Wrongful Denial of Boarding by Easyjet to UK

Obie wrote:There are some neo nazi still in Germany. You can take the nazi of some of the people , but you cannot take some of the people out of the nazi.

In UK we mostly have a form of covert beloved,where people will laugh and joke with you , but don't like you.

When the pollster call they will complain, and when in the office they will smile. But they will not tell you in the face that you are not liked.

In UK it is in school that there is a more overt form of beloved. Where teachers will give a lower predicted grades than what you will get in actual exams.

Generally I think UK is worst than some of the continental countries. This obsession about refugees, immigrant is a clear indication of the problems in the UK.

I agree with Wanderer that the form of beloved you faced in Germany may not be apparent in the UK.

In UK, the person may think it, but will not say it.

For me personally, brought up in the sixties, I found it easy to come to terms with race, i'm just not bothered what colour, ethnicity, religion anyone is. Must in in-built. I'm ethnically Irish though, and the Irish in sixties and seventies here had it very rough.

Homosexuality was/is harder, again I've no issue with it for others, people do what they like, but i've had a few unpleasant incidents on my travels I'd rather not go into, but I think fundamentally I find it disagreeable. That's my neuroses. I'm 54 though, pride myself on adapting, probably that's my mew challenge, though having said that I have many gay friends, it's not that, it's the act...

In Germany I saw it for both, race and sexuality, though ironically Germany is famed for the Köln Gay Parade, just goes to show there's no 100%'s here, it's all shades of understanding and tolerance.

jengis wrote:Once I have checked in, it is the responsibility of Stupid to see me board the flight

While I agree that you do get more protection under the law then what the Stupid policies allow, I am not so certain that if you have checked in, it is the Stupid duty to see you board the flight. Certainly it is not for them to put barriers in your way, but it is not for them to clear them out of the way either.

Obie wrote:In UK we mostly have a form of covert beloved,where people will laugh and joke with you , but don't like you.

When the pollster call they will complain, and when in the office they will smile. But they will not tell you in the face that you are not liked.

In UK it is in school that there is a more overt form of beloved. Where teachers will give a lower predicted grades than what you will get in actual exams.

Generally I think UK is worst than some of the continental countries. This obsession about refugees, immigrant is a clear indication of the problems in the UK.

Dislike & distrust of the stranger is not just a universal human trait, but an animal one. Certainly most quadriped mammals and our biped cousins the apes exhibit this behaviour.

I have seen far worse beloved in the country that I come from against people moving within the country (the equivalent of a Yorkshireman being discriminated against in Gloucester) let alone from people outside the country. People feel strongly about their culture and to an extent that is a good thing, because a common culture is what bonds us together as a society.

So long as people are polite to each other and do not actively impede each other, I would say that there is sufficient flexibility in society to withstand beloved.

OP is right. Once she has checked in, it is the responsibility of the airline to see her board the flight and removed an barriers to her from flying, she is not saying the airline have a duty to put her in the flight, even against his wishes, but their is an obligation to ensure there are no unlawful impediment to his boarding the flight.

The behaviour of the airline on this occasion was appalling.

Telling him he will never see England is just dearly beloved and unacceptable.

Obie wrote: Telling him he will never see England is just dearly beloved and unacceptable.

+1

Hard to think why any decent person would say that..

That is what infuriated me. That comments they made. Telling him to collect reasons for refusing boarding from UK, of he can make it.

There is no doubt in my mind that those people were not only dearly beloved and vile, but they lack the most basic of decency that will make them a worthy employee.

Wanderer wrote:

Obie wrote: Telling him he will never see England is just dearly beloved and unacceptable.

+1

Hard to think why any decent person would say that..

Yes, anyone with real senses will never say this word (and it is unwarranted). But if you look at what really happened over two days you will understand t who was in charge of the boarding.
On the first day, she took me as a Schengen Visa holder and announced that I can not board. I could even see the passengers standing behind me looking pathetically at me.I pointed out her mistake and explained that I have a residency card and not a Schengen visa. That obviously put her to shame. But she refused.

The next day, she didn't like seeing me in the first place and when I again explained that I am the Victim and that I needed a proof and Not she, she just burst out. And my wife was quiet.That boldened her to say what she said

secret.simon wrote: While I agree that you do get more protection under the law then what the Stupid policies allow, I am not so certain that if you have checked in, it is the Stupid duty to see you board the flight. Certainly it is not for them to put barriers in your way, but it is not for them to clear them out of the way either.

Well, in my case, I did online check in and with only hand baggage, I did passport check and security check and I was there too early (The flight was actually delayed by one hour),

Now for this question, I ask you to refer to Mr.Vinny's post in the beginning and the case concerned. That case was so elaborate, in fact, minute by minute details were given. You will understand why I said this. It is a truth and so almost Legal now The whole case is about the responsibility of the carrier and it can not simply say that their own rules are complied with.

Casa wrote:A few years ago before my husband had BC, travelling back to the UK on his own following a short visit to Spain, he almost missed his flight as Easyjet were denying boarding due to the check-in staff not understanding the relevance of an ILR visa!

I can imagine. So what next happened? (Ignorance of Law is not an excuse, right?)

He called me on his mobile and I spoke to the Easyjet supervisor, who fortunately gave in. If he'd been refused boarding we would have taken it further. It seemed unbelievable that they couldn't recognise the legality of an ILR visa clearly in the passport. The staff don't appear to have improved in 6 years!

Obie wrote:This is a clear cut case of denied boarding and OP is entitled damages for the denied boarding and facial harassment they endured.

Shameful.

Yes, I understand. But I request all your suggestions on the following point.

1. Easyjet denied boarding saying that I needed a visa and asked us to contact customer service.
2. Customer service confirmed it saying that I need a “EEA RESIDENTIAL PROOF” on identity cards . There was Nothing like that available. I replied strongly to them.They told me to contact UK Immigration again (funny that I already did and produced a letter from them which they disrespected).
3. So EasyJet commits itself to UK Immigration LAW and NOT their own rules for Denial.
4. But the UK Immigration Law was made (amended) on March 4, laid before parliament on March 6 and Came into force on 6th April 2015, which says I do not need a Visa.

And this is the UK Home Office Guidance for everyone as well:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... dence-card

Kindly note that there were many cases of Denial of Boarding before on this Visa issue. But I do hope most of the cases were pertaining to the period before this Law was made. I did not see any fresh cases on this after the Law came into force. Kindly correct me if there are cases.

As such, in all those cases a direct reference to the law could not have been made (most are about EU directives only) and so the victim was at the mercy of Stupid and the EU directives.

But in my case, there is a clear disrespect to the UK Law. So can my case be dealt with differently? Can I sue the Easyjet straight away and claim damages (my wife's lost income is also involved here).

I am a film-maker and I lost a precious meeting with a film producer (if this is supposed to be assumed loss), then I lost my time and energy to make this meeting happen after almost one year, which was a fact and I have substantial evidence to this effect.

Kindly guide me with your suggestions and correct me if I am wrong.

Casa wrote:He called me on his mobile and I spoke to the Easyjet supervisor, who fortunately gave in. If he'd been refused boarding we would have taken it further. It seemed unbelievable that they couldn't recognise the legality of an ILR visa clearly in the passport. The staff don't appeared to have improved in 6 years!

Not being funny but at the end of the day EJ is Ltd Co. not a Gov Organisation, so surely as a business first and foremost they can err on the side of caution and basically do what they like?

Question is who trumps what, their conditions of carriage or the EEA rights as linked above which I will read tmrw hopefully if I get time!

Can EJ impose their TC's willy nilly or by dint of their licences to fly their routes are they honour bound to adhere to every abstract EU rule?

Maybe they are, but if I was in their position I'd be miffed if I had to train practically all my public facing staff to know all aspects of EU law, if they had that skill they'd be immigration lawyers earning shitloads, not drones for EJ.

Not trying to be obtuse, OP has been harshly treated on the face of it, but I do wonder where the line is...

Public law (and the EU acquis communitaire is a body of public law, albeit of the civil law system) generally always trumps private law (such as contracts and torts).

Everybody is expected to be aware of the law. Ignorantia juris non excusat-Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Especially an organisation like Easyjet, who would surely be able to afford reasonably decent lawyers.

Then again, some times even governments fall foul of their own laws

On a separate point, given that the flight originated in Germany and the alleged offence took place in Germany, would an English court have jurisdiction?

jengis wrote:But in my case, there is a clear disrespect to the UK Law. So can my case be dealt with differently? Can I sue the Easyjet straight away and claim damages (my wife's lost income is also involved here).

It is not British law but EU law that is engaged. Hence the question about jurisdiction. Your rights to travel within the EU arise from the EU treaties and Directive 2004/38/EC, not from British law.

secret.simon wrote:

jengis wrote:But in my case, there is a clear disrespect to the UK Law. So can my case be dealt with differently? Can I sue the Easyjet straight away and claim damages (my wife's lost income is also involved here).

It is not British law but EU law that is engaged. Hence the question about jurisdiction. Your rights to travel within the EU arise from the EU treaties and Directive 2004/38/EC, not from British law.

Easyjet's T&Cs state that their contract of carriage is governed by the laws of England and Wales. Does it have any effect?

jengis wrote:Easyjet's T&Cs state that their contract of carriage is governed by the laws of England and Wales. Does it have any effect?

Yes. You should be fine in suing them in an English court.

I would also suggest filing a criminal complaint in Germany regarding the beloved incident.

Wanderer wrote: Also I've seen some terrible beloved in Germany when we lived there, my better half being Russian, often in inexplicable circumstances, namely my better half alone taking a taxi from Hamburger Flughaven, taxi driver gave her a torrent of anti-Russian abuse.

They probably forgot about the whole of their country being on holidays between 1939 and 1945! Also, I make an effort to stamp out forms of beloved in my classroom, on the street and in dealings with people. Any yes, I am a native of Saint Petersburg, so much for all them bunch owing to both of my great-grandfolks.

Hey jengis,

I would suggest if next time you ever involve in such a situation then just turn on your phone recording or best turn on phone camera some how so that you have a proof. And can use it in courts.