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Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

General UK immigration & work permits; don't post job search or family related topics!

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MamaMoss94
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Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by MamaMoss94 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:15 pm

Hello, to keep an extremely long story short, I moved to UK at 14. Now 22. Married with 2 kids, can't pass my citizenship to them as didn't live in US long enough. Don't have any money as my visa was stolen when I thought it was being renewed, so I am an over stayer. I have no family in US that I speak to, and cannot get accepted for visa as do not make any money, and living off one income. Question: if I renounce my US citizenship, as its causing me more problems then solutions and I don't intend to go back, will I be accepted for a stateless visa?
Thanks

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CR001
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Re: Stateless visa

Post by CR001 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:19 pm

You will need evidence of another nationality to renounce US citizenship. The fee to renounce is $2350 in ££ equivalent.

https://uk.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-se ... /overview/

Suggest sort out your visa story on FLR(FP) 10 years partner route if you have a British spouse. I am assuming your kids are British??

I don't understand what you mean by '....as my visa was stolen when I thought it was being renewed'? Please explain.

How long have you been an overstayer?
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MamaMoss94
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Re: Stateless visa

Post by MamaMoss94 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:33 pm

My mum told me she would renew my visa as I was 17 when she took my passport, but instead went back to the states. No one is helping or giving me advise, and my husband only just got a decent paid job. My visa ran out about 4 years ago now. I keep applying for for family route but keep getting rejected as no money. The USCIS website said if I give it up but don't have a new nationality then I will become stateless, and as I am getting no support from either government, I'm not really bothered about giving up my citizenship if it will help me be able to work here in the long run.

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Re: Stateless visa

Post by CR001 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:46 pm

What 'family route' have you been applying for? You need to provide the proper names of the applications you have made, there are different visas and they have different rules and requirements.

FLR(FP) does not have a financial requirement element which is why I suggested it.
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Re: Stateless visa

Post by MamaMoss94 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:09 pm

I spent most of the 4 years saving for a marriage visa, which I found out was the wrong one before I applied. I was then told by the HO to apply for a residence card, which took me a while to save up even for that, and was obviously denied. I then applied for leave to remain with family, 10 year partner route, on a fee waiver as I was told by the HO again that I would qualify as we were on very low income at the time, and I am unable to work, but was denied again, and told I can only reapply with a lawyer, and to sign on at the police station on a monthly basis. I'm just thinking now, it may be better to give up citizenship and apply as stateless as I am getting no help from my family, my husbands family, the US, or the UK. We are having to live paycheck to paycheck until I am able to work as well.

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Re: Stateless visa

Post by CR001 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:26 pm

I then applied for leave to remain with family, 10 year partner route, on a fee waiver as I was told by the HO again that I would qualify as we were on very low income at the time, and I am unable to work, but was denied again
Why was this one refused? This is the same as what I have suggested you apply for on the partner route.
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Re: Stateless visa

Post by Morning Boat » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:37 pm

As CR001 posted, you cannot surrender your US citizenship that easily. In addition to the fees and required tax returns (if you ever made over $8000 a year or whatever the legal limit to file happened to be in the year that you were over it), there's also no guarantee that the embassy will let you go through with it. While it's technically legal, not every embassy will accept your paperwork without a foreign passport, mostly because you have no idea what you're doing or what kind of hell you're getting yourself into. For one example of this kind of thing going extremely terribly, see this page (note that Australia promptly deported the newly stateless man back to the US anyway):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joel_Slater

As to the rest of your situation, is your husband British and were your children born in the UK/are they British?

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Re: Stateless visa

Post by MamaMoss94 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:45 pm

I understand that being stateless has a lot of problems, however I am already living under very limited freedom. I can't work, no access to education, cannot get credit, bank account, NHS care, no public funds, and cannot have a home in my name, and have to report to the police once a month or I'll be detained and deported. I would be living exactly the same. On USCIS website, it says I don't need a visa or nationality, it is advised, but not mandatory. I was rejected on the fee waiver because the way they see it, my husband has a job and can get public funds if he wasn't working, so that's good enough in their eyes. I just don't know how to gt this sorted and can't afford the visa fee, legal costs, NHS fee for the flr visa and my husbands credit has been ruined through all of this. I've never worked, I've been illegal since I turned 18, and caring for my daughter. I want to work now, and have a possible job waiting. I just don't know how to fix what my mums done to me.

And my husband is British and my kids are as well, I can't even pass my citizenship to them as I didn't live in states long enough.

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Re: Stateless visa

Post by Morning Boat » Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:25 pm

None of those things would change if you became stateless. In fact, since renouncing costs something like 1800 pounds right now, some might get worse. Frankly, I don't think it would ever get to that point because the embassy could easily ignore the law and not allow the paperwork to be filed (you can Google around to find this does happen) but there is nothing good about being stateless:

http://www.statelessness.eu/blog/update ... -decisions

It's taking the UK up to three years to decide these applications and less than 10% are being granted. While the decision is being made you will not have permission to work or anything else you don't have already.

Furthermore, unlike genuine refugee status, becoming stateless by choice is not even necessarily something that would stop the UK from deporting you. This is what the guidance notes say:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... __EXT_.pdf
4.6.6 Voluntary renunciation of nationality
Voluntary renunciation occurs when an individual gives up his or her nationality
through choice, usually by oral or written declaration. The subsequent withdrawal of
nationality by the State may be automatic or at the discretion of the authorities.
Although many States have safeguards in their nationality laws to prevent this from
leading to statelessness, it continues to occur.
Sometimes individuals have to renounce their nationality in order to naturalise in
another State and may then remain stateless if they do not acquire the second
nationality. In other cases individuals voluntarily renounce their nationality because
they do not wish to be nationals of a particular State or in the belief that this will lead
to the grant of a protection status in another country. Those who have renounced
their nationality voluntarily may be able to reacquire such nationality, unlike other
stateless persons.
The question of an individual’s free choice is not relevant when determining eligibility
for recognition as stateless under Article 1(1) of the 1954 Convention, even if it
appears that the applicant may have been motivated by the prospect of securing
leave to remain as a stateless person. The applicant must nevertheless be asked the
reason for renunciation and the possibility of re-acquiring that nationality must be
examined very carefully in such cases. Loss of nationality and consequential
statelessness will not necessarily prevent re-admission to the country concerned.
Where there is evidence to suggest that someone has deliberately renounced
nationality in an attempt to benefit from stateless provisions, and there remains an
option for them to approach the relevant State to reacquire their former nationality,
the stateless application should be refused.


Whether reacquiring your US citizenship would still be an option is not an easy question for myself (a former US immigration attorney) to answer and would probably require a court case, taking years and thousands of pounds/dollars, to decide; as I'm not a UK solicitor or barrister I have no idea how you would go about proving this either way. The fact that Joel Slater got his back through more or less asking nicely does not bode well, however. If you cannot afford the fees for the normal immigration process you definitely cannot afford to gamble on this.

This is not nearly everything that could go wrong, but hopefully enough to convince you that this is an extremely terrible idea.

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Re: Stateless visa

Post by MamaMoss94 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 6:06 pm

What if I apply for for under private life 10 year route? With a fee waiver? Could I pass for a waiver then? Instead of applying through my partner like last time? This is all making me crazy, I'm getting ill, not to sound dramatic. I need to progress my life and support my family, and I have no idea how to go about doing that.

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Fee exemption ?

Post by MamaMoss94 » Mon May 01, 2017 1:03 pm

Hello, I am unable to work, and my husband is on very low income. I applied for flr partner 10 year route, with a fee waiver, but was denied. I literally have no money, and was left in the country with no visa by my mum. If I apply for flr private life 10 year route, would I qualify for a fee waiver?I have no family or friends in the states, where I am from. And its only my husband and I taking care of ourselfs and 2 kids, can't afford the visa fees at all!

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Re: Fee exemption ?

Post by Casa » Mon May 01, 2017 1:08 pm

What reasons were given in your previous application for not qualifying for a fee waver?
(Casa, not CR001)
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MamaMoss94
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Re: Fee exemption ?

Post by MamaMoss94 » Mon May 01, 2017 1:12 pm

They said its not in my kids best interest. My husband is able to work so that's 'good enough' when its really not unless you make tons of money. I have also found out since then that I don't qualify to pass my citizenship to my kids, I didn't live in the states long enough.

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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by MamaMoss94 » Mon May 01, 2017 3:40 pm

So, I'm just going to get myself detained. Already emailed HO and told them. I am not going to the police station this month to sign on. I'm done being a victim my whole life, treated like a criminal for something I didn't do. Anyways, detainees seem to get more help and support anyways. Daily mirror is publishing my story. Told the HO That as well.

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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by remiee » Mon May 15, 2017 10:58 am

Please I need advice. We were all granted 2.5yrs FLR (FP) outside the immigration rules. All our four children all born in the UK my first child got registered as a British and now got his British passport early this year and the second is due for registereing next year April 2018.

We are due for renewal in November 2017, and my question are
1. Can we apply by ourselves as the cost of payning lawyers will be too much for us.

2. The cost of the application for Family of 5 will cost aleast £6k or more including NHS fee. And for that reason that we can't afford that amount. Can we apply for fee waiver?.

3. What doccument/Letters are required for renwal

4. What are the chances of been successful if we renwe it without going through a lawyer.

Please I need advice, so we have enough time to prepare

MamaMoss94
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Proving nationality

Post by MamaMoss94 » Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:38 pm

Hello, my FLR(FP) application was denied. I'm now being looked at by enforcement team 28 on human rights basis. My British husband doesn't have a passport, been asked to get him one. But when I was filling out my application, I read somewhere that by sending in his mother's birth certificate, she was also born in UK to UK parents, this can prove his nationality. Now they say this is incorrect, but if I can send them the link to where I read this, they may consider it as I have VERY unique circumstances. But as this was 7 months ago, I can't remember where I saw this. If anyone knows of this rule, can I please get a link so I may send to HO

Thanksss

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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by vinny » Sat Jul 15, 2017 4:29 am

This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

vinny
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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by vinny » Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:33 am

A British passport does not confer British citizenship. There is no requirement for British citizens to have British passports.

When was he born?

You are correct that he may prove his citizenship via his place of birth and parent's status.
This is not intended to be legal or professional advice in any jurisdiction. Please click on any given links for further information. Refer to the source of any quotes.
We do not inherit the Earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children.

MamaMoss94
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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by MamaMoss94 » Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:06 pm

Thank you so much! Do you have a link where I can send to the removal team for prove?
He was born in UK in 1992.
His mum was was born in UK in 1962
And his dad was born in UK in 1964
As well as both their sets of parents, all born in the UK!

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Re: Fee Waiver - FLR(FP)

Post by MamaMoss94 » Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:53 am

My HUSBAND just received a letter from the HO discussing MY case. I know this is illegal for them to do. What legal action can I take on them? They won't accept his parents birth certificates as prove of his nationality, when I've sent them legislation on the British nationality act, chapter 53, and the immigration act proving this is acceptable proof. What can I do???

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