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Moderators: Casa, archigabe, CR001, push, JAJ, ca.funke, Amber, zimba, vinny, Obie, EUsmileWEallsmile, batleykhan, meself2, geriatrix, John, ChetanOjha
No, until you claim to be self-sufficient or a student.lovety23 wrote:1, if this guy claim child benefit and child tax credit and add my name to the child tax credit wil this affect me when I apply for R.O.R or permanent residence?
Yes, if he remains in the UK and also he becomes a permanent resident or remains a qualified person (e.g. by continuing to work). However, you need to watch for a change in the regulations. It is quite possible that it is you who may have to be the worker (etc.), not from when the divorce happens, but from when the law changes as a result of the UK voting to remain in the EU. It has been promised that the definition of a 'marriage of convenience' will change to include failed marriages that are maintained to give the non-EEA spouse an immigration advantage.lovety23 wrote:2 If my EU husband refuse to corporatet with the divorce can I apply for permanent residence on 2018 after completing five years of residence.
Not a problem.lovety23 wrote:3 my health visitor gave me a form to fill so i can entitle to free precription base on having a child under 1 one year of age is this ok to do.
That is a consequence, but not the one I had in mind.lovety23 wrote:So though his biological father is British he cannot apply for him for British pasport is that what u mean?
How do you envisage a FLR(M) application being valid? Her husband is an EU national and she isn't married to her new British partner...and wouldn't at present qualify as an unmarried partner. She holds no category of visa under UK Regulations which would enable her to switch to 'Further Leave'.Richard W wrote:That is a consequence, but not the one I had in mind.lovety23 wrote:So though his biological father is British he cannot apply for him for British pasport is that what u mean?
My understanding is that if your husband were to permanently return to his home country tomorrow, you and your son would cease to have any right to be in the United Kingdom. The only way I can think of for you two to remain would be to use the 'family route', applying under form FLR(M) (which stands for 'Further Leave to Remain on the basis of Marriage'). That costs £822 (fee) + £500 (NHS surcharge) + £19.20 (Biometric application fee) for you, and either £822 for your son if he is an EEA citizen or the same as you if he is not an EEA citizen. It is cheaper and the 10-year route is easier if your son is British.
If you want the 5-year family route, you also have to prove your competence in English (unless you have other evidence, such a degree taught in English or country of origin) and show you meet the income requirement - which must be done using your new partner's income alone if you lose your right to be in the UK. Furthermore, you must not have overstayed by more than 28 days.
For the 10-year route, you do not have to meet the income requirement, but you will have to satisfy Immigration Rule EX.1. You would have to show either that there are "very significant difficulties which would be faced by the applicant or their partner in continuing their family life together outside the UK and which could not be overcome or would entail very serious hardship for the applicant or their partner" or that you have "a genuine and subsisting parental relationship with a child who ... is a British Citizen or has lived in the UK continuously for at least the 7 years immediately preceding the date of application ;and it would not be reasonable to expect the child to leave the UK." While you may qualify with your new partner's child, you would definitely qualify with your son if he became a British citizen.
For your son, registration as British may be cheaper than a residence card for him if you can do everything yourself. I am assuming that his biological father is recorded on his birth certificate, and that the Home Office will not insist on a DNA test, as they might if his birth was registered on or after 10 September 2015.
Casa wrote:How do you envisage a FLR(M) application being valid? Her husband is an EU national and she isn't married to her new British partner...and wouldn't at present qualify as an unmarried partner. She holds no category of visa under UK Regulations which would enable her to switch to 'Further Leave'.Richard W wrote:That is a consequence, but not the one I had in mind.lovety23 wrote:So though his biological father is British he cannot apply for him for British pasport is that what u mean?
My understanding is that if your husband were to permanently return to his home country tomorrow, you and your son would cease to have any right to be in the United Kingdom. The only way I can think of for you two to remain would be to use the 'family route', applying under form FLR(M) (which stands for 'Further Leave to Remain on the basis of Marriage'). That costs £822 (fee) + £500 (NHS surcharge) + £19.20 (Biometric application fee) for you, and either £822 for your son if he is an EEA citizen or the same as you if he is not an EEA citizen. It is cheaper and the 10-year route is easier if your son is British.
If you want the 5-year family route, you also have to prove your competence in English (unless you have other evidence, such a degree taught in English or country of origin) and show you meet the income requirement - which must be done using your new partner's income alone if you lose your right to be in the UK. Furthermore, you must not have overstayed by more than 28 days.
For the 10-year route, you do not have to meet the income requirement, but you will have to satisfy Immigration Rule EX.1. You would have to show either that there are "very significant difficulties which would be faced by the applicant or their partner in continuing their family life together outside the UK and which could not be overcome or would entail very serious hardship for the applicant or their partner" or that you have "a genuine and subsisting parental relationship with a child who ... is a British Citizen or has lived in the UK continuously for at least the 7 years immediately preceding the date of application ;and it would not be reasonable to expect the child to leave the UK." While you may qualify with your new partner's child, you would definitely qualify with your son if he became a British citizen.
For your son, registration as British may be cheaper than a residence card for him if you can do everything yourself. I am assuming that his biological father is recorded on his birth certificate, and that the Home Office will not insist on a DNA test, as they might if his birth was registered on or after 10 September 2015.
Not that it makes a great deal of difference, but just for the record the postal fee for a FLR(M) application is £811
I'm assuming that it will be easy to demonstrate that the previous marriage has broken down irretrievably.Casa wrote:How do you envisage a FLR(M) application being valid? Her husband is an EU national and she isn't married to her new British partner...and wouldn't at present qualify as an unmarried partner.
Does she need a visa? I believe the relevant rules (both in Appendix FM) are:Casa wrote:She holds no category of visa under UK Regulations which would enable her to switch to 'Further Leave'.
Lovety23, so far as we are aware, does not have leave to be in the UK but is instead has the EEA exemption. Now, if this exemption suddenly disappears without warning, she might be able to put in an application before the overstay reaches 28 days, but if not, she will rely on Paragraph EX.1, specifically, the bond with a British citizen child.Immigration status requirements
E-LTRP.2.1. The applicant must not be in the UK-
(a) as a visitor; or
(b) with valid leave granted for a period of 6 months or less, unless that leave is as a fiancé(e) or proposed civil partner, or was granted pending the outcome of family court or divorce proceedings
E-LTRP.2.2. The applicant must not be in the UK –
(a) on temporary admission or temporary release, unless:
(i) the Secretary of State is satisfied that the applicant arrived in the UK more than 6 months prior to the date of application; and
(ii) paragraph EX.1. applies; or
(b) in breach of immigration laws (disregarding any period of overstaying for a period of 28 days or less), unless paragraph EX.1. applies.
I think I got confused with the £1622 for mother and son. Perhaps I should just have said "c. £1,000".Casa wrote:Not that it makes a great deal of difference, but just for the record the postal fee for a FLR(M) application is £811
It seems that some people get professional help to submit a naturalisation application. That increases the cost. Actually, I think my arithmetic is wrong. I forgot the cost of the Nationality Checking Service (NCS) is around £40, and for UKF applications you just pay the cost of the ceremony. I am now thoroughly confused myself! Is form UKF only for adults? The guidance claims the form is only for those born in 2006 or earlier; they've overlooked cases such as your son. It could be that registration as British is free in this case.lovety23 wrote:Please I dont seem to understand the last paragraph, "for ur son registration as british may be cheaper than a residence card for him if i can do every for my self
1, what do u mean if I can do every for my self?
They could. You would have to pay. The guidance notes for UKF says a birth certificate will be accepted. I haven't heard of British birth certificates as composed within one year of birth being rejected as evidence of paternity, but in some countries the mother's statement as to who the father is is reportedly accepted. If the birth certificate records the true father, there should be no problems.lovety23 wrote:2,And that home office will not insist on a DNA test, as they might if his birth was registered on or after 10 September 2015. Do u mean they will carry DNA test on my currrent partner to confirm if he is the biological father?
Your only problem will be if the current birth certificate is dishonest. If the birth certificate records your husband as the father, I don't know what will happen.lovety23 wrote:3,If the DNA confirm he is the biological father what will they do will that has a consequense on my side ?
NCS cannot be used for UKF or UKM forms as HO requires ALL original documents for verification and authentication checks.Richard W wrote:Actually, I think my arithmetic is wrong. I forgot the cost of the Nationality Checking Service (NCS) is around £40, and for UKF applications you just pay the cost of the ceremony. I am now thoroughly confused myself! Is form UKF only for adults? The guidance claims the form is only for those born in 2006 or earlier; they've overlooked cases such as your son. It could be that registration as British is free in this case.
No, she entered the UK with her husband. The marriage failed in the UK; it lasted over a year here, and reportedly lasted for a total of five years. Now, by the Diatta case, as this was not a marriage of convenience, and, moreover, subsisted in the UK, she counts for the EEA regulations as her husband's family member until the divorce is finalised. We have not been told whether proceedings have started. It might be more convenient for the OP if the marriage were already terminated.Casa wrote:The challenges I see are:
1. The OP is here as a family member of an EU national.
2. If she now claims that she has not been residing here under EEA Regulations but has been clocking up 2 years of co-habitation 'akin to marriage' with a British national, one or the other will not be valid.
I disagree with your numbered points, but it will be helpful to have another opinion.Case wrote:3. You can't pick and mix EEA regulations with EU Rules. FLR(M) is for a visa extension under UK Immigration Rules. The OP doesn't currently hold a visa.
4. A spouse or unmarried partner visa application can't be submitted from within the UK, if not switching from valid leave.
5. I don't believe the HO will accept an application as an unmarried partner if she is not divorced from the husband.
I agree that it's a complex case. FLR(FP) under the 10 year partner route may be an option but I would prefer to see further advice from others more qualified. Confirmation on the length of the new relationship needs to be confirmed.
Do they not check that the application is complete?CR001 wrote:NCS cannot be used for UKF or UKM forms as HO requires ALL original documents for verification and authentication checks.
Lovety23 is married. Under British nationality law, the mother's husband is the child's father. This is no longer a presumption, but an irrefutable fact by definition. However, Section 4G of the Nationality Act allows a person born since 1983 to register as British if his natural father is British and the person would have been British if his natural father were his father. The problem is that the guidance for UKF implies that applicants will have been born in 2006 or earlier.CR001 wrote:The nationality rules changed in 2006 in that children born to unmarried parents where the father is British means the child will be British automatically.
Richard W wrote:Do they not check that the application is complete? No they don't. UKF is only for children born before 1st July 2006 so would not be the appropriate form either for the reason I have already stated.CR001 wrote:NCS cannot be used for UKF or UKM forms as HO requires ALL original documents for verification and authentication checks.
The problem with UKF is worse than I thought. I'd overlooked Section 4E(a), which restricts the scope to those born before 1st July 2006. Consequently, Lovety23's son would have to be registered at discretion under form MN1, which has a fee of £936. The case is covered under Paragraph 9.9.5 of the Nationality Instructions. If he avoids long stays (> 90 days) abroad, he will be entitled to be registered as British when he reaches the age of 10, for the same fee. I don't know what to advise. Is the son an EEA citizen? Ultimately, he should be registered before he reaches the age of 18.CR001 wrote:Richard W wrote:Do they not check that the application is complete? No they don't. UKF is only for children born before 1st July 2006 so would not be the appropriate form either for the reason I have already stated.CR001 wrote:NCS cannot be used for UKF or UKM forms as HO requires ALL original documents for verification and authentication checks.
Check that your husband is in the UK and still working. It's good news for you that the crucial date is the service of the divorce papers, not the decree absolute. It makes an emergency resort to FLR(M) much less likely.lovety23 wrote:1 , what right steps to take now ?
You have to count as a 'worker', unless by staying at home you enable your boyfriend to earn enough that the four of you (a) get no benefits and (b) can afford Comprehensive Sickness Insurance for at least you and your son. So, basically, you have to be working. Once the divorce happens, your right to reside depends on your 'exercising the treating rights', and being a student does not count.lovety23 wrote:2, should I start divorce precceeding my other fear to this am not back to work yet as some people said i have to be working before and after the divorce is that true?
That's your risk assessment. You would have to provide evidence that your husband was working for the whole five years, and that may be difficult to obtain. If you divorce, the relevant evidence of working from the time of the divorce will be the evidence that you were working, which will be much easier to obtain.lovety23 wrote:3 ,should I wait until 2018 and apply straight for permanent residence after completing five years in the UK just want to get my self wel prepare ahead. Once again thanks to every one given me this vital information as i have no knowledge which route to take so stress he hurt me and now am in dilema .
Once again thank u casa for ur quick reply, i meet a lawyer before my baby was born told me the same thing that if I clock the five years and my husband stil excise his treaty right and corporate wit me I wil be able to secure permanent residence base on stil maried to him and no divorce yet he said am stil regarded as family member of an EU.Casa wrote:So although I don't believe that an unmarried partner application would be an option for you, the fact that you have only been together for 14 months counts this out anyway. Does you current partner earn at least £18,600 a year?
Personally, I believe your best route to solving your situation would be to apply for PR once you qualify with your husband's co-operation.
I'll leave others to respond who are better placed to advise on your child's right to BC.
Yes, it will work if he stays in employment in the UK. Not all men are bad.lovety23 wrote:Yes my husband has been in full time job since I entered the uk and still working and excise his treaty right and the last time we spoke , he told me after completing my five years he will give me his documents for me to apply for my permanent residence is that possible ?
No, the law lays down that if the mother has a husband, for the purposes of British nationality, the husband of the mother is the person considered to be the father. Current policy allows you to buy him British nationality for just under £1,000, which I believe is to be regarded as a sort of tax on future income. (I believe such an explanation was given when fees first became very large.) The birth certificate, and possibly the DNA test, may be used as evidence of permission to buy him citizenship.lovety23 wrote:Is my son not entittle to a british passport through his British father? as he is registered on the birth certificate .
The financial problem with an unmarried partner visa (not available for 10 months - this is planning for an emergency that may never happen) is that unless the son becomes British, the visa will need to cover both mother and son, so the threshold is not £18,600 but £22,400. At least, I assume the threshold rises for EEA national children, and we have no idea whether the son is an EEA national (in accordance with the principles of British nationality).Casa wrote:Does you current partner earn at least £18,600 a year?