Irish citizen return to Ireland after practicing treaty rights in other EEA state - confused about application

[alabamadark]

Hello all,

I am an Irish national, my husband a is non EU visa required national. We moved to Germany in April of this year and have received a one year residency card based on article 10. It was based on self sufficient via savings and health insurance.

We emailed europa and we're told we had to be here a minimum of 3 months living before I can return to Ireland. We plan to travel into Ireland using his German residency card, copy of directive and marriage cert in July (closer to the end).

My question is once i am in Ireland will i be applying as stamp 4 or eustamp4. I initially thought I would go there and start over i.e. look for work, get apartment, pps etc. Basically restart practicing eu treaty rights there and be recognized as an eu citizen not an Irish. But reading INIS website about the national immigration route they say this:

A. If you are a non visa required national who has entered the State legally within the last 90 days or if you are a visa required national and you are within the period of permission to remain granted to you on arrival in the State (except short stay ‘c’ visas):, or if you have current permission to remain in the State on an alternative basis both you and your Irish national spouse/civil partner should attend at your local Garda National Immigration Bureau Registration office with the following documentation:

Your original marriage/civil partnership certificate
Your original passport
Your Irish spouse’s/civil partner’s original passport
Evidence of your joint address

My husband is a visa required national but he will be able to enter with the residency card and be stamped for 90 days. So would he be under the '' visa required national and you are within the period of permission to remain granted to you on arrival in the State (except short stay ‘c’ visas)''. Would i then go to the garda get a stamp and have to prove is right to be in ireland is his 90 day based on a member eea state residency card. Or would I have to prove my ''COL'' here in Germany for the last 3 months - which has me worried as I used my Irish bank account for saving but haven't used it here brought cash with me so only have home contract, receipts and health insurance. Still have a month to try and collect more concrete document's as proof -pictures, library cards,events etc.

All help would be appreciated.

[broli]

Why not apply as irish spouse.

We moved to Germany in April of this year : This looks so short and it shows that you never intended to live in germany. They could bring that up as well.

Now i dont know how long is long enough but 3 months using common sens looks more like an attempt to circumvent irish immigration than a genuine eu treaty right residence.

If you would not qualify under eu rules why not to properly follow the eu treaty rights in another country before coming back in the state.

[alabamadark]

I was hoping to apply for the stamp 4 under the Irish spouse national route in Ireland. Applying for the Irish spouse visa would not be successful as i haven't been working the 3 previous years with 40k earnings. Also the country my husband is from is not issuing any visa's to Ireland. I found out about the SS route when i was speaking to embassy staff who told me it's taking well over a year to even get a response.

Do Irish people applying get refusals based on trying to circumvent immigration laws? I thought that only happened in UK, as the minimum time set in EU law to change COL is 3 month's. The problem is I've been looking online and there's not many example's of Irish nationals using this route.

I thought I wouldn't have to get the lengthy stamp 4eufam as my husband possessing the card is proof of my practicing my right's in Germany, therefore he enter's the country legally with no c visa and we would get around the national route's rule's.

[broli]

Do Irish people applying get refusals based on trying to circumvent immigration laws? I thought that only happened in UK , Only one girl i know was rejected she was recently naturalized and tried doing like you through another eu country last year (Because she came in the state via an Eu treaty right as well and got divorce). but then she got approved with irish route later on as she made enough money.

I thought I wouldn't have to get the lengthy stamp 4eufam as my husband possessing the card is proof of my practicing my right's in Germany, therefore he enter's the country legally with no c visa and we would get around the national route's rule's.
http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/vi ... dence-card he doesnt need a visa as per link.

Your EU/EEA or Swiss family member has rights under EU treaties that may allow you to accompany or join them in Ireland without a visa.

So once in the country you can apply for anything. But you know that you will to take up a JOB or study while having enough money. Suffiscient ressources if you have really good savings. a lawyer told me if you suffiscient ressources comes from saving you need to show you can have more than 500€ a week not official though.


If i were you i would in the EU for at least a year before coming back. Coming after 3 months they wont thrilled about but it could still be OK .


Now can i asked the card that you have is only 1 year why ? EU treaty right cards are 5 years are you sure its not a temporary while they process your application ?
Please not that in Ireland the first card is 6 months then after you get 5 years.

IF your card is temporary then no chance to get approval here

[alabamadark]

Here in Germany I've seen many people getting different length cards in facebook groups. It's not a temp. Just based on the immigration officers decision, we came with enough savings for 3 years. The week before we came and left with no card on an insurance technicality which we fixed and came back. I just believe they're unfamiliar with self sufficient so seemed apprehensive giving us anything not based on study or employment. My husband is trying to get a job this week and if he does we will go back again and try change the card. But she just asked us questions about what we were up to. She just decided a year and said come back if it changes before than - just printed on the spot.

For the national spouse route do they look at anything besides address and marriage certificate? I was just hoping to do this as even though that stamp gives less right's to the non - eu in term's of travel requirement's, you can get it quicker.

What should I do here to prove COL? Besides lease as I'm self sufficient seems more tricky to prove.

My reason's for going to Ireland so quick is I'll get a good job here compared to here all the non German jobs seem to be factory work and hey don't want a woman. We have good saving's and our own apartment so seems silly to stay here longer than necessary when I'm just sitting on my arse all day.

[jlad]

Hi alabamadark,

I am too in Germany now holding the residence card for Family Member of Union Citizen. My card, however, lasts 3.5 years but the officer in my local Immigration office did apologise to me because it usually is a 5-years residence card but due to my passport expires in 3.5 years so they can only issue the residence card till the passport expires. But i have been told to renew it once i have a new passport. I have already been here 2 years now.

My partner and I are thinking of moving to Ireland next year (depending on work) and we are going to go through the similar process with yours. And i did send a quick email to INIS and also Irish Embassy here in Germany (Berlin) a while ago in regards to the process of moving to Ireland based on marriage to Irish spouse. I got a reply within an hour to say;

Dear xxx,

As you are a xx Citizen married to an Irish Citizen, you do not
require a visa to enter the State. Your passport will be stamped on entry
by an Immigration officer at the airport - usually for 90 days but this is
at the discretion of the officer..

On entry you should inform the immigration officer that you are relocating
to reside here on a full time basis with your spouse. Before the entry
stamp expires you should both attend the local Immigration office to
register as the spouse of an Irish National. If residing in Dublin you
attend the Garda National Immigration Office 13/14 Burgh Quay Dublin 2.

Attendance is by appointment only. To make an appointment go to
http://burghquayregistrationoffice.inis.gov.ie

Ensure you bring both your passports, marriage certificate and evidence of
where you are residing.

You will then be issued with a registration card/stamp 4 which will enable
you to reside in the State, enter employment without the need of a work
permit and set up a business in the State without the consent of the
Minister. Your passport will be endorsed on the day to reflect this. As the
spouse of an Irish national there is no fee.

This permission will be for one year and is renewable once you attend your
nearest Garda Immigration Office together a month prior to the expiry date
bringing both your passports, marriage certificate, proof of address and
once you have abided by the laws of the State. Should you fail to renew
the stamp before the current one expires you would become illegal in the
State and if you wished to remain, you would have to make a new
application to this office which can take 12 months to process

Please note you cannot start this process from outside the State.

If you intended to enter Ireland using the residence card, the Immigration Officer in Dublin (or any port of entry in Ireland) might not stamp your passport because of the EU law - just like how EU citizen entering an EU country they won't stamp your passport. So this can cause problems if you go to your local Immigration office and with no stamp on your husband's passport stating on his intention to come to Ireland to join Irish spouse. I might be wrong but just thought i would give you an insight.

If you could get round that, could you please update with all of us your process. It seems like a straight forward process according to the email that your husband would receive a stamp on your appointment on the day to allow residence in Ireland.

[broli]

@ alabamadark from what this guy it seems you only got 1 years because there's little suggesting that you intend to stay in germany. they would probably increase spouse got a JOB.

[alabamadark]

Thanks for the helpful replies. So seem's like I should be ok, before our travel date I'll try my hardest to find work just to increase the length on the card as seems to be the main point of worry in this plan.

If not, do you think it's possible I bring something to prove my cads not a temp?

I'm worried if asked by either immigration at Dublin airport or the gards, I say the wrong thing and they accuse me of circumventing immigration laws. It shouldn't be a problem, but don't want to put me foot i my mouth if questioned why our card is only a year.

[alabamadark]

My partner and I are thinking of moving to Ireland next year (depending on work) and we are going to go through the similar process with yours. And i did send a quick email to INIS and also Irish Embassy here in Germany (Berlin) a while ago in regards to the process of moving to Ireland based on marriage to Irish spouse. I got a reply within an hour to say;

Dear xxx,

As you are a xx Citizen married to an Irish Citizen, you do not
require a visa to enter the State. Your passport will be stamped on entry
by an Immigration officer at the airport - usually for 90 days but this is
at the discretion of the officer..

On entry you should inform the immigration officer that you are relocating
to reside here on a full time basis with your spouse. Before the entry
stamp expires you should both attend the local Immigration office to
register as the spouse of an Irish National. If residing in Dublin you
attend the Garda National Immigration Office 13/14 Burgh Quay Dublin 2.

Attendance is by appointment only. To make an appointment go to
http://burghquayregistrationoffice.inis.gov.ie

Ensure you bring both your passports, marriage certificate and evidence of
where you are residing.

You will then be issued with a registration card/stamp 4 which will enable
you to reside in the State, enter employment without the need of a work
permit and set up a business in the State without the consent of the
Minister. Your passport will be endorsed on the day to reflect this. As the
spouse of an Irish national there is no fee.

This permission will be for one year and is renewable once you attend your
nearest Garda Immigration Office together a month prior to the expiry date
bringing both your passports, marriage certificate, proof of address and
once you have abided by the laws of the State. Should you fail to renew
the stamp before the current one expires you would become illegal in the
State and if you wished to remain, you would have to make a new
application to this office which can take 12 months to process

Please note you cannot start this process from outside the State.

Thanks, that email is really clear guidance. When I emailed INIS in regards to my queries, they just forwarded me onto Dublin airport immigration and the German embassy site has only got a 250 character limit to query's.

I'll update you how we get on as were planning to leave end of july, just in case the national route won't work I'll have the ea route to fall back on - as I'll have completed the 3 months minimum.

[jul1]

In theory 3 month should be enough to return and claim article 10. The ECJ made that clear, and that the reason behind you move is irrelevant. Unfortunately some county like UK doesn't want to accept that and forces people to live 6-12 months in another eu country before return, and they dont accept self-sufficiency for the SS route.

In Ireland as far as i know they are not bitching about this too much, and if you were an eu citizen but not Irish would be extremely simple, cause you just have to enter Ireland, and from that on they could not decline you...But as your Irish you have less right in Ireland in that matter, so better to be careful about it.

First, i would rather bought return tickets for both of you to Germany, and when you enter Ireland just say you are visiting for a week, than you leave, it will be easier to get in, you can read my topic about this, im Hungarian, with my Filipino wife, with a valid visa-c in her passport we had to argue for half an hour with the IO at the airport, depending on the nationality they are told to be more suspicious.

As in the Operation Vantage it turned out that eastern eu marrying asian means potentially higher risk for sham marriage, they really questioned us, and thank that i was really prepared with the documents and our rights, i had to correct the IO a lot, than we entered, the rest was sorted fine since than.
Would have been much easier to just get a return ticket, and we could save the hassle.
Which way is better for you, depend on non-eu spouse nationality, and the current IO at the airport.

I think you were likely to succeed with 3 months in Germany on self-sufficiency, but it would be better chances with 6 months, and u actually working in there. Anyway, you have to spend quite a money on official translation later, to prove that u were living in Germany.

About your case INIS website doesnt share too much information:

"Applications based on Irish nationals are not accepted by EU Treaty Rights Unit
Please note that we cannot accept applications under EU Treaty Rights provisions from non-EEA family members of Irish nationals. Directive 2004/38/EC on the right of citizens of the EU and their family members to move and reside freely within the territory of the Member States applies only to Union citizens who move to or reside in a Member State other than that of which they are a national.

Exceptions to this apply only in cases where the non-EEA national family member has previously held a residence card of a family member of a Union citizen which has been issued by another Member State under Article 10 of the Directive."

http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/EU ... y%20Rights

[jlad]

Hi alabamadark,

I have to remind you that the reply i got from INIS is based on my circumstances. I am non-visa required national to enter Ireland/UK/EU so i think that smooth things out for me a little bit. Based on the email i have received from INIS, i highly doubt that they consider my case under EU regulations although i had told them that i hold Article 10 Residence Card issued by Germany. I think they actually consider me under Irish national law instead. But having the Article 10 residence card gives me extra protection if it does not work out for Irish national law and i can go through EU law.

However, your situation is slightly tricky. You have mentioned that your husband is visa-required national and your intention to enter Ireland using German-issued Article 10 residence card (to get visa-free entrance) and once you enter in Ireland then you want to switch to national law to get the stamp. I do not know how that would work out because you are switching systems (EU to national).

I can not advice you on this because i do not know how it works, or whether it works. It is because when you go and see your local immigration officer, i do not know whether they will check based on the non-EU's nationality is visa-required or non-visa required. If they do, they might direct you to EU treaty section for application since you are entering Ireland under EU directive? I might be wrong and correct me if i do.

I would suggest you to check with maybe EU treaty sections in INIS and also INIS to clarify on this (but it would sounds fishy to them that you are trying to play with the system)

Otherwise, check with jul1 to see whether his/her Filipino's wife get stamp stating to join spouse on her arrival in Ireland. I have been to Ireland a few times myself and i always get stamped to say why i am there for and for how long. Sometimes i get full 90 days, sometimes they even asked me how long do i need (Irish IO are very friendly imo). If it does, you could try (national route) and argue your way out when your visit your local Immigration officer.

Hope this helps and do share your experience with us once you have enter Ireland and tell us which route you have chose.

[jul1]

I dont think she ever mentioned that they want to enter Ireland on the German resident card than switch to national law. First it is not possible (to be here more than 90 days legally, entering Ireland on the article 10 card is no problem) , the non-eu spouse has to be outside of Ireland to apply for visa D, and with eu treaty rights her husband would get stamp4 eu fam, and they can travel in Europe with that card visa free which is much better than normal stamp 4.

Also there is a requirement, similar to UK, that u have make certain amount, i think it is 50k in the last 3 years, which is not that hard to gain, considering the minimum wage is about 20k in Ireland, but she mentioned she is not living in Ireland for a while, and just like in UK, in case where the Irish citizen left the country for years, got married with non-eu, they cant just come back. first the Irish citizen has to move back to gain money here, then they can apply.

For them the SS route is the best, just make sure u collected loads of documents to prove that u were there, though i dont know if Ireland is that strict than UK, if they really want to see those docs collected in Germany, and translated officially (cold be thousands of euros).

On INIS website they just say if has an article 10 card from another eu country, than u can fall under eu treaty rights.

[alabamadark]

That was what I was hoping for, that by entering with the residency card I would be able to get a 90 day stamp and be able to apply under national law. As this would reduce the length of time he would get citizenship to 3 years. Also, I wouldn't be scared of losing work during that time, as my husband plans not on working for awhile just studying for a year to switch his current qualifications to the Irish standard.

I feel like this would be possible as on INIS site it sates a non eu can apply from within the state as long as they were stamped with permission to stay at the airport (except with the c visa). For awhile we tried to find work so he could enter on a work visa and apply under the national route but that effort was unfruitful. So by entering with the card we would legally be there according to eu law, therefore Irish law.

It is heavily dependent on how our immigration officer in cork would accept it. I've read as long as my husband enters the state not on a c visa we would be ok. And just explaining at dublin airport we need the stamp as we plan on settling. I am legally allowed to enter , but just worried as if we travel with the card, I've read they don't stamp and when i emailed Dublin airport immigration they told me to go to the eu queue but i think we would have better chance of getting said stamp in non eu queue. What are your thoughts on this, does it seem like it would work?

It is very frustrating for me the irish spouse visa rule's. I have enough savings that if we were applying for the spouse visa in the uk as uk citiziens i would be accepted. I was advised by a lawyer they will deny as I have not worked 3 years in the state, also they are not issuing visa's anymore from my husbands country, wait time's are over 14 month's currently. So really applying for the d visa is not an option.

[jul1]

That was what I was hoping for, that by entering with the residency card I would be able to get a 90 day stamp and be able to apply under national law. As this would reduce the length of time he would get citizenship to 3 years. Also, I wouldn't be scared of losing work during that time, as my husband plans not on working for awhile just studying for a year to switch his current qualifications to the Irish standard.

I feel like this would be possible as on INIS site it sates a non eu can apply from within the state as long as they were stamped with permission to stay at the airport (except with the c visa). For awhile we tried to find work so he could enter on a work visa and apply under the national route but that effort was unfruitful. So by entering with the card we would legally be there according to eu law, therefore Irish law.

It is heavily dependent on how our immigration officer in cork would accept it. I've read as long as my husband enters the state not on a c visa we would be ok. And just explaining at dublin airport we need the stamp as we plan on settling. I am legally allowed to enter , but just worried as if we travel with the card, I've read they don't stamp and when i emailed Dublin airport immigration they told me to go to the eu queue but i think we would have better chance of getting said stamp in non eu queue. What are your thoughts on this, does it seem like it would work?

It is very frustrating for me the irish spouse visa rule's. I have enough savings that if we were applying for the spouse visa in the uk as uk citiziens i would be accepted. I was advised by a lawyer they will deny as I have not worked 3 years in the state, also they are not issuing visa's anymore from my husbands country, wait time's are over 14 month's currently. So really applying for the d visa is not an option.

As i understand the rules, there is no way that a non-eu spouse can get like stamp 4, when they were not legally resident in Ireland before. You can travel with you German resident card for sure, and have to specifically ask them to stamp your passport, but im not sure they will do that now, that is against the rules when travelling on an article 10 card. This card will allow you to be here for 90 days, so its like a visa-c.

If you were both legally residing here. than got married i think u could have stamp 4, but coming on a visa-c/article 10 card means you are not legally residing here. In this case you have to apply for visa-D family reunification, that takes 6-12 months.

I dont understand when u say "they are not issuing visa's anymore from my husbands country".... the visa has to be given by the Ireland, the decision will be made in Dublin, and if accepted you can collect the visa in Germany in the Irish embassy...so your country doesn't have to issue any visa to you, but yeah, cause of the 3 years non working period it will be denied probably.

Also this: " For awhile we tried to find work so he could enter on a work visa and apply under the national route but that effort was unfruitful."

It doesnt work like that, just because he gets a job in Germany with his article 10 card (working rights automatically given by the eu treaty rights), does not mean that he can apply in Ireland for a working visa, that is very hard to get, mostly doctors , nurses, special engineers, programmers, chefs maybe, can usually get work permits, for the rest is very hard or impossible.

I think there is only one really sure way for you to sort this out, travel here on the article 10 card, than right away apply on the eu1 form, and explain your situation.
Try to get a solicitor who is experienced in eu treaty rights, applied for a returning Irish citizen with non-eu spouse, who was exercising eu treaty rights in another eu country. £ months should be enough, but i would rather be there for 6 months, at this point i dont know how much the Irish practice is based on the UK one.
That is better to figure it out, cause in the UK they are looking for 6-12 months living in another eu country, self sufficiency is not accepted but work only. Better to do some research before jumping back to Ireland just to be declined.

[together_2017]

I think you will not get a problem as per my experience unless really a bad day.

I myself Non-Eu
Wife: Irish

She Went to other eu state and I secured my residency from xyz EU state (5 Years) thu in my case.

As soon as we land in dublin airport not a single question was asked !

But yea they wont stamp , my non-eu passport and that's the problem you face some difficulties during next process. Althu I asked but nope they dont stamp at all !

As soon as we were in the state I was just waiting for my wife to get on the job and when she started the job we went to GNIB we were treated as we came illegaly they dont know a shit about eu treaty rights section. They misbehaved us and taunt us really in a bad way.

To cut a long story short we did not get a single thing from GNIB.

Now I ll save your time here. Go home and relax just put the EU1 Application thats all you need !!! And within few weeks ur husband will get the temp stamp and he can start study/work whatever he wants to

Myself recently On March 2018 secured my EU FAM 5 Years
I landed in Dublin April 2017

[alabamadark]

I think you will not get a problem as per my experience unless really a bad day.

I myself Non-Eu
Wife: Irish

She Went to other eu state and I secured my residency from xyz EU state (5 Years) thu in my case.

As soon as we land in dublin airport not a single question was asked !

But yea they wont stamp , my non-eu passport and that's the problem you face some difficulties during next process. Althu I asked but nope they dont stamp at all !

As soon as we were in the state I was just waiting for my wife to get on the job and when she started the job we went to GNIB we were treated as we came illegaly they dont know a shit about eu treaty rights section. They misbehaved us and taunt us really in a bad way.

To cut a long story short we did not get a single thing from GNIB.

Now I ll save your time here. Go home and relax just put the EU1 Application thats all you need !!! And within few weeks ur husband will get the temp stamp and he can start study/work whatever he wants to

Myself recently On March 2018 secured my EU FAM 5 Years
I landed in Dublin April 2017

Can i ask about the process when you applied your eu1?

Did you explain in your cover letter about having a residency card from another member state?

Did you enclose proof of practicing treaty rights where you were issued the card? Was the further questioning on this to provide more proof's of your say in the member sate or were he paper's you submitted mainly in regard's to your say in Ireland?

[alabamadark]

As i understand the rules, there is no way that a non-eu spouse can get like stamp 4, when they were not legally resident in Ireland before. You can travel with you German resident card for sure, and have to specifically ask them to stamp your passport, but im not sure they will do that now, that is against the rules when travelling on an article 10 card. This card will allow you to be here for 90 days, so its like a visa-c.

If you were both legally residing here. than got married i think u could have stamp 4, but coming on a visa-c/article 10 card means you are not legally residing here. In this case you have to apply for visa-D family reunification, that takes 6-12 months.

I dont understand when u say "they are not issuing visa's anymore from my husbands country".... the visa has to be given by the Ireland, the decision will be made in Dublin, and if accepted you can collect the visa in Germany in the Irish embassy...so your country doesn't have to issue any visa to you, but yeah, cause of the 3 years non working period it will be denied probably.

Also this: " For awhile we tried to find work so he could enter on a work visa and apply under the national route but that effort was unfruitful."

It doesnt work like that, just because he gets a job in Germany with his article 10 card (working rights automatically given by the eu treaty rights), does not mean that he can apply in Ireland for a working visa, that is very hard to get, mostly doctors , nurses, special engineers, programmers, chefs maybe, can usually get work permits, for the rest is very hard or impossible.

I think there is only one really sure way for you to sort this out, travel here on the article 10 card, than right away apply on the eu1 form, and explain your situation.
Try to get a solicitor who is experienced in eu treaty rights, applied for a returning Irish citizen with non-eu spouse, who was exercising eu treaty rights in another eu country. £ months should be enough, but i would rather be there for 6 months, at this point i dont know how much the Irish practice is based on the UK one.
That is better to figure it out, cause in the UK they are looking for 6-12 months living in another eu country, self sufficiency is not accepted but work only. Better to do some research before jumping back to Ireland just to be declined.

OK sure, looks like I'll have to give up hope of trying he Irish national route. I'll still pop into our local garda and ask as were no in Dublin so should be easy to inquire. I'm just am combing through the law now to bring proof to see what is accepted under that route as I know a lot of officials are unhelpful with regards to more complex immigration cases. You think I could try find a way, bring a solicitor with me and argue my case to the garda in Cork? Or here would be no point in that?

I'll just focus now on trying to get our residency card for a longer duration here and to go via the eu route which was our original plan.

[jul1]

As i understand the rules, there is no way that a non-eu spouse can get like stamp 4, when they were not legally resident in Ireland before. You can travel with you German resident card for sure, and have to specifically ask them to stamp your passport, but im not sure they will do that now, that is against the rules when travelling on an article 10 card. This card will allow you to be here for 90 days, so its like a visa-c.

If you were both legally residing here. than got married i think u could have stamp 4, but coming on a visa-c/article 10 card means you are not legally residing here. In this case you have to apply for visa-D family reunification, that takes 6-12 months.

I dont understand when u say "they are not issuing visa's anymore from my husbands country".... the visa has to be given by the Ireland, the decision will be made in Dublin, and if accepted you can collect the visa in Germany in the Irish embassy...so your country doesn't have to issue any visa to you, but yeah, cause of the 3 years non working period it will be denied probably.

Also this: " For awhile we tried to find work so he could enter on a work visa and apply under the national route but that effort was unfruitful."

It doesnt work like that, just because he gets a job in Germany with his article 10 card (working rights automatically given by the eu treaty rights), does not mean that he can apply in Ireland for a working visa, that is very hard to get, mostly doctors , nurses, special engineers, programmers, chefs maybe, can usually get work permits, for the rest is very hard or impossible.

I think there is only one really sure way for you to sort this out, travel here on the article 10 card, than right away apply on the eu1 form, and explain your situation.
Try to get a solicitor who is experienced in eu treaty rights, applied for a returning Irish citizen with non-eu spouse, who was exercising eu treaty rights in another eu country. £ months should be enough, but i would rather be there for 6 months, at this point i dont know how much the Irish practice is based on the UK one.
That is better to figure it out, cause in the UK they are looking for 6-12 months living in another eu country, self sufficiency is not accepted but work only. Better to do some research before jumping back to Ireland just to be declined.

OK sure, looks like I'll have to give up hope of trying he Irish national route. I'll still pop into our local garda and ask as were no in Dublin so should be easy to inquire. I'm just am combing through the law now to bring proof to see what is accepted under that route as I know a lot of officials are unhelpful with regards to more complex immigration cases. You think I could try find a way, bring a solicitor with me and argue my case to the garda in Cork? Or here would be no point in that?

I'll just focus now on trying to get our residency card for a longer duration here and to go via the eu route which was our original plan.

Highly doubt that u can argue with the garda with a solictor on ur side...

Start the EU1 application, sent it INIS with all the proof u have, dont sent originals, only if requested. Normally u dont need a solicitor for EU1 application, i did it myself, u only need one maybe if you are declined, but if u are well prepared u can argue urself, the eu treaty rights is very strong in general, and ur case doesnt look complicated, the vultures are asking for 150eur/hours....better to save that

[alabamadark]

Ok look's like I'll go ahead with just the eufam route as I've no other options. Was just trying to avoid as Ireland is taking ages to issue the cards. Do you thin i could apply for naturalization after 3 yeas for my spouse as he is sill married to an Irish national or am I then classified as an eu spouse?