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ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Only for queries regarding Indefinite Leave to Remain (ILR). Please use the EU Settlement Scheme forum for queries about settled status under Appendix EU

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f317633
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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by f317633 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:21 pm

AML2015 wrote:@AHD2016

My solicitor seemed pretty positive since the late filing of my SA's have not caused any loss of revenue to HMRC. Since tax owed for 2010/11/12/13 is £0.

So in essence, if I had filed them in the respective tax years or in Jan 2016 (a month prior to my PEO application) the tax liability would still be £0. Additionally I took due diligence a month prior to my application to ensure HMRC receive the SA's even though there is no tax liability, but to ensure that the records are updated.

She reckons this argument would work in my favour. So hoping for the best. Left the rest to God...

Additionally we plan to add more documents to the admin review filing since I have an option to file them to clear myself of deception charges.
Is it not that even though it's a late payment of taxe to HMRC, there is absolutely no revenue loss to the department as the late payment incurs interest and penalties too. So HMRC never face any revenue loss even if the tax is paid late.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AHD2016 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:55 pm

noajthan wrote:Members are reminded of Board T&Cs (click);
eg points 2 & 7.
This board is to help each other out of difficult situations we all are put into because of HO. and if sharing some information can help someone, I don't think there is any harm. It is not advertising in anyway.

Either I have to put random posts to reach the count of 30 and then use PM facility.. or else there is no way.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AHD2016 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:58 pm

Hi AML,

please suggest how else can I contact you. Is there anyway, you can share the solicitor information please. I hope you understand the level frustration I am going through.

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CR001
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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by CR001 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:07 pm

Member are not permitted to post publicly any solicitor details.

If you post random posts to increase your post counts, these will be deleted and your PM function will be permanently disabled.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

AHD2016
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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AHD2016 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:10 pm

CR001 wrote:Member are not permitted to post publicly any solicitor details.

If you post random posts to increase your post counts, these will be deleted and your PM function will be permanently disabled.

It was just a suggestion. No one is gonna do it.

The attitude honestly doesn't look genuine. Everyone here seems to be ready to comment rather help except few genuine ones.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by O_Relly » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:28 pm

AHD2016 wrote:
noajthan wrote:Members are reminded of Board T&Cs (click);
eg points 2 & 7.
This board is to help each other out of difficult situations we all are put into because of HO. and if sharing some information can help someone, I don't think there is any harm. It is not advertising in anyway.

Either I have to put random posts to reach the count of 30 and then use PM facility.. or else there is no way.
Point 7 in Boards T&C quoted below,
You may discuss freely your personal experiences with various services, but you may NOT name them when you are posting negative commentary. If you wish to post positive commentary, which is your own, direct and personal experience(s), naming of reputable & reliable services will generally be permitted, so long as it does not become advertising or promotion.
It only states you are not allowed to post negative comments about solicitors, however positive reviews are permitted. So I don't believe there is any harm naming solicitors as long as it is your own positive personal opinion and not for commercial / advertising purposes.
Cheers,
OR

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AHD2016 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:33 pm

O_Relly wrote:
AHD2016 wrote:
noajthan wrote:Members are reminded of Board T&Cs (click);
eg points 2 & 7.
This board is to help each other out of difficult situations we all are put into because of HO. and if sharing some information can help someone, I don't think there is any harm. It is not advertising in anyway.

Either I have to put random posts to reach the count of 30 and then use PM facility.. or else there is no way.
Point 7 in Boards T&C quoted below,
You may discuss freely your personal experiences with various services, but you may NOT name them when you are posting negative commentary. If you wish to post positive commentary, which is your own, direct and personal experience(s), naming of reputable & reliable services will generally be permitted, so long as it does not become advertising or promotion.
It only states you are not allowed to post negative comments about solicitors, however positive reviews are permitted. So I don't believe there is any harm naming solicitors as long as it is your own positive personal opinion and not for commercial / advertising purposes.

This is what I was trying to explain. You need the support from community to help people in need.

Thanks for posting the info.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by O_Relly » Wed Feb 17, 2016 8:41 pm

It appears that is what @noajthan was trying to point to by making a reference to point 7, that it was OK to name solicitors as long as it was positive personal opinion and not advertising.
Cheers,
OR

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by noajthan » Wed Feb 17, 2016 11:44 pm

AHD2016 wrote:This board is to help each other out of difficult situations we all are put into because of HO. and if sharing some information can help someone, I don't think there is any harm. It is not advertising in anyway.

Either I have to put random posts to reach the count of 30 and then use PM facility.. or else there is no way.
Regarding the Board PM feature, do not go down the path of padding & nonsense messages to game the system.
This is monitored and such game-playing is observed and acted upon.


fyi - action also has to be (and is) taken daily against the spammers, the scammers, the vultures, the snake-oil 'advisors' & others who are drawn to these 'ILR refused due to my dodgy tax filing / deception / incompetent advisors'-type postings.

This is done to protect the membership at large as well as ImmigrationBoards.
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AHD2016 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:20 am

AML2015 wrote:I was also advised that I could work during JR if the HO agree to it in writing prior to the first hearing. She did get one of her clients the right to work during a JR if you can justify it with the right reasons.

AML2015 - I have left PM for you with regards to solicitor address. Could you please reply when u get time.

Many Thanks

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by CR001 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:54 am

AHD2016 wrote:
AML2015 wrote:I was also advised that I could work during JR if the HO agree to it in writing prior to the first hearing. She did get one of her clients the right to work during a JR if you can justify it with the right reasons.

AML2015 - I have left PM for you with regards to solicitor address. Could you please reply when u get time.

Many Thanks
You are not able to send PMs. You do not have enough posts.
Char (CR001 not Casa)
In life you cannot press the Backspace button!!
Please DO NOT send me a PM for immigration advice. I reserve the right to ignore the PM and not respond.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by adamsmith » Thu Feb 18, 2016 5:20 pm

AML2015 wrote:@AHD2016

My solicitor seemed pretty positive since the late filing of my SA's have not caused any loss of revenue to HMRC. Since tax owed for 2010/11/12/13 is £0.

So in essence, if I had filed them in the respective tax years or in Jan 2016 (a month prior to my PEO application) the tax liability would still be £0. Additionally I took due diligence a month prior to my application to ensure HMRC receive the SA's even though there is no tax liability, but to ensure that the records are updated.

She reckons this argument would work in my favour. So hoping for the best. Left the rest to God...

Additionally we plan to add more documents to the admin review filing since I have an option to file them to clear myself of deception charges.
Hi AML,
As far my understanding goes, I think your case is quite strong as you declared before you applied. Mistakes regarding tax matters are pretty common with all the organisation and individual tax returns.
I hope everything goes well with you. Could you please let me know what is the procedure for JR? If we loose do we have to pay for the legal costs and how long does it takes and how much is a typical lawyer charges for JR?
May god help us all at this very critical moment. Plz share your experiences. Thanks a lot.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by noajthan » Thu Feb 18, 2016 6:05 pm

Word to the wise, this is an example of how it's done:
http://www.immigrationboards.com/uk-tie ... 03469.html
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

raju4u
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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by raju4u » Fri Feb 19, 2016 12:25 pm

The only thing i do not understand is that you have paid before ur application and ur record was updated but they still refused you, So one Govt Department is accepting amendments and charging u penalties and interests for ur ignorance but the other Govt department is refusing you on the same basis. In your case it will be very interesting to know that what was your difference which you have revised. And what is the income in other 5 years. What are the wordings on your refusal letter. Because your posts does not cover the crucial areas of your application which led the cw to decide that he should refuse ur app. The question i believe raised by CW in your case is on the genuineness of your case unless you do not give a clear picture any helpful advice is not possible.

Admin review is likely to be refused as well whether u r genuine or not. While JR you will be an over stayer and wont be able to work. I believe there are many people who are caught up in the heat and they do not deserve such treatment after spending a significant time in this country. Worrying time ahead guys..



AHD2016 wrote:I just came back after meeting the barrister in london. Let me correct that you are legal to work only during AR not JR. during JR you are overstaying and shouldn't work.
He said that in last few weeks many cases like ours have come up. Probably things are changing now and even amendments are an issue to them.
Fingers crossed lets see what happens next. filed my AR today.

All the best everyone.

And yes for people who still have to make an application, please don't go to solihull. Worst place to apply ever. Go for Cryodon. There the case workers are much more experienced.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by noajthan » Fri Feb 19, 2016 12:42 pm

In this world nothing can be said to be certain, except death and taxes.
- Benjamin Franklin.

ILR is ofcourse not a 'visa' nor a right.
It is a privileged settled status for guests in this country to aspire to.

Similarly citizenship and even a first British passport are not rights but privileges.
All privileges need to be earned (& can be removed).

Reaching one step of a ladder does not guarantee you will make it to the next one (let alone the rest of the way up).

Some members have been on their ILR journey for up to 10 years.
That is surely ample time to learn British culture and traditions, such as filing of tax returns, paying taxes on time & etc.

High-powered and entrepreneurial businessmen (often with teams of professional advisors) in any part of the world clearly need to understand the business and political climate they operate in.

How could anyone survive in business by any other way?!
Pleading ignorance and/or those who are 'innocents abroad' will simply get trampled underfoot by the competition.

Migrants and tax avoidance/evasion are both current hot potatoes, how could anyone fail to grasp these political truths.
It is clear how the land lies in the prevailing geopolitical climate.

Also understand that HMRC and HO are two different government departments.
There is no guarantee of joined-up thinking or alignment between the two.
What may be acceptable to satisfy one set of legal requirements (say, tax) may not be sufficient in another area (eg immigration).

I have discovered one sign of increasing maturity is when we stop blaming our parents for our misfortunes & the way life turns out.
(I include myself in this).

I am becoming more and more convinced that this probably applies in terms of blaming HMRC & HO for tax and immigration misfortunes too.

In this case refusal was said to be due to caseworker's discretion based on serious grounds under 322(2) & 322(5).
These determinations are evidence-based and guidance states:
Standard of evidence
To refuse under paragraph 322(1A), 322(2) or 322(2A), you must have positive evidence to prove that the applicant has lied or submitted a false document. The burden of proof is balance of probabilities
Ref https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... __EXT_.pdf
- see page 8+

And regarding 322(5)
...guidance for caseworkers on how to consider when it is undesirable to let an applicant, applying for leave to remain, stay because of their character, behaviour or associations or they are a threat to national security.

...
This relates to general grounds for refusal under paragraph 322(5) of the rules.
The main types of cases you need to consider for refusal under paragraph 322(5) or referral to other teams are those that involve criminality ...
- ref linked doc (above); page 30+
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AML2015 » Fri Feb 19, 2016 12:54 pm

@adamsmith

Thanks for the positive inputs. Check the link below for getting upto speed with the JR process.

https://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/co ... review.pdf

The cost could vary depending on how many hearings you have in court plus the time your solicitor/barrister spends on your case. It highly depends on how expensive your solicitor is in the first place. The ballpark figure I got from my solicitor based on the JR going on for 8 months is around £15k.

As per the UK law, the loser pays all damages to the winner. This includes all damages claimed along with the solicitor charges. The solicitor fees included in the reimbursement is only from the time you paid the solicitor after the AR refusal.

There are insurances available for JR which you could take prior to the PAP initiation. Not sure how expensive they are but will cover your costs in case you lose the case. I think it will only cover the reimbursement costs and not your solicitor fees.

My solicitor advised me that mostly (around 95%) the HO retrieves their original decision during the PAP process if they are not 100% sure (if they have valid proof of deception then they will go ahead) of their arguments if they have to go to JR. Since its a huge monetary burden on the state if they lose the case and have to cough up to pay dual solicitor charges.

Hope this helps.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by AML2015 » Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:01 pm

@raju4u

Please refer to my another topic I had posted prior to my application. Hopefully this will give you some insights to my case.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/indefi ... 01405.html

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by raju4u » Fri Feb 19, 2016 9:08 pm

AML2015 wrote:@raju4u

Please refer to my another topic I had posted prior to my application. Hopefully this will give you some insights to my case.

http://www.immigrationboards.com/indefi ... 01405.html

I was actually asking AHD2016 as he has sorted all his matters before applying, so an insight to his case is interesting.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by PSCILR » Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:20 pm

AHD2016 wrote:
AML2015 wrote:All

Thanks for your support and inputs.

I have had a meeting with a solicitor today, and will be submitting my AR next Thursday. Hoping for the best.
Hi AML. How positive was your solicitor about the case. My barrister said 50-50 chances in JR as even judges are becoming strict these days.

Hi AHD2016 ,

Could you please share more details of your case.

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Re: ILR Refused @ PEO - LTD Company Director

Post by Casa » Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:27 pm

PSCILR wrote:
AHD2016 wrote:
AML2015 wrote:All

Thanks for your support and inputs.

I have had a meeting with a solicitor today, and will be submitting my AR next Thursday. Hoping for the best.
Hi AML. How positive was your solicitor about the case. My barrister said 50-50 chances in JR as even judges are becoming strict these days.

Hi AHD2016 ,

Could you please share more details of your case.
Before expecting AHD2016 to re-post details of their case, read through the thread and you will find it there.
(Casa, not CR001)
Please don't send me PMs asking for immigration advice on posts that are on the open forum. If I haven't responded there, it's because I don't have the answer. I'm a moderator, not a legal professional.

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Re: ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Post by adamsmith » Sat Feb 20, 2016 1:52 am

Samsaro wrote:Hi AML,

I am almost in the same situation as you are, but I have my T1G visa valid until 2017 and eligible to apply for ILR on 15th Feb, 2016. So I have decided to wait until HMRC amends my TAX. I have spoken to my Solicitor, and he advised me that I can put a covering letter explaining the fact with the evidence of tax amendment submitted to HMRC. But it is up to case worker to accept it or not. I would advise better consult a solicitor before you take any decision.

Thanks..
Hi samsaro,
Have u got any reply from HMRC regarding your tax amendment? Mine will be dealt with by 4th of March at least that's what they said. Please let me know your progress as I am very anxious about it, don't know what else I could do. I am trying my best to put things right.
Many Thanks.

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Re: ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Post by noajthan » Sat Feb 20, 2016 11:12 am

Word to the wise...
Casa wrote:
Without entering into a discussion about tax discrepancies, members should be aware that only applications which are 100% straightforward should be submitted in person at a PSC.

The PSC Case Workers are of a junior level and simply don't have the authority (or the knowledge) to process any application with requires further verification. The application will either be rejected on the day, or, if fortunate, it will be passed to senior level Case Workers for further checks and will join the postal queue at the premium fee.
All that is gold does not glitter; Not all those who wander are lost. E&OE.

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Re: ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Post by rush05 » Sat Feb 20, 2016 3:38 pm

@AML2015,

Hi bro,

Sorry for what has happened in your case.........

Coming to the personal tax amendments ...........Even I have sent my returns in the month of november2015 for year (2010-2011)......waiting for them to update on the system by HMRC.........have been given a date for that...........1st week of march............My ILR is due in End of april..............Just would like to check whether they are asking any company accounts for 2010-2011............Your help is much appreciated.......Thanks so much

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Re: ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Post by AML2015 » Sat Feb 20, 2016 4:55 pm

@rush

No there are not asking for any company accounts.HMRC will only update the figures if there is any tax liability and you owe them money. If not then dont bother since they wont update as seen in my case.

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Re: ILR Application Dilemma - PEO or Post ?

Post by karg_g » Sat Feb 20, 2016 6:20 pm

Hello

I think the spate of refusals is due to the fact people trying to fix things retrospectively. AML2015 i think you must be one of the unluckiest ones, but for the fact that retrospectively your saying you still dont owe any money to HMRC. The question is after amending your returns does your old and new tax difference is alarming different? If so, i think CW has got a good chance to reject your ILR.

I am going to Solihull PEO on Friday, 26-Feb. Although i have not amended any returns have filed every year for my Self-assessment since i have entered this country. I am perm employee since late 2013 and filling it because of my accountant (who pesters me every year). Even i have checked my SA 302 and its slightly different from what i have claimed for T1 - Extension but i will still qualify (i sincerely hope) even if they just take the SA 302.

I wish all the people, good luck and who have genuinely made a mistake in not filing SA due to their fault or accountant ignoring it.

Best wishes again
I try to give honest answers, however I might be wrong, kindly always check with your solicitor/accountant for final confirmation

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