Help! Family Residence Permit Application - Surinder Singh R

[mckenzieslomp]

Hi,

I am a Canadian citizen, married to a British citizen (June 2016)

We have been living in Berlin (I am on a youth mobility visa) since July 2016 and want to move back to the UK via the Surinder Singh route.

Do I need to apply for a Residence Card in Berlin? Or can we apply directly online for the EEA Family Residence Permit - go back to the UK on this- and then from there apply for a 5 year Residence Card?

We want to know the fastest + safest route to enter back into the UK.

Cheers!

[noajthan]

You cannot apply for a UK RC until resident in UK.

You can apply for a FP which may facilitate your journey.
Or, if you have a German RC (Article 10), you could be hardcore and turn up at the UK border to be stamped in as an EEA dependent.
Good luck.

[Casa]

As your sponsor, what has your British spouse being doing during the time spent together in Germany? Have they been employed?

[mckenzieslomp]

As your sponsor, what has your British spouse being doing during the time spent together in Germany? Have they been employed?

Yes, we have both been employed while in Berlin, and have plenty of proof of this.

[mckenzieslomp]

You cannot apply for a UK RC until resident in UK.

You can apply for a FP which may facilitate your journey.
Or, if you have a German RC (Article 10), you could be hardcore and turn up at the UK border to be stamped in as an EEA dependent.
Good luck.

How long does it take to get a German RC? Do you know?
Will a FP be sufficient to get in? This is applied for online right?

[mckenzieslomp]

Hi,

My husband, a british citizen and I (canadian citizen) applied for the EEA Family Permit under the Regulation 9 and got a refusal letter in the mail today. The reason for refusal was he did not show enough evidence that he was working in the member state (Germany). We included all his invoices but as he is a freelancer it is hard to have any formal sort of contract.

I have 2 questions:
1. Can we apply immediately again?
2. If we include a signed statement that he worked as a freelancer for the company he has been working for, his bank statements, his pay slips and business card, will this be sufficient evidence?

Thank you in advance!

[noajthan]

Hi,

...

I have 2 questions:
1. Can we apply immediately again?
2. If we include a signed statement that he worked as a freelancer for the company he has been working for, his bank statements, his pay slips and business card, will this be sufficient evidence?

Thank you in advance!

1) You can reapply as soon as you have assembled adequate (rock-solid) documentary supporting evidence.
You should ofcourse have been diligently generating the necessary papertrail during your German sojourn.

You can see how a selfemployed qualified person is typically assessed and weighed up in HO guidance here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _clean.pdf

Pro tip: As well as the fundamental proofs of id, don't skimp on evidence of residence (together, preferably) and of relationship (marriage certificate is not enough!).

2) No, self-certification will not be adequate.

How long were you in Germany?
What did you do to integrate there?
Have you been in UK under auspices of previous UK visas?
Do you have any adverse UK immigration history?

[noajthan]

Posts merged.

[mckenzieslomp]

Hi,

...

I have 2 questions:
1. Can we apply immediately again?
2. If we include a signed statement that he worked as a freelancer for the company he has been working for, his bank statements, his pay slips and business card, will this be sufficient evidence?

Thank you in advance!

1) You can reapply as soon as you have assembled adequate (rock-solid) documentary supporting evidence.
You should ofcourse have been diligently generating the necessary papertrail during your German sojourn.

You can see how a selfemployed qualified person is typically assessed and weighed up in HO guidance here:
https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... _clean.pdf

2) No, self-certification will not be adequate.

How long were you in Germany?
What did you do to integrate there?
Have you been in UK under auspices of previous UK visas?
Do you have any adverse UK immigration history?

Thank you for your reply!

We are working on gathering the supporting evidence now. My husband has spoken to his employer and they are drafting up a contract that will state his start date, job description ect. and will be signed by them. Will this be sufficient?

We have been in Germany for 7 months, almost 8, we have registered, rented an apartment, both have jobs and have been travelling Germany, making friends, trying (but failing) to learn some German since being here.

I lived in the UK on a Tier 5 Youth Mobility Visa when I met my husband. I left the country before my visa expired and have no adverse UK immigration history. The refusal for the EEA Family Permit was my first refusal.

Should I appeal the current application and add in the supporting documents or reapply? Which process is quicker?
Is there any other reason they could have refused our application? Or would they have stated these reasons in the letter?

[noajthan]

Thank you for your reply!

We are working on gathering the supporting evidence now. My husband has spoken to his employer and they are drafting up a contract that will state his start date, job description ect. and will be signed by them. Will this be sufficient?

We have been in Germany for 7 months, almost 8, we have registered, rented an apartment, both have jobs and have been travelling Germany, making friends, trying (but failing) to learn some German since being here.

I lived in the UK on a Tier 5 Youth Mobility Visa when I met my husband. I left the country before my visa expired and have no adverse UK immigration history. The refusal for the EEA Family Permit was my first refusal.

Should I appeal the current application and add in the supporting documents or reapply? Which process is quicker?
Is there any other reason they could have refused our application? Or would they have stated these reasons in the letter?

If you have an appeal right, not sure what grounds you have to appeal on if you failed to submit adequate information,.
Reapplying will surely be quicker.

You probably failed at a hurdle and then the process stopped.
I'm not sure whether you would be notified comprehensively of all failure reasons or just for the the first one.

A contract will help.
See what else you can come up with based on the guide (tax registration/docs/tax returns/marketing materials/invoices/receipts/professional accreditation/indemnity insurance & etc etc).

You have the UK's longstanding (but non-EU friendly) centre of life test and recent EEA Regulations changes (related to SS) to contend with.

A poor UK history would now be a showstopper.
7 months in country may be deemed adequate.
A year or so and/or a child in school and/or a property purchase etc would have been better.

More on EEA Regs changes here:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 19308.html

Note the returning British sponsor now appears to have to be a qualified person in UK too (despite Eind case law).

[mckenzieslomp]

Thank you for your reply!

We are working on gathering the supporting evidence now. My husband has spoken to his employer and they are drafting up a contract that will state his start date, job description ect. and will be signed by them. Will this be sufficient?

We have been in Germany for 7 months, almost 8, we have registered, rented an apartment, both have jobs and have been travelling Germany, making friends, trying (but failing) to learn some German since being here.

I lived in the UK on a Tier 5 Youth Mobility Visa when I met my husband. I left the country before my visa expired and have no adverse UK immigration history. The refusal for the EEA Family Permit was my first refusal.

Should I appeal the current application and add in the supporting documents or reapply? Which process is quicker?
Is there any other reason they could have refused our application? Or would they have stated these reasons in the letter?

If you have an appeal right, not sure what grounds you have to appeal on if you failed to submit adequate information,.
Reapplying will surely be quicker.

You probably failed at a hurdle and then the process stopped.
I'm not sure whether you would be notified comprehensively of all failure reasons or just for the the first one.

A contract will help.
See what else you can come up with based on the guide (tax registration/docs/tax returns/marketing materials/invoices/receipts/professional accreditation/indemnity insurance & etc etc).

You have the UK's longstanding (but non-EU friendly) centre of life test and recent EEA Regulations changes (related to SS) to contend with.

A poor UK history would now be a showstopper.
7 months in country may be deemed adequate.
A year or so and/or a child in school and/or a property purchase etc would have been better.

More on EEA Regs changes here:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/eea-ro ... 19308.html

Note the returning British sponsor now appears to have to be a qualified person in UK too (despite Eind case law).

Thanks again!

We plan to reapply. With the following documents submitted is there anything else you can suggest us to include that would better our case?

Supporting Documents:
-original marriage certificate
-my passport
-husbands original passport
-husbands british birth certificate
-application and appointment confiramtion
-two passport sized photos
-my German work contract
-last 6 months of payslips
-current bank statement (to prove I can support myself while over there)
-husbands newly drafted and signed work contract
-husbands invoices
-husbands bank statements
-husbands business card
-husbands tax registration number
-our german registration
-cover letter from my husband stating that he will sponser me
-cover letter form me briefly describing our relationship and that we plan to work when in the UK
-cover letter from my husbands parents saying when they met me and that we can stay with them as long as we want
-photos of my husband and I

Question, should the cover letter my husbad writes, stating he will sponser me contain anything specific? i.e that he is exercising his treaty rights under regulation 9? And should we provide proof in my cover letter of how we have transferred our centre of life to Germany? i.e starting to teach ourselves the language, friends and family to come visit us and see our apartment here ect.

We are looking to give ourselves the best chance we can and don't want to miss anything out this time around.
Thank you for the advice in advance!

[noajthan]

You don't seem to have much showing residence in Germany (to complement treaty rights/work).
For example, house rental/purchase;

• utility bills;
  residence cards;
  local tax documents;
  healthcare arrangements/medical registration;
  any other local German documents (whatever they may be).

Be careful -any such cover letter is tricky.

There have been cases where applicants have been refused due to displaying excessive knowledge of EU law and Surinder Singh case law in particular.
Such knowledge was assumed (by UKVI/HO) to mean that the applicants were trying to circumvent UK domestic immigration.

For example, read and weep:
https://www.freemovement.org.uk/home-of ... knows-law/

So suggest don't quote Surinder Singh chapter and verse.
You could describe your life in Germany in general terms and give examples of how you had moved your centre of life there and begun to assimilate without explicitly mentioning "centre of life".

Hopefully you had long term plans to make a life in Germany (for example, a long-term house rental contract could help to show this) - even if such plans may now have been cut short for some reason or other that has enforced your return to UK.