EU Citizen with no job

[samira_uk]

Hi,

Does an EU citizen who has lived in the UK for many years but not worked most of the time (due to motherhood and family reasons) can apply for an EU residency card or permanent residency?

Thanks

[member]

How long has she been in the UK?

What is her spouse's nationality?

[samira_uk]

How long has she been in the UK?

What is her spouse's nationality?

for over 10 years and her spouse is British.

[secret.simon]

If she has had Comprehensive Sickness Insurance (essentially private health insurance) or has been covered by her husband's health insurance at work for any five continuous years, then yes.

Otherwise, no.

Mere residence in the UK does not qualify for PR. Specific treaty rights need to be exercised for five continuous years.

[Obie]

Hi,

Does an EU citizen who has lived in the UK for many years but not worked most of the time (due to motherhood and family reasons) can apply for an EU residency card or permanent residency?

Thanks

What is the nationality of the EEA National?

[samira_uk]

Hi,

Does an EU citizen who has lived in the UK for many years but not worked most of the time (due to motherhood and family reasons) can apply for an EU residency card or permanent residency?

Thanks

What is the nationality of the EEA National?

Danish, but does it make any difference? I know many EEA nationals with the same situation and I assume they dont have any way to stay here. Maybe applying for Spouse visa using Appendix FM?

[Obie]

EEA national cannot apply under Appendix FM.

Has the British Person ever resided in another memberstate with the Danish National ?

[Richard W]

EEA national cannot apply under Appendix FM.

I dispute that, and have refuted Obie's arguments posted there. UKVI guidance explicitly states that EEA nationals can apply under the Immigration Rules:

10. EUN1.10 Can EEA nationals apply under the Immigration Rules?
Yes. If an EEA national wishes to apply under the immigration rules, they are entitled to do so.

How is Appendix FM different from the rest of the Rules? I don't think it is.

Starting with FLR(M) is slightly cheaper than starting with a spouse visa. However, note that to make her presence in the UK not "in breach of immigration law", she would have to exit the UK and re-enter and then apply within the 3 months. Possibly she could apply for a spouse visa in Denmark for greater peace of mind and then just travel to the UK. I can see an argument that entering the UK would give her 3 months leave, though I think that argument is wrong. Repeatedly exiting and entering to avoid the need to be a 'qualified person' is an 'abuse' of the law, and may lead to an exclusion from the UK for 12 months under Regulation 19(3)(c) of the EEA Regulations.

Note that as the children are British, they are irrelevant for determining the financial requirement, though as the wife is 'voluntarily' not working, I suspect it is not an issue.

It may be cheaper to obtain Comprehensive Sickness Insurance (CSI) and hope to acquire meaningful 'EEA permanent residence' than to pay for all the visa fees. At least EEA nationals are exempt from the Immigration Health Surcharge, but I have no idea what will happen if the UK leaves the EEA.

There's a Free Movement article on CSI. It's conceivable that Danes in the UK might have it from the Danish government - it was asserted in the Ahmad case cited in the article, but no proof was ever submitted.

[vinny]

The OP's partner is present by the EEA Regulations, so no leave is required.

What happens if she has no right to reside under the EEA regulations? They may refuse FLR(M) or put her on the 10-year route?

[Richard W]

The OP's partner is present by the EEA Regulations, so no leave is required.

What happens if she has no right to reside under the EEA regulations? They may refuse FLR(M) or put her on the 10-year route?

You quoting Regulation 14, 'Extended Right of Residence'. If she regularly had a right under that regulation, we wouldn't (bar misconceptions) have this thread. I've suggested she obtain a right for 3 months under Regulation 13, 'Initial Right of Residence'. Are you perhaps suggesting that she would fall for refusal if this initial right expired while she was waiting for her case to be considered? I know of no argument that applications under consideration prolong automatic EEA rights. In this case, as the couple appear to have British children, Rule EX.1 would probably save the day if the UK is still in the EEA. Under the Rules, using Rule EX.1 is no bar to the 5-year route.

I'm assuming there will be no problem from previous long-term unlawful presence.

[samira_uk]

Thank you all.

My friend did not tell my everything and I just found out that she has worked since 8 months ago. Based on this fact I assume she can apply for a registration certificate based on working status in the UK? and after 5 years of working she can apply for PR.

Given the uncertainty following the Brexit, I myself would go with Appendix FM despite it is much more expensive.

[Richard W]

Based on this fact I assume she can apply for a registration certificate based on working status in the UK?

Provided the work is 'genuine and effective', yes. There might be a problem with a poorly paid part-time job.

and after 5 years of working she can apply for PR.

The most widely predicted date for an imminent departure from the EEA seems to be 2019, so we really don't know. ('Never' is also a popular prediction for when.)

Given the uncertainty following the Brexit, I myself would go with Appendix FM despite it is much more expensive.

A possible, but untested I believe, emergency solution would be to convert her extended right of residence to settled status the way the Irish acquire it - enter the UK from the Republic of Ireland. She would then be qualified to apply for British citizenship after just 3 years of working, which she will clock up at the end of 2018. The unavoidable risk is that naturalisation is at discretion, and she might be refused for exploiting a loophole in the regulations for the Common Travel Area. The loophole was opened in 2014. Another risk is that she might be refused for being in the UK unlawfully before she started working - though I haven't heard of that happening to people on the EEA route. If naturalisation fails, she may be unable to travel abroad and return to the UK while preserving her settled status - the loophole will be closed if the UK leaves the EEA.

Obie is still maintaining that Appendix FM is not available to EEA nationals, and if he is right, trying that route would also lose an expensive application fee.

[Obie]

With the utmost respect, what you are saying is just wrong.

An EEA national cannot convert the Extended Right of Residence to Settled, by coming through Ireland, and applying after 3 years. It is just wrong, and not found anywhere in the law books.

Furthermore it was not me that said EEA national cannot apply under Appendix FM, it is rule 5 of the Immigration rules that said so. There are strong basis for that rule and i support it as legally sound.

[secret.simon]

I am inclined to agree with Obie on both points.

Rule 5 of the Immigration Rules is quite clear.

5.Save where expressly indicated, these Rules do not apply to those persons who are entitled to enter or remain in the United Kingdom by virtue of the provisions of the 2006 EEA Regulations. But any person who is not entitled to rely on the provisions of those Regulations is covered by these Rules.

I believe that the only exception made is when a person has spent part of his stay in the UK under the Immigration Rules and then moves to a stay under the EEA Regulations, he can count the latter stay towards the 10 years long term residency requirements under the Immigration Rules.

A possible, but untested I believe, emergency solution would be to convert her extended right of residence to settled status the way the Irish acquire it - enter the UK from the Republic of Ireland. She would then be qualified to apply for British citizenship after just 3 years of working, which she will clock up at the end of 2018. The unavoidable risk is that naturalisation is at discretion, and she might be refused for exploiting a loophole in the regulations for the Common Travel Area. The loophole was opened in 2014.

I must own that I am wholly unaware of the basis for this advice. Can I request Richard W to elucidate the provisions that came into force in 2014 that he believes makes this scenario possible?

[noajthan]

Unclear how you've missed it secret.simon..

Examples:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... l#p1372062
&
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... d#p1372885

There is then a whole separate topic on that 'theory'.
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... l#p1372811


This topic is for OP with no job.