Please please help me to come in a decision

[meet2mustafiz]

I am in very difficultly position.My appeal's hearing held on June 2014. 5 month before the hearing date on last January 2014, I changed my solicitor and present solicitor immediately informed Home Office and tribunal about the changes.I changed my address aswel during this time,my solicitor said he will inform Tribunal and Ho about the changes.On my hearing day my present solicitor mention that he is my present solicitor and my present address.Tribunal dismissed my appeal on first week of July 2014 and unfortunately they sent decision letter to my previous solicitor's address .I did not knew the decision until I phoned Tribunal on 2nd week of August 2014 about the outcome.They also said they still have my old address and previous solicitor's name in their system.I immediately phoned my solicitor about the issue.My solicitor then phoned tribunal and Tribunal said they will reissue our decision’s letter and send it to right address.they also said to my solicitor that they have a backlog in their system, so they will take time to send it.So,we are waiting for the decision letter for last 3 month.

Yesterday I Called Home office they still have my old address in their system.Then I called Tribunal,they said they can't see any record that my solicitor contract with them .Though he is in this sector for 20 years.Now I am in a very difficult situation to trust him -is he really informed Home Office and tribunal that he is my representing me ? can I trust him ?

Is it possible for a solicitor to represent me in the hearing who never introduce himself as my solicitor to Home Office and Tribunal ?

Please please help me to come in a decision

[peppekalle]

What decision do you want to come to?Your solicitor informed the tribunal during the hearing he is representing you.

[Obie]

The solicitor should have got you to sign a letter of authority and send that to UKBA.

[meet2mustafiz]

is he really informed Home Office and tribunal that he is my representing me ? can I trust him ?

Is it possible for a solicitor to represent me in the hearing who never introduce himself as my solicitor to Home Office and Tribunal ?

He took authorization from me to sent HO and Tribunal but how come I sure that he sent this authorization letter ?

if he really sent this letter the how come both HO and Tribunal don't update ?

[meet2mustafiz]

What decision do you want to come to?Your solicitor informed the tribunal during the hearing he is representing you.

is he really informed Home Office and tribunal that he is my representing me ? can I trust him ?

Is it possible for a solicitor to represent me in the hearing who never introduce himself as my solicitor to Home Office and Tribunal ?

He took authorization from me to sent HO and Tribunal but how come I sure that he sent this authorization letter ?

if he really sent this letter the how come both HO and Tribunal don't update ?

[peppekalle]

If you are not sure he sent the letter ask him .I have previously changed my address with the border agency and they still got it wrong until after a few reminders.

[meet2mustafiz]

My visa was refused and appealed in First Tier Tribunal.After lodge this appeal I changed my solicitor.My present solicitor did not lodge the original notices of appeal,He filed the Appellants’ witness statements and bundle of documents and represented them at the hearing and he is still representing me.But Tribunal sent refusal decision letter to my previous solicitor.by sending decision to my previous solicitor ,Do you think Tribunal followed the right procedure ??

My solicitor wrote to them by email to resend the decision letter.He say because Tribunal sent decision letter to a wrong address so this decision letter is invalid ,its been 2 month and we are still waiting for this letter, we want to appeal to upper tribunal. do you think it could break of my long residency ?

many thanks

[meet2mustafiz]

My visa was refused and I appealed in First Tier Tribunal.After lodge this appeal I changed my solicitor.My present solicitor did not lodge the original notices of appeal,He filed the Appellants’ witness statements and bundle of documents and represented them at the hearing and he is still representing me.But Tribunal sent Decision letter to my previous solicitor(I phoned Tribunal and they said my appeal was dismissed).By sending decision to my previous solicitor ,Do you think Tribunal followed the right procedure ??

My solicitor wrote to them by email to resend the decision letter.He say because Tribunal sent decision letter to a wrong address so this decision letter is invalid ,its been 2 month and we are still waiting for this letter, we want to appeal to upper tribunal. do you think it could break of my long residency ?

many thanks

[vinny]

Do you think Tribunal followed the right procedure ??

Search the Rules and legislation.

[vinny]

See also IA/49819/2013.

[meet2mustafiz]

Thank you very very much for relevant case history,if know more case on similar issue pls share.

thanks againg

[meet2mustafiz]

See also IA/49819/2013.

Thank you very very much for relevant case history,if know more case on similar issue pls share.

thanks againg

[Obie]

It is a simple issue that can get sorted in few days.

The Solicitor write to the tribunal informing them that the decision has not been served.

A copy is send and an appeal is lodged.

An application is made to file an appeal out of time, stating that it was not served or properly served.

As simple as that.

This is not the forum's job or the moderators job, it is the job of your representatives to sort .

It is, in my view, one of the basic task of a competent representative.

[meet2mustafiz]

It is a simple issue that can get sorted in few days.

The Solicitor write to the tribunal informing them that the decision has not been served.

A copy is send and an appeal is lodged.

An application is made to file an appeal out of time, stating that it was not served or properly served.

As simple as that.

This is not the forum's job or the moderators job, it is the job of your representatives to sort .

It is, in my view, one of the basic task of a competent representative.

Thanks for your information.I sincerely appreciate your help .

Its supposed to be simple procedure but its not simple anymore,problem is..

In Tribunal's system(also Home Office's system) showing my previous solicitor was representing me that's why they sent decision letter to my previous solicitor and Tribunal still have same information.My present solicitor contracted with Tribunal 4-5 times(email) in last 3 month but they are not responding ,

My worries is..
When I started taking service from my present solicitor on last Feb 2014,He supposed to inform Home Office and Tribunal that he is representing me.If my present solicitor mistakenly did not inform Tribunal about his representation -does Tribunal followed right procedure by sending decision letter to my previous solicitor ? though he filed the Appellants’ witness statements and bundle of documents and represented them at the hearing.

I need to be legally in UK for another 7 month then I can apply for ILR.Does my solicitor intentionally trying to killing some times ? trying to make me eligible to apply ILR ? may be he is not sharing with me because of legal reason !

This forum is very very important for people like me who need someone to share their ideas and take advice and information.I am in middle of nowhere.I can't fully trust my solicitor because of this situation.Moreover I can't choose any other solicitor because He is the one who have all those information to keep my 3C active.

[Obie]

I don't think your solicitor is trying to buy time, if that is what he is doing, he is going about it the wrong way.

There is no section 3C rights, because the tribunal is of the view that the decision has been properly served.

Section 3C can only be reinstated again, if it can be established that the decision was wrongly served.

If it was not then you no longer have a section 3C, unless an extension of time is granted.

[meet2mustafiz]

I don't think your solicitor is trying to buy time, if that is what he is doing, he is going about it the wrong way.

There is no section 3C rights, because the tribunal is of the view that the decision has been properly served.

Section 3C can only be reinstated again, if it can be established that the decision was wrongly served.

If it was not then you no longer have a section 3C, unless an extension of time is granted.

You gave me many important information.You must understand my mental condition.I won't asked anymore,Just tell me one final information please

If I guess... my present solicitor mistakenly did not inform Tribunal about his representation but he filed the Appellants’ witness statements and bundle of documents and represented them at the hearing. If he able to proved that he filed the Appellants’ witness statements and bundle of documents and he represent me at hearing then do you think my 3C reinstated again ?

thanks for you valuable information

[Obie]

Section 3C will be reinstated if a late notice is accepted and extension of time is granted. Otherwise it will not.

You need to speak to and discuss with your solicitor about this.

These are technical and highly complex matter that one cannot explain to you on the forum

[meet2mustafiz]

Section 3C will be reinstated if a late notice is accepted and extension of time is granted. Otherwise it will not.

You need to speak to and discuss with your solicitor about this.

These are technical and highly complex matter that one cannot explain to you on the forum

thanks for your time and advice

[meet2mustafiz]

Section 3C will be reinstated if a late notice is accepted and extension of time is granted. Otherwise it will not.

You need to speak to and discuss with your solicitor about this.

These are technical and highly complex matter that one cannot explain to you on the forum

thanks for your time and advice

[meet2mustafiz]

Section 3C will be reinstated if a late notice is accepted and extension of time is granted. Otherwise it will not.

You need to speak to and discuss with your solicitor about this.

These are technical and highly complex matter that one cannot explain to you on the forum

Please check what I got today on The Asylum and Immigration Tribunal's rules and legislation (https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... -rules.pdf)....

its about Appellant's Representative ''If a party appoints a representative, that party (or the representative if the representative is a
qualified representative) must send or deliver to the Tribunal written notice of the representative’s name and address, which may be done at a hearing''

thanks for your attention

[vinny]

The current rules were in force since 20 October 2014. However, it appears similar to 11.

[Obie]

Vinny, i think it was Rule 48 of the 2005 of the Asylum and Immigration procedural rule 2005 that was repealled by the 2014 Rule, which you correctly cited.

The 2009 Procedural rule you mentioned is still in operation, save for minor amendments. It applies to the Regulatory Chamber, and not the Immigration Tribunal.

Rule 48 is in similar term to the now rule 10, Save for the fact that with the current rule a person can notify the tribunal at the hearing or in letter.

I believe that the OP's solicitor or representative did not comply with their duties with rule 48 that was then in force.

[meet2mustafiz]

Vinny, i think it was Rule 48 of the 2005 of the Asylum and Immigration procedural rule 2005 that was repealled by the 2014 Rule, which you correctly cited.

The 2009 Procedural rule you mentioned is still in operation, save for minor amendments. It applies to the Regulatory Chamber, and not the Immigration Tribunal.

Rule 48 is in similar term to the now rule 10, Save for the fact that with the current rule a person can notify the tribunal at the hearing or in letter.

I believe that the OP's solicitor or representative did not comply with their duties with rule 48 that was then in force.

Yes The Asylum and Immigration Tribunal (Procedure) Rules 2005 say a person can notify the tribunal at the hearing or in letter and I can clearly remember that my solicitor clearly mention that he is my legal representative on hearing.On hearing Judge mention my solicitor's name as my legal representative.My solicitor also brief about my previous solicitor's unprofessional service what I received.I don't understand why Obie is saying that my representative did not comply with their duties with rule 48 that was then in force! please explain

[Obie]

10.
—(1) A party may be represented by any person not prohibited from representing by section84 of the 1999 Act.

(2)Where a party is or has been represented by a person prohibited from representing by section84 of the 1999 Act, that does not of itself render void the proceedings or any step taken in the proceedings.

(3)If a party appoints a representative, that party (or the representative if the representative is a qualified representative) must send or deliver to the Tribunal written notice of the representative’s name and address, which may be done at a hearing.

(4)Anything permitted or required to be done by a party under these Rules, a practice direction or
a direction may be done by the representative of that party, except signing a witness statement.

(5)A person who receives notice of the appointment of a representative—

(a)must provide to the representative any document which is required to be provided to the
represented party, and need not provide that document to the represented party; and

(b)may assume that the representative is and remains authorised as such until they receive
written notification that this is not so from the representative or the represented party.




(6)As from the date on which a person has notified the Tribunal that they are acting as the
representative of an appellant and has given an address for service, if any document is provided to
the appellant a copy must also at the same time be provided to the appellant’s representative.

(1) An appellant or applicant for bail may act in person or be represented by any person not prohibited from representing him by
section 84 of the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999.

(2) A respondent to an appeal, the Secretary of State or the United Kingdom Representative may be represented by any person authorised to act on his behalf.

(3) If a party to whom paragraph (1) applies is represented by a person not permitted by that paragraph to represent him, any
determination given or other step taken by the Tribunal in the proceedings shall nevertheless be valid.

(4) Where a representative begins to act for a party, he must immediately notify the Tribunal and the other party of that fact.

[(4A) Where a notice of appeal, or an application for bail under rule 38, is signed by a representative, the representative will be deemed to have notified the Tribunal and the other party that he is acting for a party in accordance with paragraph (4).

(4B) Where a notice of appeal, or an application for bail under rule 38, is not signed by a representative, the
representative must file a separate notice with the Tribunal and serve it on the other party to comply with his
obligations under paragraph (4).]

(5) Where a representative is acting for a party, he may on behalf of that party do anything that these Rules require or permit that party to do.

(6) Where a representative is acting for an appellant, the appellant is under a duty—

(a) to maintain contact with his representative until the appeal is
finally determined; and
(b) to notify the representative of any change of address.

(7) Where a representative ceases to act for a party, the
representative and the party must immediately notify the Tribunal and
the other party [in writing] of that fact, and of the name and address of any new representative (if known).

(8) Notification under paragraph (4) . . .—

(a) [where a representative is appointed to act for a party on the day of a hearing,] may be given orally at [that] hearing to the Tribunal and to any other party present at that hearing; but

(b) must otherwise be given in writing.

(9) Until the Tribunal is notified that a representative has ceased to act for a party, any document served on
that representative shall be deemed to be properly served on the party he was representing.

Suffice to say that rule 48(7) of the rules in place at the time of your appeal was not complied with.

The Tribunal are clearly in the right here.

[meet2mustafiz]

10.
—(1) A party may be represented by any person not prohibited from representing by section84 of the 1999 Act.

(2)Where a party is or has been represented by a person prohibited from representing by section84 of the 1999 Act, that does not of itself render void the proceedings or any step taken in the proceedings.

(3)If a party appoints a representative, that party (or the representative if the representative is a qualified representative) must send or deliver to the Tribunal written notice of the representative’s name and address, which may be done at a hearing.

(4)Anything permitted or required to be done by a party under these Rules, a practice direction or
a direction may be done by the representative of that party, except signing a witness statement.

(5)A person who receives notice of the appointment of a representative—

(a)must provide to the representative any document which is required to be provided to the
represented party, and need not provide that document to the represented party; and

(b)may assume that the representative is and remains authorised as such until they receive
written notification that this is not so from the representative or the represented party.




(6)As from the date on which a person has notified the Tribunal that they are acting as the
representative of an appellant and has given an address for service, if any document is provided to
the appellant a copy must also at the same time be provided to the appellant’s representative.

(1) An appellant or applicant for bail may act in person or be represented by any person not prohibited from representing him by
section 84 of the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999.

(2) A respondent to an appeal, the Secretary of State or the United Kingdom Representative may be represented by any person authorised to act on his behalf.

(3) If a party to whom paragraph (1) applies is represented by a person not permitted by that paragraph to represent him, any
determination given or other step taken by the Tribunal in the proceedings shall nevertheless be valid.

(4) Where a representative begins to act for a party, he must immediately notify the Tribunal and the other party of that fact.

[(4A) Where a notice of appeal, or an application for bail under rule 38, is signed by a representative, the representative will be deemed to have notified the Tribunal and the other party that he is acting for a party in accordance with paragraph (4).

(4B) Where a notice of appeal, or an application for bail under rule 38, is not signed by a representative, the
representative must file a separate notice with the Tribunal and serve it on the other party to comply with his
obligations under paragraph (4).]

(5) Where a representative is acting for a party, he may on behalf of that party do anything that these Rules require or permit that party to do.

(6) Where a representative is acting for an appellant, the appellant is under a duty—

(a) to maintain contact with his representative until the appeal is
finally determined; and
(b) to notify the representative of any change of address.

(7) Where a representative ceases to act for a party, the
representative and the party must immediately notify the Tribunal and
the other party [in writing] of that fact, and of the name and address of any new representative (if known).

(8) Notification under paragraph (4) . . .—

(a) [where a representative is appointed to act for a party on the day of a hearing,] may be given orally at [that] hearing to the Tribunal and to any other party present at that hearing; but

(b) must otherwise be given in writing.

(9) Until the Tribunal is notified that a representative has ceased to act for a party, any document served on
that representative shall be deemed to be properly served on the party he was representing.

Suffice to say that rule 48(7) of the rules in place at the time of your appeal was not complied with.

The Tribunal are clearly in the right here.

Dear Obie
I don't know why you are keep telling that Tribunal are right.My solicitor have evidence that he inform Tribunal on time that he is my legal representative.
However, I contract with Tribunal through email,explain everything and their final reply is-they are going to re-send the determination letter to my address and my solicitor's address.

When I will get the determination letter then how many days I have to apply permition for appeal ? 5 days or according to new regulation 14 days? thanks