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I've created this thread so I can answer any questions people may have who are considering using Surinder Singh to bring their families over to the UK but are worried about the new 'center of life' rules. This forum contained most of the information that helped with my success.

I'm a British citizen and even though my salary was enough for me to apply for a Settlement visa for my Pakistani wife ,I know there was up to 6 month wait for the visa as there was a backlog on settlement cases and I had read a lot of stories that people were being refused for minor mistakes.
I decided that it would be quicker and more interesting to use the Surinder Singh method to get to the UK. I thought of the 3 months in another EU country as a Honeymoon / Holiday.

Since I don't consider myself a great story teller, I’ll just list the steps I took.

1. I chose to apply for an Ireland Directive 2004/38/EC Visa due to Ireland’s proximity and shared language/culture to the UK (link to visa cover letter). I applied for an accompany EU spouse visa in late December 2013 and was granted the Visa in mid-January 2014. I flew to Ireland with my wife on the 27th of January 2014. At the airport my wife was given a 90 days stamp on her passport and explained if we wished to stay longer we need to apply for a EU1 card.

2. On arrival in Dublin I stayed in a hotel while I tried to find some rented accommodation. It took around a week to find a place. Daft.ie is a good place to start. I had some difficulties as people were reluctant to rent out to someone without a previous landlords reference. The rent in Dublin was around 500 euro for a 1 bedroom flat so I looked further out and found a house to rent in Co Laois for 600 a month. I signed a 6 month tenancy agreement, the landlord was in the process of selling his property so I was lucky it sold in 4 months and I was able to save on 2 months rent.

3. I moved into the rented house on the 3rd of February 2014. The landlord switched over the Gas and Electric bills to my wife’s and my name. I also asked my landlord to register me and my wife as tenants with the PRTB on the property.

4. We applied for a PPS number at the local Social Welfare Branch Office. Our joint tenancy agreement and passports were sufficient. It took some convincing and standing our ground for them to agree to issue my wife a PPS number, due to her being non EEA. They made a few phone calls and finally agreed to accept her application. Our PPS numbers arrived through the post a few days later.

5. We signed up for Sky TV, landline and broadband on the 8th of February. They don’t do a credit check, just need to pay 50 Euro on any Credit/Debit Card (I used my UK card).

7. Applied for a joint AIB bank account on the 12th of February. Used PPS no, passports and tenancy agreement as ID.

8. I decided to go self-employed, offering various computer services so I applied for a business bank account. Once that was open, I registered for Income Tax with the Revenue and created a website.

9. I registered a business name with the CRO, in the name of my computer services related business website.

10. I registered me and my wife with the local doctor, I requested a letter from the doctor confirming my registration.

11. I exchanged my UK driving license for an Irish license. It’s very easy to do and I assume it helps with proving that you transferred your center of life.

12. I paid for my business expenses with by business debit card and tried to use my personal account as much as possible instead of paying cash for bills and shopping. I also registered with the local library.

13.. Once I received my PRTB registration letter and I had 2 months of invoices, I applied for a EU1 Ireland residence card for my wife in April. I sent our passports, PPS letters, bank statements, work invoices, tax, PTRB, and business registration documents. I received all the documents back in around a week (before the 90 days were up on her passport stamp) and a letter to take to the Guarda (police) for a temp Stamp 4.

14. The Guarda give us an appointment in a few weeks (for the end of April). They issued my wife a 6 month Temporary stamp 4 which extended our permission to stay in Ireland for 6 months whist the EU1 was being decided.

15. I obtained a reentry visa from the INIS in Dublin (free of charge) in case I had difficulty in entering the UK so we could reenter Ireland as opposed to her being sent back to Pakistan from the UK.

16. On the 7th of May we drove to Belfast Airport (UK). I took with me all the documents that I had sent for the EU1 and a print outs of Directive 2004/38/EC , the immigration act with relevant parts highlighted and a FOI request and email confirming that a Family Permit is not required when travelling from Ireland as it is part of the Common Travel Area.

15. On Arrival at Manchester airport, I couldn't find anyone to request a 1A stamp so we headed home in England.

16. I tried to open a bank account for my wife but I had difficulty proving her status here so I applied for an EEA2 card on the 8th of June. I included exactly the same documents I had sent for the EU1 card in Ireland including the doctor’s letter and a copy of my Ireland driving license and library card. I did not include a cover letter though I did include a special delivery SAE.

18. I received a COA with the right to work on the 19th of June which helped me register her with the NHS, open a bank account and obtain a NI number.

19. I had redirected our mail from Ireland to the UK and had not got a reply on our EU1 Application yet so I thought I’d forget about hearing back from the Home Office regarding the UK Residence card until the 6 months were up.

20. I thought I had a slim chance as I has only lived in Ireland for 3 months and a week and with the Center of Life changes to regulation 9 but I was pleasantly surprised when I received my documents back including my wife’s residency card sticker on her passport on the 30th of July.

I have to thank God, the forum members and mods. I wouldn't have had a clue about what I was doing if I didn’t spend time reading the questions from member and replies from the mods. If anyone has any questions I’ll do my best to answer.

Thanks for the write up st2447, hope it gives others the strength to go onwards to victory.

hi, i have submit a spouse application under uk law and that been refused 3 months ago, me n my wife planning to do same what you did instead waiting up to 9 months for appeal , thank you indeed st2447 for given us a hope

I am so happy for you and that your now in the UK. Ive been in Ireland since 11Feb 2014 ive worked on and off for a total of 7weeks, my wifes got temp stay here till her Resident Card is issued. Do u think i could do what u did?

Can i ask you these few questions please ull be helping me a great deal:

1. Did you have any trouble boarding the plane?
2. Did you face any immigration officers in belfast or in Manchester?
3. Would it be difficult to face immigration officers if they do stop me?

I would be really grateful for you reply.

Thanks

May i ask which airline did you use?

Thanks, I was self employed for at least 2 months continuously, i'm not sure if intermittent employment would count. You don't need a Ireland residence card as the home office reassess if you have exercised treaty rights.

1. I had no problems getting on the plane in Belfast to Manchester as you only need a passport for ID, you could also use a driving license if the airline allows, as its an internal flight. I flew on easyjet.

2. There aren't usually any immigration officers on internal flights, however I have seem them occasionally. There is no routine immigration controls between the Republic of Ireland and Northern Ireland.

3. I was hoping to run into immigration control in Manchester to obtain a 1A stamp. I had all my documents with me, the same I submitted for my EEA2 so i was confident. If you can't prove that you should be admitted under regulation 9 then you may have problems. The worst they can probably do to you is put you on a flight back to Ireland, so it would be safer if you had a Ireland reentry visa.

Thanks so much for ur reply.

The reason im slighlty confident is that according to the new case c456-12 you only need to be resident for 3months. So my hope is to not bump into any officers, then once in te UK apply for my wifes resident card for uk. Then if they refuse me i will appeal and use c456-12

I think im gonna give it a go because its getting really tough here

Thats really fast.

You were lucky to get 90 days stamp for your wife, Am a British national and recently arrived with my non EEA husband but he was only given 30 days stamp in his passport

Very unfair for them to do that to us...
Means I ve to do loads of running around within one month

Thank you for sharing this.

maaberglady45 wrote:Thats really fast.

You were lucky to get 90 days stamp for your wife, Am a British national and recently arrived with my non EEA husband but he was only given 30 days stamp in his passport

Very unfair for them to do that to us...
Means I ve to do loads of running around within one month

Yes that's very unfortunate, I think you should apply for the EU1 with whatever documents you manage to obtain by then, they usually send you a letter asking for more documents but at least your application is with them.

Thanks for reply st2447

Can you kindly talk me through ur self employment route, I intend to do same as looking for a job now could take longer than the weeks we have been given.

How much did u ve in the business account and how did u operate it.

Will really appreciate ur help on this

Thanks

I have a background in Search Engine Optomisation so I created a website promoting my services and used google adwords to promote my site to mainly Irish customers. I'd seen a refusal for someone who traded mainly with UK customers from Ireland.

In total I would have had a around 4000 Euro through my business bank account and would transfer what I needed to my personal account.
I was processing around 3 orders a week. I included all the invoices in the EEA2 application.

st2447 wrote:I've created this thread so I can answer any questions people may have who are considering using Surinder Singh to bring their families over to the UK but are worried about the new 'center of life' rules. This forum contained most of the information that helped with my success.

I'm a British citizen and even though my salary was enough for me to apply for a Settlement visa for my Pakistani wife ,I know there was up to 6 month wait for the visa as there was a backlog on settlement cases and I had read a lot of stories that people were being refused for minor mistakes.
I decided that it would be quicker and more interesting to use the Surinder Singh method to get to the UK. I thought of the 3 months in another EU country as a Honeymoon / Holiday.

Since I don't consider myself a great story teller, I’ll just list the steps I took.

1. I chose to apply for an Ireland Directive 2004/38/EC Visa due to Ireland’s proximity and shared language/culture to the UK (link to visa cover letter). I applied for an accompany EU spouse visa in late December 2013 and was granted the Visa in mid-January 2014. I flew to Ireland with my wife on the 27th of January 2014. At the airport my wife was given a 90 days stamp on her passport and explained if we wished to stay longer we need to apply for a EU1 card.

2. On arrival in Dublin I stayed in a hotel while I tried to find some rented accommodation. It took around a week to find a place. Daft.ie is a good place to start. I had some difficulties as people were reluctant to rent out to someone without a previous landlords reference. The rent in Dublin was around 500 euro for a 1 bedroom flat so I looked further out and found a house to rent in Co Laois for 600 a month. I signed a 6 month tenancy agreement, the landlord was in the process of selling his property so I was lucky it sold in 4 months and I was able to save on 2 months rent.

3. I moved into the rented house on the 3rd of February 2014. The landlord switched over the Gas and Electric bills to my wife’s and my name. I also asked my landlord to register me and my wife as tenants with the PRTB on the property.

4. We applied for a PPS number at the local Social Welfare Branch Office. Our joint tenancy agreement and passports were sufficient. It took some convincing and standing our ground for them to agree to issue my wife a PPS number, due to her being non EEA. They made a few phone calls and finally agreed to accept her application. Our PPS numbers arrived through the post a few days later.

5. We signed up for Sky TV, landline and broadband on the 8th of February. They don’t do a credit check, just need to pay 50 Euro on any Credit/Debit Card (I used my UK card).

7. Applied for a joint AIB bank account on the 12th of February. Used PPS no, passports and tenancy agreement as ID.

8. I decided to go self-employed, offering various computer services so I applied for a business bank account. Once that was open, I registered for Income Tax with the Revenue and created a website.

9. I registered a business name with the CRO, in the name of my computer services related business website.

10. I registered me and my wife with the local doctor, I requested a letter from the doctor confirming my registration.

11. I exchanged my UK driving license for an Irish license. It’s very easy to do and I assume it helps with proving that you transferred your center of life.

12. I paid for my business expenses with by business debit card and tried to use my personal account as much as possible instead of paying cash for bills and shopping. I also registered with the local library.

13.. Once I received my PRTB registration letter and I had 2 months of invoices, I applied for a EU1 Ireland residence card for my wife in April. I sent our passports, PPS letters, bank statements, work invoices, tax, PTRB, and business registration documents. I received all the documents back in around a week (before the 90 days were up on her passport stamp) and a letter to take to the Guarda (police) for a temp Stamp 4.

14. The Guarda give us an appointment in a few weeks (for the end of April). They issued my wife a 6 month Temporary stamp 4 which extended our permission to stay in Ireland for 6 months whist the EU1 was being decided.

15. I obtained a reentry visa from the INIS in Dublin (free of charge) in case I had difficulty in entering the UK so we could reenter Ireland as opposed to her being sent back to Pakistan from the UK.

16. On the 7th of May we drove to Belfast Airport (UK). I took with me all the documents that I had sent for the EU1 and a print outs of Directive 2004/38/EC , the immigration act with relevant parts highlighted and a FOI request and email confirming that a Family Permit is not required when travelling from Ireland as it is part of the Common Travel Area.

15. On Arrival at Manchester airport, I couldn't find anyone to request a 1A stamp so we headed home in England.

16. I tried to open a bank account for my wife but I had difficulty proving her status here so I applied for an EEA2 card on the 8th of June. I included exactly the same documents I had sent for the EU1 card in Ireland including the doctor’s letter and a copy of my Ireland driving license and library card. I did not include a cover letter though I did include a special delivery SAE.

18. I received a COA with the right to work on the 19th of June which helped me register her with the NHS, open a bank account and obtain a NI number.

19. I had redirected our mail from Ireland to the UK and had not got a reply on our EU1 Application yet so I thought I’d forget about hearing back from the Home Office regarding the UK Residence card until the 6 months were up.

20. I thought I had a slim chance as I has only lived in Ireland for 3 months and a week and with the Center of Life changes to regulation 9 but I was pleasantly surprised when I received my documents back including my wife’s residency card sticker on her passport on the 30th of July.

I have to thank God, the forum members and mods. I wouldn't have had a clue about what I was doing if I didn’t spend time reading the questions from member and replies from the mods. If anyone has any questions I’ll do my best to answer.

Hi
If my wife is in India, do I have to go to India and fly with her to Ireland?
Or can I first go to Ireland myself, and then call her over?
if so, which letter do I use?

thanks

The letter I used was for accompany spouse, i guess for join spouse there is not much to change except to explain that your EEA spouse is in Ireland and include proof of him/her exercising treaty rights there. You don't need proof of exercising treaty rights if your spouse has been in Ireland for less than 3 months.

Is surender singh route applicable for parents?

akash08 wrote:Is surender singh route applicable for parents?

Yes .."a financially dependent parent of a British citizen can qualify
under Surinder Singh/regulation 9, provided the British citizen was
engaged in genuine and effective employment or self-employment in another
EEA state before returning to the UK. "

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/ ... or_parents

Hi.

Congrats and thanks for your post, its basically my step to step guide! .
I have a few questions looking at the first step.

I chose to apply for an Ireland Directive 2004/38/EC Visa due to Ireland’s proximity and shared language/culture to the UK (link to visa cover letter).

1) When applying for the visa which marriage document did you submit? Did you submit the Nadra certificate or the English version of the nikah papers?

2) Also where did you apply for the visa as I thought there isn't an Irish embassy in Pakistan?

3) On the cover letter you have included the visa reference number, whats that?

Thanks!

IM91 wrote:Hi.

Congrats and thanks for your post, its basically my step to step guide! .
I have a few questions looking at the first step.

I chose to apply for an Ireland Directive 2004/38/EC Visa due to Ireland’s proximity and shared language/culture to the UK (link to visa cover letter).

1) When applying for the visa which marriage document did you submit? Did you submit the Nadra certificate or the English version of the nikah papers?

2) Also where did you apply for the visa as I thought there isn't an Irish embassy in Pakistan?

3) On the cover letter you have included the visa reference number, whats that?

Thanks!

Hi, Thanks

1. I submited both, remember to get your marriage certificate attested from one of these offices.
http://www.mofa.gov.pk/content.php?pageID=consaffairs.


2/3. I applied online at https://www.visas.inis.gov.ie/avats/OnlineHome.aspx

The visa reference number is given when you apply. At the end of the process you are shown an address to post your documents to. Ireland has a consulate in Karachi. I used TCS to post the application.

Thank you for the reply and guidance and the attestation info.

I have got a job offer in Spain so now applying for the schengen via for my spouse.

Would the cover letter you linked be good enough for the schengen visa too? As I like the directive reference you put in.

Much appricated.

Thanks for sharing your story, it is really very helpful for others.

One question please, me and my wife are british citizen and I need to call my parents through this route, from Pakistan for which irish visa they should apply, will that be family visitor or some other type?

Please suggest. thanks.

IM91 wrote:Thank you for the reply and guidance and the attestation info.

I have got a job offer in Spain so now applying for the schengen via for my spouse.

Would the cover letter you linked be good enough for the schengen visa too? As I like the directive reference you put in.

Much appricated.

The cover letter is specifically for Ireland as it quotes Ireland's EU Directive guidelines.

I would double check the visa you are applying for. I think you need to apply for the EU spouse visa not schengen from the Spanish embassy/consulate.

desertman wrote:Thanks for sharing your story, it is really very helpful for others.

One question please, me and my wife are british citizen and I need to call my parents through this route, from Pakistan for which irish visa they should apply, will that be family visitor or some other type?

Please suggest. thanks.

That would be Join Parent of EEA National

st2447 wrote:

IM91 wrote:Thank you for the reply and guidance and the attestation info.

I have got a job offer in Spain so now applying for the schengen via for my spouse.

Would the cover letter you linked be good enough for the schengen visa too? As I like the directive reference you put in.

Much appricated.

The cover letter is specifically for Ireland as it quotes Ireland's EU Directive guidelines.

I would double check the visa you are applying for. I think you need to apply for the EU spouse visa not schengen from the Spanish embassy/consulate.

Thanks. I keep going back and forth on the idea of which place to go. Its more about having a source of income rather than the country.

Hi, thanks for the detailed OP. I have a couple of questions for anyone who might be able to help:

1) When entering Ireland, do you suggest specifically requesting a 90 day stamp for the non-EU national? Is it worth explaining what you are trying to do (find property, register tenancy, apply Residence)

2) If the Non-EU spouse is only granted 30 day stamp at the border, what are the ramifications? Is it possible to get PRTB (housing) registration letter in that period (therefore allowing Garda registration). If not would spouse need to leave the country to reapply.

3) Is applying for a Family Permit after several months via the EU1 form the "final" step? I thought this form had a different name (VF something or other)

Many thanks.

I was also wondering the same thing

currently trying to gather information about the Irish entry visa for my indonesian partner do you get 90 days? also would a previous refusal to uk vistor visa present issues getting irish entry visa?

and what paper work do you have to inc in the application? is marriage document enough?