record. In other words, the history of your study in the UK

[darkcloud20]

Oh ok. Today I called the UKVI sponsor and education helpline (0300 123 4699) and they said this number is ONLY for sponsors, Not for me.
Then I called the UKVI immigration helpline (03001232241) and a person gave me some info about 5 year cap which I am NOT familiar with:-

He said - 5 year cap will NOT apply if I make a new Tier 4 application from OUTSIDE the UK. In that case, the CAP will start from the beginning

Is the above info correct? Is there any situation where the 5 year cap starts again? or the 5 year cap applies to the whole lifetime?

I also asked that person about the duration between 1st Aug 2015 and 1st Oct 2017 (in page 31 of Tier 4 policy guidance for applicants). He checked that page (31) and told me the info is correct there. He said the duration is 27 months as it is written there. He told me to use the calendar.
How come its 27 months? It should be 26 months 1 day, as the day counting software says. Is there anybody who can help please ? Sorry its very urgent

Hi all, when I came in 2012 in the UK, my course was International Foundation Programme. Is it BELOW-Degree level? I am confused...

Thanks a lot everyone.

[vinny]

Then I called the UKVI immigration helpline (03001232241) and a person gave me some info about 5 year cap which I am NOT familiar with:-

He said - 5 year cap will NOT apply if I make a new Tier 4 application from OUTSIDE the UK. In that case, the CAP will start from the beginning

Is the above info correct? Is there any situation where the 5 year cap starts again? or the 5 year cap applies to the whole lifetime?

Seems incorrect, if you compare 245ZU(ga) and 245ZX(ha).

[darkcloud20]

Then I called the UKVI immigration helpline (03001232241) and a person gave me some info about 5 year cap which I am NOT familiar with:-

He said - 5 year cap will NOT apply if I make a new Tier 4 application from OUTSIDE the UK. In that case, the CAP will start from the beginning

Is the above info correct? Is there any situation where the 5 year cap starts again? or the 5 year cap applies to the whole lifetime?

Seems incorrect, if you compare 245ZU(ga) and 245ZX(ha).

you mean if someone spends 5 years in Degree-level course, then he NEVER EVER can study in degree level AGAIN in the UK (if he applies from outside the UK)?
The 5 year cap is for WHOLE LIFE-TIME ?!

[vinny]

For the avoidance of doubt, the calculation of whether the applicant has exceeded the time limit will be based on what was previously granted by way of period of leave and level of course rather than (if different) periods and courses actually studied.

[darkcloud20]

For the avoidance of doubt, the calculation of whether the applicant has exceeded the time limit will be based on what was previously granted by way of period of leave and level of course rather than (if different) periods and courses actually studied.

Sorry, I get confused by the immi rules . Is the above rule talking about whole life-time?
For example, someone studied in Degree-level for 5 years in the UK. Then he went back to his home country. After 6 years (in home country), he wants to come to the UK to study something in Degree-level AGAIN. Will the "5 year cap" be applied to him OR, the cap will start from the beginning?

Thank you very very much for helping me....

[vinny]

All study in the UK on a Student or Tier 4 visa counts even if a student leaves the UK and returns (e.g. if a student studies for 3 years then leaves the UK and returns two years later they can still only study for another 2 years to make 5 years in total - unless one of the exceptions listed above would apply).

[cs95tdg]

For the avoidance of doubt, the calculation of whether the applicant has exceeded the time limit will be based on what was previously granted by way of period of leave and level of course rather than (if different) periods and courses actually studied.

Sorry, I get confused by the immi rules . Is the above rule talking about whole life-time?
For example, someone studied in Degree-level for 5 years in the UK. Then he went back to his home country. After 6 years (in home country), he wants to come to the UK to study something in Degree-level AGAIN. Will the "5 year cap" be applied to him OR, the cap will start from the beginning?

Thank you very very much for helping me....

Reading what vinny has shared above, and also underlined (previously granted), its quite clear that it's a lifetime cap - in your words.

It also clears up the area discussed in this topic around actual study versus, period of leave granted to help in the calculation.

[darkcloud20]

hmm i see . thanks a lot.

I have some confusions regarding which periods are counted in 5 year cap and which are not. I called the HO but my confusion hasn't gone yet. Please see the scenarios below :-

Scenario: The HO has NOT curtailed my visa yet (although they got the report from the uni 1 month ago, for example). They will take the decision of curtailment on 1 July 2016 for 60 days (i.e. ending on 29 Aug 2016), BUT I am leaving the UK tomorrow (1 June 2016). That means I leave the UK 29 days (from 2 June to 30 June) BEFORE my "60 days" start.

-----Will this "29 days" be counted within the 5 year cap?
-----In this scenario, what periods will Not be counted in the 5 year cap?
-----Is it possible that the HO has NOT curtailed my visa yet, EVEN after getting the report from my uni 1 month ago?

[keysersoze22]

Contact your old Universities Tier 4 Compliance Team , and if you don't have one, the International Student Advice Service granting them permission to discuss your case with UKVI and to enquire about your curtailment. They should have their own license account manager who these queries can be raised to.

Thank you so much keysersoze22. You mean License account manager in the university? what is license account manager?

UKVI License manager. Your University will have direct contact with them. I have told you who to contact in your University.

[cs95tdg]

hmm i see . thanks a lot.

I have some confusions regarding which periods are counted in 5 year cap and which are not. I called the HO but my confusion hasn't gone yet. Please see the scenarios below :-

Scenario: The HO has NOT curtailed my visa yet (although they got the report from the uni 1 month ago, for example). They will take the decision of curtailment on 1 July 2016 for 60 days (i.e. ending on 29 Aug 2016), BUT I am leaving the UK tomorrow (1 June 2016). That means I leave the UK 29 days (from 2 June to 30 June) BEFORE my "60 days" start.

-----Will this "29 days" be counted within the 5 year cap?
-----In this scenario, what periods will Not be counted in the 5 year cap?
-----Is it possible that the HO has NOT curtailed my visa yet, EVEN after getting the report from my uni 1 month ago?

The questions you have here are very specific to your circumstances, and those that it wouldn't be possible to answer unless you had access to detailed HO guidance on curtailment procedure & steps. So I would tend to agree with the other member here who has suggested that this would be a question for the HO. Alternatively search the HO web site to see if any guidance has been published publicly. I have seen a archived PDF document on general curtailment procedure, but not anything else.
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... lean_a.pdf

[darkcloud20]

Hi, thanks a lott for the replies.
Three HO staffs told me that I can apply from within the UK for Tier 4, two staffs said I cannot. So I cannot be sure that they are giving the accurate info

Are the rules in Archived document "Curtailment of Leave" should be used?
(in the GOV UK website it is said - This publication was withdrawn on 29 April 2016. This document is no longer current.)
The link: https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... t-of-leave

In the Tier 4 policy guidance for applicants, in page 30 (para 109) it says --

109. We will also count any previous periods of leave you have held under Tier 4 (General) and/or the Student route, where you have subsequently left the UK. This period will be counted from the date the leave began until the date it expired. If you extended your Tier 4/Student leave, or received any period of continuing leave in accordance with section 3c of the Immigration Act 1971, this will be included. If your leave was curtailed, we will take the date the curtailed leave expired.

As it is said in the last sentence (underlined), will HO count the time UP TO the end of curtailment period (i.e. the date on which 60 days will be finished) within the 5 year cap ?

There is another para (112) ---

112. We will count the full period unless there are exceptional compelling and compassionate circumstances that either prevented you from completing the course within the time given or caused you to prematurely leave your course (for example, serious illness or disability).

Can this relate to my withdrawal from the course due to my severe depression? Will HO ignore that 8 months (MSc) if I can show them letter from therapist/mental health doctor ?

The question about calculating duration between two dates :--
(I asked the HO but didn't get any proper answer)

In the Tier 4 guidance for applicants, page 31 (in the worked examples):
From 01 Aug 2015 to 01 Oct 2017 = 27 months. [According to the online software: 26 months 1 day ]
From 01 Aug 2015 to 01 Oct 2020 = 62 months [According to the online software: 62 months 1 day ]
From 01 Aug 2011 to 01 Jan 2017 = 65 months [According to the online software: 65 months 1 day ]
From 01 Aug 2010 to 01 Oct 2014 = 50 months [According to the online software: 50 months 1 day ]

In para 110 of the guidance it says --

We will count time in months, with individual days rounded upwards or downwards to the nearest month. Dates falling on the middle day of the month will be rounded downwards. For the avoidance of doubt, time will not be double-counted.

--Is the calculation in first example (red color underlined) wrong ? I don't know why it is written 27 months in the guidance.
--Are the other ones correct ?
--Para 110 says - "We will count time in months". What does it mean? Can someone please tell me in what way does HO calculate a duration between two dates? (I mean is it like finding the number of days between two dates, and then dividing that by 30, OR, some other way?)

The link for online software: http://www.timeanddate.com/date/duratio ... 2017&ti=on

Thanks again.

[vinny]

--Is the calculation in first example (red color underlined) wrong ? I don't know why it is written 27 months in the guidance.

Probably an error, as it's inconsistent with the other calculations.

--Para 110 says - "We will count time in months". What does it mean? Can someone please tell me in what way does HO calculate a duration between two dates? (I mean is it like finding the number of days between two dates, and then dividing that by 30, OR, some other way?)

Doesn't 110 go on to explain how they round up or down to the nearest month?

We will count time in months, with individual days rounded upwards or downwards to the nearest month. Dates falling on the middle day of the month will be rounded downwards. For the avoidance of doubt, time will not be double-counted.

[keysersoze22]

Can this relate to my withdrawal from the course due to my severe depression? Will HO ignore that 8 months (MSc) if I can show them letter from therapist/mental health doctor ?

Didn't you state earlier on you have no evidence to prove this?

That "particular" concession of the guidance is for student-led withdrawals on the basis of ill health. You've stated your University withdrew you and you took no modules in 8 months. If you infact withdrew yourself from your course after providing all the evidence to your University (and the report that was made to the UKVI by your sponsor made mention of this) then you can look to this route. Otherwise, if you are conjuring evidence from nowhere and your University withdrew you for non attendance/non progression then this won't work.

[darkcloud20]

@keysersoze22.
I SAID I withdrew myself, because I could Not do any module due to my severe depression. My uni did NOT tell me to withdraw. And I did NOT say I don't have evidence. I SAID - "if" there is no evidence (I was being curious). Sorry for the confusions.
When I was going through severe depression, I talked many times with a mental health doctor/therapist (who lives in my home country) over the phone. So basically I called to my home country (to talk to him) from UK. I had sessions with him over the phone (i.e. I was getting treatment over the phone). Can he give me evidence?