URGENT: Tier1 -> ILR Received, Status of Wife and Child

[AO]

Hi All:

Thanks for this wonderfully helpful forum.

I received my ILR last month (21st Feb). My wife's still on PBS Dependent Visa. I didnt know that she had to be moved to FLR (M) and recently came to know. A lawyer also told me that since my visa has changed and hers has become invalid, she loses the 1.5 years she has already spent in UK towards her qualification period for ILR. Is that true?

How quickly does she need to switch to FLR (M) to not lose status and past period? I've read 28 days somewhere. Is that true? Its only 2-3 days before that 28-day limit will pass. So, I need to do this really quick. Since no PEO appts are available for atleast 2-3 weeks, should I put in a mail application?

Also, my son was born on 29th February AFTER my ILR was received. Does that mean he is automatically a british citizen and I dont need to file the form MN11 (?). Just go to the post-office and apply for a British passport. How long does that take to come in?

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Thanks very much...

A.

[Greenie]

There is nothing in the law that says she needs to apply within 28 days. Best to apply sooner rather than later though and she shouldn't travel on her current visa.

The lawyer you spoke to is wrong. Her time as a tier 1 dependent is not lost at all. It will count towards her two years for ilr but she does need to switch on FLRM first. Assuming your son was born in the UK yes he is automatically British.

[AO]

There is nothing in the law that says she needs to apply within 28 days. Best to apply sooner rather than later though and she shouldn't travel on her current visa.

The lawyer you spoke to is wrong. Her time as a tier 1 dependent is not lost at all. It will count towards her two years for ilr but she does need to switch on FLRM first. Assuming your son was born in the UK yes he is automatically British.

Thanks Greenie.

However, I was concerned that if the 28 day limit passes and she "loses" her current status, we might have to start all over again with regards to the time period...

I think the lawyer was trying to pressurize / scare me into applying a PEO application with him immediately. Guess that happens quite often which is why I don't use lawyers and try to do my own filings - and sometimes make mistakes too...

[vinny]

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Her current dependant leave ceases to be valid for travel, as entry is subject to 321A.

[AO]

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Her current dependant leave ceases to be valid for travel, as entry is subject to 321A.

Thanks, Vinnie. So...

What you're saying is that 28-day limit doesnt apply BUT she cannot return back to the country on the current visa. Does it matter if she applies for FLR (M) inside the UK or outside the UK? Does that have a material impact on her preserving her 1.5 year residency in UK? We can't get a PEO appointment but can possibly mail in an application FLR(M). We have exactly a month before we leave. Any place I can get average processing times for FLR(M)?

[osteophytes]

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Her current dependant leave ceases to be valid for travel, as entry is subject to 321A.

Thanks, Vinnie. So...

What you're saying is that 28-day limit doesnt apply BUT she cannot return back to the country on the current visa. Does it matter if she applies for FLR (M) inside the UK or outside the UK? Does that have a material impact on her preserving her 1.5 year residency in UK? We can't get a PEO appointment but can possibly mail in an application FLR(M). We have exactly a month before we leave. Any place I can get average processing times for FLR(M)?

You might be able to apply from outside UK but the processing times for that visa are long (unlike non-immigrant visas). Why dont you try a PEO appointment? If you cant find one, some solicitors have few slots booked each week and they might be able to help. Try a decent solicitor and not a dodgy one like you had before

[AO]

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Her current dependant leave ceases to be valid for travel, as entry is subject to 321A.

Thanks, Vinnie. So...

What you're saying is that 28-day limit doesnt apply BUT she cannot return back to the country on the current visa. Does it matter if she applies for FLR (M) inside the UK or outside the UK? Does that have a material impact on her preserving her 1.5 year residency in UK? We can't get a PEO appointment but can possibly mail in an application FLR(M). We have exactly a month before we leave. Any place I can get average processing times for FLR(M)?

You might be able to apply from outside UK but the processing times for that visa are long (unlike non-immigrant visas). Why dont you try a PEO appointment? If you cant find one, some solicitors have few slots booked each week and they might be able to help. Try a decent solicitor and not a dodgy one like you had before

OK, so hear is the dilemma.

Counting backwards, Monday is the 28th day since the day I was approved the ILR and her "PBS" became invalid. The following link talks about 28 days:

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... ing-in-uk/

but this is about applying BEFORE expiring current leave to remain not AFTER. I am guessing from the replies on this forum that this doesnt apply to me.

If there is a 28 day period, then the only thing I can do is to apply by post post-marking the application for Monday. No chance I'll get it in a month. Don't think I can get a decent solicitor to arrange for a monday appointment without getting shot in the arm and the leg. But the FLR(M) processing times I got from other places on this forum look quite insane.

If the 28 day limit does not apply, then I can get a PEO before I leave and do this in person.

My wife went through child birth during these last couple of weeks and we were busy coping with all that comes with it and hence we've missed doing this earlier. You think this would could for mitigating circumstances with the case officer to allow our application even if we over-stepped a timelimit - real or percevied.

The question really is, is there a 28 day limit or no limit for applying FLR(M)? Can anyone give me a ref to a relevant official document?


One of the lawyer I spoke with today remarked: "They [UKBA] people are only there to send you back, they're not there to help you" ... Or am I just being a bit paranoid...

[vinny]

I cannot see any immigration rules stating that she must switch within 28 days, following her husband's ILR.

[Greenie]

There is not a 28 day requirement. I can't give you a ref to a rule that doesn't exist!

The link you have posted doesn't talk about a 28 day requirement either. The ukba advise people to apply at least 28 days before expiry of leave but this is not a requirement and is not relevant to your wife's situation. You should apply as soon as practically possible though. When is the earliest you can get a peo appointment for?

applying from abroad is not an option because in order to accumulate the two years between the time spent as a PBS dependent and spouse of a settled person she needs to obtain an extension of stay and not entry clearance as your spouse. See para 287 a i d
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... _partners/


Does your wife meet the English language requirement?

[AO]

There is not a 28 day requirement. I can't give you a ref to a rule that doesn't exist!

The link you have posted doesn't talk about a 28 day requirement either. The ukba advise people to apply at least 28 days before expiry of leave but this is not a requirement and is not relevant to your wife's situation. You should apply as soon as practically possible though. When is the earliest you can get a peo appointment for?

applying from abroad is not an option because in order to accumulate the two years between the time spent as a PBS dependent and spouse of a settled person she needs to obtain an extension of stay and not entry clearance as your spouse. See para 287 a i d
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... _partners/


Does your wife meet the English language requirement?

Greene,Thanks.

My wife qualifies the English Language requirement. Bachelors degree in English - she's qualified the PBS on this twice - and we've also taken the Knowledge of Life in UK Test which qualifies as English Language Test as well (at least for the ILR). Although the FLR forms do not seem to recognise this. We can get a PEO appointment for the 29th in Glasgow.

One more quick question, is there a maintenance requirement for FLR(M) applications from inside the UK? The form (dated 10/2011) doesn't seem to suggest that, though I know there is some maintenance requirement from applying from outside the country.

Much appreciated.

[vinny]

Can you apply?

[vinny]

Hi There:

I had my visa recently converted to ILR. My wife is still on the PBS Tier 1 visa so needs to move to FLR(M) for a few months before she can apply for ILR. We're both inside the UK right now but plan to travel abroad for a month or so.

I wanted to find out about the Maintenance Requirement for FLR(M) applied from inside the country. While Maintenance funds for PBS was quite straight forward (£x in the bank account) the maintenance for FLR(M) is a lot fuzzy and leaves a lot of discretion to the case worker. What does 20 months of maintainability mean? How do the case workers generally assess employability of the main applicant and the spouse?

Can anyone with experience elaborate a bit?

Also, what difference would it make if we went out of the country and applied from outside the UK? Does that affect her continued status in anyway? I know she can't come back into the country on the PBS Dependent visa so we need to do it before she travels back but would going out, in any way, affect her residency requirements (start the clock all over again)?

Much appreciated.

-A.

[vinny]

Hi There:

My Tier1 General was converted to the ILR 3 weeks ago.

I understand my wife, who was a PBS dependent, now needs to change to FLR(M). We were planning to go out of the country in early April (all arrangements made) for a couple of months and I understand that she won't be able be able to re-enter on the PBS Dependent Visa even if it is valid.

I also understand - from answers read on the forum - that there is no 28 days limit for doing this. It must simply be done "as soon as possible."

I have three questions:

a) When she moves to FLR(M) does that re-set her residency clock back to zero (start all over again). Means her 1.5 years in UK have gone wasted. I am asking because I am getting conflicting opinions from both lawyers I've asked and this forum. Any authoratative answer and/or references?

b) If, due to certain circumstances, we cannot apply a PEO appointment before we leave, we'll have to apply an FLR(M) or equivalent from outside the country (Pakistan). Does that have any material change on her status (i.e. residency clock) or would hers be considered a continuous residency with some absence from the country?

c) If the residency clock doesn't changes when switching between different category dependent visas, or between applying while being inside the UK or outside, then when does the residency clock re-start? Presumably if the FLR(M) or equivalent is not applied "as soon as possible".

There is a chance that we might spend considerable more than 2 months outside UK, does that mean the clock will definitely start over. I am sure after a while the the previous residency will become immaterial but is there a threshold, 3 months, 4 months?

Highly appreciate a response from an experienced hand...

Best,
-A.

[vinny]

applying from abroad is not an option because in order to accumulate the two years between the time spent as a PBS dependent and spouse of a settled person she needs to obtain an extension of stay and not entry clearance as your spouse. See para 287 a i d
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... _partners/

(d) the applicant was admitted to the UK or given an extension of stay as the spouse or civil partner of a Relevant Points Based System Migrant, and then obtained an extension of stay under paragraphs 281 to 286 of these Rules and has completed a period of 2 years as the spouse or civil partner of the person who is now present and settled here; or

It's ambiguous. Applying from outside the UK is subject to 281. However, 281 is an entry clearance application and not an extension of stay application.

[AO]

applying from abroad is not an option because in order to accumulate the two years between the time spent as a PBS dependent and spouse of a settled person she needs to obtain an extension of stay and not entry clearance as your spouse. See para 287 a i d
http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/polic ... _partners/

(d) the applicant was admitted to the UK or given an extension of stay as the spouse or civil partner of a Relevant Points Based System Migrant, and then obtained an extension of stay under paragraphs 281 to 286 of these Rules and has completed a period of 2 years as the spouse or civil partner of the person who is now present and settled here; or

It's ambiguous. Applying from outside the UK is subject to 281. However, 281 is an entry clearance application and not an extension of stay application.

Thanks Vinnie.

Can you please comment on re-setting of the clocks? Does her clock re-set to zero if she gets onto FLR from PBS Dependent now? I know Greenie has said above that they don't. I was trying to confirm that by looking at several other posts on the forum and have found very conflicting assessments.

If the clocks are re-set anyway, then it doesn't really matter if we apply from inside or outside the UK. An FLR(M) with reset clock is as good as as new entry clearance.

Thanks very much.

[vinny]

An FLR(M) application should not reset her clock. It's uncertain if a spouse entry clearance application will, or will not, reset her clock, as 287(a)(i)(d) is ambiguously worded.

[AO]

Hi There:

I had my visa recently converted to ILR. My wife is still on the PBS Tier 1 visa so needs to move to FLR(M) for a few months before she can apply for ILR. We're both inside the UK right now but plan to travel abroad for a month or so.

I wanted to find out about the Maintenance Requirement for FLR(M) applied from inside the country. While Maintenance funds for PBS was quite straight forward (£x in the bank account) the maintenance for FLR(M) is a lot fuzzy and leaves a lot of discretion to the case worker. What does 20 months of maintainability mean? How do the case workers generally assess employability of the main applicant and the spouse?

Can anyone with experience elaborate a bit?

Also, what difference would it make if we went out of the country and applied from outside the UK? Does that affect her continued status in anyway? I know she can't come back into the country on the PBS Dependent visa so we need to do it before she travels back but would going out, in any way, affect her residency requirements (start the clock all over again)?

Much appreciated.

-A.

Any thoughts from experienced people / members on how the 20-month maintenance requirement for FLR(M) actually calculated?

Much appreciated. I have an appointment in a week's time and have to decide if I want to keep it or let it go...

[vinny]

Note that the maintenance requirements are the same, whether applying from inside (284(viii)) or outside (281(v)) the UK .

[Greenie]

Hi There:

I had my visa recently converted to ILR. My wife is still on the PBS Tier 1 visa so needs to move to FLR(M) for a few months before she can apply for ILR. We're both inside the UK right now but plan to travel abroad for a month or so.

I wanted to find out about the Maintenance Requirement for FLR(M) applied from inside the country. While Maintenance funds for PBS was quite straight forward (£x in the bank account) the maintenance for FLR(M) is a lot fuzzy and leaves a lot of discretion to the case worker. What does 20 months of maintainability mean? How do the case workers generally assess employability of the main applicant and the spouse?

Can anyone with experience elaborate a bit?

Also, what difference would it make if we went out of the country and applied from outside the UK? Does that affect her continued status in anyway? I know she can't come back into the country on the PBS Dependent visa so we need to do it before she travels back but would going out, in any way, affect her residency requirements (start the clock all over again)?

Much appreciated.

-A.

Any thoughts from experienced people / members on how the 20-month maintenance requirement for FLR(M) actually calculated?

Much appreciated. I have an appointment in a week's time and have to decide if I want to keep it or let it go...

I would not risk applying from outside the UK.

For maintenance-you need to show that after rent and council tax are deducted from your income, that you have at least the amount that a family of your size your receive on income support.

For a couple with no children this is £105.95 per week or £459 per month.

[selva]

Hi All:

Thanks for this wonderfully helpful forum.

I received my ILR last month (21st Feb). My wife's still on PBS Dependent Visa. I didnt know that she had to be moved to FLR (M) and recently came to know. A lawyer also told me that since my visa has changed and hers has become invalid, she loses the 1.5 years she has already spent in UK towards her qualification period for ILR. Is that true?

How quickly does she need to switch to FLR (M) to not lose status and past period? I've read 28 days somewhere. Is that true? Its only 2-3 days before that 28-day limit will pass. So, I need to do this really quick. Since no PEO appts are available for atleast 2-3 weeks, should I put in a mail application?

Also, my son was born on 29th February AFTER my ILR was received. Does that mean he is automatically a british citizen and I dont need to file the form MN11 (?). Just go to the post-office and apply for a British passport. How long does that take to come in?

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Thanks very much...

A.

Hi AO,
As far as I understood your situation, I think your wife dependent visa may not be valid any more (when you get ILR your previous visa become invalid? right?) you could mail UKBA and ask their help.

I have seen your circumstance as well so best option would be (whether dependent visa valid or invalid) go for PEO and get a cover letter explaining why you could not apply sooner (child birth ....) with all other docs including evidence for child birth. Most probably you would be fine. I have known people who did over stay and got the extension within UK, as far as you give them a very good reason they should considered it and I believe your reason is enough.

you son is automatically British

Good Luck.

[Greenie]

Hi All:

Thanks for this wonderfully helpful forum.

I received my ILR last month (21st Feb). My wife's still on PBS Dependent Visa. I didnt know that she had to be moved to FLR (M) and recently came to know. A lawyer also told me that since my visa has changed and hers has become invalid, she loses the 1.5 years she has already spent in UK towards her qualification period for ILR. Is that true?

How quickly does she need to switch to FLR (M) to not lose status and past period? I've read 28 days somewhere. Is that true? Its only 2-3 days before that 28-day limit will pass. So, I need to do this really quick. Since no PEO appts are available for atleast 2-3 weeks, should I put in a mail application?

Also, my son was born on 29th February AFTER my ILR was received. Does that mean he is automatically a british citizen and I dont need to file the form MN11 (?). Just go to the post-office and apply for a British passport. How long does that take to come in?

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Thanks very much...

A.

Hi AO,
As far as I understood your situation, I think your wife dependent visa may not be valid any more (when you get ILR your previous visa become invalid? right?) you could mail UKBA and ask their help.

I have seen your circumstance as well so best option would be (whether dependent visa valid or invalid) go for PEO and get a cover letter explaining why you could not apply sooner (child birth ....) with all other docs including evidence for child birth. Most probably you would be fine. I have known people who did over stay and got the extension within UK, as far as you give them a very good reason they should considered it and I believe your reason is enough.

you son is automatically British

Good Luck.

your advise about the wife's visa is completely incorrect and this has issued has already been explained to the OP. Please don't make such statements unless you can back them up with references to the law.

[AO]

Hi There:

I had my visa recently converted to ILR. My wife is still on the PBS Tier 1 visa so needs to move to FLR(M) for a few months before she can apply for ILR. We're both inside the UK right now but plan to travel abroad for a month or so.

I wanted to find out about the Maintenance Requirement for FLR(M) applied from inside the country. While Maintenance funds for PBS was quite straight forward (£x in the bank account) the maintenance for FLR(M) is a lot fuzzy and leaves a lot of discretion to the case worker. What does 20 months of maintainability mean? How do the case workers generally assess employability of the main applicant and the spouse?

Can anyone with experience elaborate a bit?

Also, what difference would it make if we went out of the country and applied from outside the UK? Does that affect her continued status in anyway? I know she can't come back into the country on the PBS Dependent visa so we need to do it before she travels back but would going out, in any way, affect her residency requirements (start the clock all over again)?

Much appreciated.

-A.

Any thoughts from experienced people / members on how the 20-month maintenance requirement for FLR(M) actually calculated?

Much appreciated. I have an appointment in a week's time and have to decide if I want to keep it or let it go...

I would not risk applying from outside the UK.

For maintenance-you need to show that after rent and council tax are deducted from your income, that you have at least the amount that a family of your size your receive on income support.

For a couple with no children this is £105.95 per week or £459 per month.

Hi Greene and Others.

I applied for my son's British passport straight away. That went quite well. So, thanks the advice on that.

With regards to my wife's FLR(M)'s maintenance requirements, here is the page I am looking at:

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... intenance/

Usually (in Tier1 and PBS visa) the maintenance requirement was specified (I think £850 for main applicant and £530+ for the dependent.) But in this case it is very open-ended. How do you satisfy that you have 2 years of maintenance funds, except through future earning potential arguments.

I have last year's payslips but I've recently started a new business venture and who knows what 2 years look like. Future maintenance is much harder to justify.

Does this page apply to us? If so how does one satisfy this if there is no specific amount given?

If this doesn't apply to us then what is the maintenance requirement for a FLR(M) visa? Can you point me to relevant document in Home Office rules?

Somebody commented here (I think it was Vinnie) that there is no maintenance requirement for FLRM visa which kind of makes sense because the form doesn't talk anything about maintenance funds....

Please advice. My appointment in a week's time and I need to do the paperwork.

[AO]

Hi All:

Thanks for this wonderfully helpful forum.

I received my ILR last month (21st Feb). My wife's still on PBS Dependent Visa. I didnt know that she had to be moved to FLR (M) and recently came to know. A lawyer also told me that since my visa has changed and hers has become invalid, she loses the 1.5 years she has already spent in UK towards her qualification period for ILR. Is that true?

How quickly does she need to switch to FLR (M) to not lose status and past period? I've read 28 days somewhere. Is that true? Its only 2-3 days before that 28-day limit will pass. So, I need to do this really quick. Since no PEO appts are available for atleast 2-3 weeks, should I put in a mail application?

Also, my son was born on 29th February AFTER my ILR was received. Does that mean he is automatically a british citizen and I dont need to file the form MN11 (?). Just go to the post-office and apply for a British passport. How long does that take to come in?

We were planning to go abroad next month for a month or so, this is going to jeopardize that trip. But maybe I'll be able to save grace if I move quickly...

Thanks very much...

A.

Hi AO,
As far as I understood your situation, I think your wife dependent visa may not be valid any more (when you get ILR your previous visa become invalid? right?) you could mail UKBA and ask their help.

I have seen your circumstance as well so best option would be (whether dependent visa valid or invalid) go for PEO and get a cover letter explaining why you could not apply sooner (child birth ....) with all other docs including evidence for child birth. Most probably you would be fine. I have known people who did over stay and got the extension within UK, as far as you give them a very good reason they should considered it and I believe your reason is enough.

you son is automatically British

Good Luck.

Applied for my son's passport. That went very well. No my wife's FLRM Visa. Still confused about the maintenance funds requirement...

Here is the page I am looking at:

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... intenance/

Usually (in Tier1 and PBS visa) the maintenance requirement was specified (I think £850 for main applicant and £530+ for the dependent.) But in this case it is very open-ended. How do you satisfy that you have 2 years of maintenance funds, except through future earning potential arguments.

I have last year's payslips but I've recently started a new business venture and who knows what 2 years look like. Future maintenance is much harder to justify.

Does this page apply to us? If so how does one satisfy this if there is no specific amount given?

If this doesn't apply to us then what is the maintenance requirement for a FLR(M) visa? Can you point me to relevant document in Home Office rules?

Somebody commented here (I think it was Vinnie) that there is no maintenance requirement for FLRM visa which kind of makes sense because the form doesn't talk anything about maintenance funds....

Please advice. My appointment in a week's time and I need to do the paperwork.

[vinny]

Note that the maintenance requirements are the same, whether applying from inside (284(viii)) or outside (281(v)) the UK.

For maintenance-you need to show that after rent and council tax are deducted from your income, that you have at least the amount that a family of your size your receive on income support.

For a couple with no children this is £105.95 per week or £459 per month.

[AO]

Note that the maintenance requirements are the same, whether applying from inside (284(viii)) or outside (281(v)) the UK.

For maintenance-you need to show that after rent and council tax are deducted from your income, that you have at least the amount that a family of your size your receive on income support.

For a couple with no children this is £105.95 per week or £459 per month.

Vinnie, do I have to show this on present / immediate past income or future income. If future income, and for 24 months, this would mean having to show £12,000 in the account?