ILR for Wife & Son who stayed for short time in UK

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Sat May 19, 2012 9:56 am

HI: Kindly help me ascertain what my next steps should be.

I have been in UK on Tier 1 General (Jan 2009) for 3 years and last year my wife and son (Born in India) joined me in UK as dependants for a period of 5 months before returning to India.

I have now extended my tier 1 general (Till May 2014) for 2 years but my family is still in India and will join me as dependants ( I need to apply for there tier 1 dependant visa now) sometime this year.

1) If my wife & son join me now and still do not complete full 2 years in UK( we have been married for 3 years now) can they apply for ILR with me 2014?

2)What if they spend only 1 year in total as my dependants (from my 5 year stay in UK) what application of extension should they make with me when i apply for ILR in 2014?

Post by **geriatrix** » Sat May 19, 2012 2:05 pm

No one can tell you today what the rules may be in 2014!

Under current rules:
1. 319E(d).
2. FLR(M).

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Sat May 19, 2012 2:51 pm

Thanks for that..

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Sat May 19, 2012 2:59 pm

The reason i was asking the question is if the current rule is to stay, then i will try and get my dependants in UK to complete the reamining 1 yr 7 months by the time i reach ILR time .
does the gap of 1 yr between the first 5 months and the potential future stay cause a problem ? or can dependants spend 2yrs in however many block of months possible with gaps in between spent outside UK?

Post by **geriatrix** » Sat May 19, 2012 4:00 pm

"Continuous" is not referred to in 319E.
See also Ambassador's success.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Sat May 19, 2012 7:17 pm

Makes sense now..Thanks: Ii have tried to re word my question after your help as follows:

Question

I am Tier 1 general visa holder. My wife & son stayed in UK as my dependants for a period of 5 months in 2011 and then returned to India. I have now extended my tier 1 General Visa for 2 years. My family will join me shortly but by the time i am eligible for ILR i.e. May 2014, they would have NOT completed a 2 years period or will only complete 20 months (of the required 24 months for ILR) by that time.

If i understand this right- When i apply for ILR in May 2014, I need my family to apply for FLR (M) as they will not be eligible for ILR yet under the 2 year category.

After my family apply for FLR(M) and a period of 4 months ( to complete the 2 year requirement) can she apply for ILR - OR - My family need to complete another 2 years on FLR (M) before getting there ILR

Post by **vinny** » Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:14 pm

Syedahm wrote:Hi

I will be applying for ILR visa via tier 1 General route ( completing 5 years in April 2014.initial visa received in march 2009 - old rules) I will start preparing for Life in UK test and as a salaried employee hopefully everything will be OK for ME. Please can you confirm what form I will need to complete?

For MY ILR- is there a min salary requirement? If for my below questions, I can apply for ILR for ALL my family – any min salary requirments?
My Wife was in UK for 5 months in 2011 (March to September) and then returned to home country. She came back to UK in Feb 2013 and by April 2014 she would have completed 3 years ( if the gap in between is not counted) or 19 months if I count exactly the number of months she was present here.
Can I apply ILR for her? If yes what form? If not what form / visa do I need to apply to extend her stay?

My Child 1 was in UK for 5 months in 2011 (March to September) and then returned to home country. He came back to UK in Feb 2013 and by April 2014 he would have completed 3 years ( if the gap in between is not counted) or 19 months if I count exactly the number of months he was present here.( he will be 4+ years in April 2014)
Can I apply ILR for him? If yes what form? If not what form / visa do i need to apply to extend his stay?

My Child 2 came to uk in Feb 2013 and by April 2014 he would have completed 14 months (he will be 2+ years in April 2014)
Can I apply ILR for him? If yes what form? If not what form / visa do I need to apply to extend his stay?

Appreciate your help in mapping my next steps as rules changed for a min 5 years dependant stay requirment and I cant figure out what is the right approach.

IF they dont get ILR with me- how and when will they be able to apply?

Many thanks

Syed

Post by **vinny** » Sun Oct 27, 2013 10:26 pm

See also Settlement.

Not certain about the Spouse ILR - 2 years definition.

See also FAQs and Dependants of ILR (economic, 5 year route) applicants.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Mon Oct 28, 2013 11:53 am

Hi Vinny

Sorry - i am clearly more confused now...

so far i understand that my ILR is all good and i need to use SET (O) form

1) for both my kids - i can apply for ILR already?? what form should i use?? " Child
Child born abroad - A child dependant with leave as PBS dependant may apply for settlement at the same time as the principal PBS migrant.
319J"

2) for my wife - i see your comment as not certain.. is it not certain for ILR ( do you know what happens if i apply for ILR- if i go in person with her form.. do they take the fees and then reject? or will someone tell me i got the wrong forms and i must fill another form?) the reason i am asking this is no body ( i spoke some friends too) knows how to approach for my wifes visa..Is there a way to talk to someone in UKBA?

solution one - apply for ILR with me and kids and if they ignore the gap - she gets the visa - right?? ( if this is done in person- will it save me loosing fees if it rejected?)

Solution two - apply for Tier 1 general extension for my wife( me and kids apply for ILR- if i understand right)

please help

Post by **vinny** » Mon Oct 28, 2013 12:23 pm

1) If the children satisfy the requirements of 319J, then they may be included in your SET(O) application or they may apply on SET(O) separately after you are granted ILR (provided they have sufficient leave).

2) Perhaps you can write and ask them for clarification.

Ayyubi72 · Post by **Ayyubi72** » Mon Oct 28, 2013 1:08 pm

If they have to come and live in UK, then why not let them first come to UK, and then a year before you think they might qualify for ILR you can look into rules in place at that time and decide what is the best way forward.

What is the point pondering over every possibiltiy (that is in your brain) and try to find an answer, when you know yoursleves that nowadays immigration rules change every other day. Any advice you obtain now may be irrelevant when its the time for you to cross the bridge.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Tue Oct 29, 2013 8:01 pm

Hi Ayyubi - they are already in UK and i need to start maintaining funds from Jan

Vinny- i read 319J and it clears my doubts about kids..thank you

from what i understood now.. me and both kids will apply for ILR under SET O and for my wife- need to find out if she can apply for iLR or extend on tier 1 .. any clues who to call at ukba or does anyone know the answer?

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:29 pm

hi- just found some statements on this forum ..regarding my kids coming to uk with the following details
"
My Child 1 was in UK for 5 months in 2011 (March to September) and then returned to home country. He came back to UK in Feb 2013 and by April 2014 he would have completed 3 years ( if the gap in between is not counted) or 19 months if I count exactly the number of months he was present here.( he will be 4+ years in April 2014)
Can I apply ILR for him? If yes what form? If not what form / visa do i need to apply to extend his stay?

My Child 2 came to uk in Feb 2013 and by April 2014 he would have completed 14 months (he will be 2+ years in April 2014)
Can I apply ILR for him? If yes what form? If not what form / visa do I need to apply to extend his stay?
"

i found the following

Q33 - My child applied for PBS dependant leave for the first time before 09-Jul-12 and my partner is not applying for settlement with me. Can I include the child as a dependant in my settlement application?
Yes, you may (319J(e)(iv)).

Q34 - My child applied for PBS dependant leave for the first time on / after 09-Jul-12 and my partner is not applying for settlement with me. Can I include the child as a dependant in my settlement application?
No, the child will have to wait until your partner becomes eligible for settlement, to be included in your partner's settlement application as a dependant (319J(e)(iv)).

so i cannot apply for ILR for my kids?? as per q34??
as my elder kid did come to UK but there was break and came back after 09-jul-12 and the little one for the first time came in Feb 2013

does this makes them not eligible for ILR now?

Post by **vinny** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:35 pm

It seems that the first child may apply for ILR in line with you, as child was your dependant prior to 9 July 2012.

Second child may apply for leave in line with your spouse. If your spouse is eligible for ILR, then your second child will be also.

Their applications would be subject to 319J, assuming your spouse qualifies for ILR under 319E.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:51 pm

thanks vinny. this makes sense and match to point on 319 J

(iv) One parent is, at the same time, being granted indefinite leave to remain as a Relevant Points Based System Migrant, the other parent is lawfully present in the UK or being granted leave at the same time as the applicant, and the applicant was granted leave as the child of a Relevant Points Based System Migrant under the Rules in place before 9 July 2012.

the only thing that contradicts is q39

Q39 - Is there a qualifying residential period for minor dependants?
A minor (under 18) is not subject to any qualifying residential period (319J).

if there is no qualifying period.. how long does my little one ( child 2) wait to get ILR ? why? same as my wife? 5 years?

i spoke to a friend of mine who got his ILR sometime ago/// he said i will have two options for my wife.. extend as tier1 dependant till she completes 2 years... or get FLR M form to complete 5 years...

key point he said is .. if she extends under tier 1 dependant.. she can still get ILR on completion of 2 years i.e if counted from Feb 2013 ( as she is only extending to cover as her stay was broken) reason being .. she was already a dependant who came to uk once before 09july2012...

Post by **vinny** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:27 pm

A child's ILR is not subject to any qualifying residential period. But is subject to parents' circumstances.

Did your spouse apply for an entry clearance after 9th July 2012?

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:49 pm

Did your spouse apply for an entry clearance after 9th July 2012?

second time she came to UK - yes - after july 2012

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 10:20 pm

vinny--

This question may sound odd but if i have to extend my families visa on Tier 1 dependant - fee is £4635 ( 1545*3) for wife and two kids

If i use FLR(M) it is £1444 ( 578 + 433*2)

i understand there calculation of 5 years will re-start from the date of granted FLR M??

we loose 1 year of time span in stay but in both routes.. i will have to extend one moretime... that means a difference of atlest £6000 in fees over the next few years.. with the way they are increasing fees.... it will be more i guess....what say?

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 10:54 pm

hi - this leads to another question... CAN I apply for FLR M for them or not..
as this link says other wise

http://www.ukba.homeoffice.gov.uk/visas ... you-apply/
"
This section is for the husband, wife or civil partner of a British citizen or a person who is settled here who had applied on or before 8 July 2012 for a visa to come to the UK.

If you had not applied for a visa under this category by that date, please see the main Partners section for the different rules that apply to you.

This page explains how to apply for permission to remain in the UK as the husband, wife or civil partner of a British citizen or a person who is present and settled here, if you are already in the UK in a different immigration category. "

does this mean i have to probably take my ILR in Person and then the next day apply for there FLR M?

are they forcing my partner and children to take up route of Point based system dependants only?

Post by **vinny** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 12:50 am

Switching to FLR(M) remains possible, if she satisfies the requirements of FLR(M).

However, not switching may also be advantageous.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:30 pm

she has a degree but another english test - she wont mind at all..

Advantageous part is when i can use all the time she spent.. from what i undertand once you have a break( depending on being out of the country more than 180 days which is true in our case.)... clock resets? we we loose one year of stay Feb2013 to April 2014 now if we choose to pick FLR M over tier 1 dependant .. is this right?

please can you confirm that in order to apply for FLR M.. i must be applying for ILR inperson and then submit there application by post... as per the requirment i become a settled person and apply for dependant?

the other requirment is earning of £24500 for wife and 2 kids.. is this earning in the last 12 months? or the projected earnings?

Post by **Amber** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:32 pm

Dependant absences should be limited and for good reason rather than below a specified period.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:13 pm

i calculated there time out of UK in intervals working backwards from ILR date. they were out of UK for more than 180 days in 2 of them.. and they have clearly mentioned that pregnancy realted time out is NOT a compassionate reason for ignoring time out. that means .. there initial time in 2011 is null and void.. there new clock started in feb 2013 - post the new rules so 5 years will be applicable to all of them.

i am trying to figure out next steps based on expenses as now i know there is no way to add previous time or close the gap

Post by **Amber** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:01 am

For the purpose of transitional protection it is when the leave was granted rather thank whether they've been in the UK.

Syedahm · Post by **Syedahm** » Sat Nov 02, 2013 3:28 pm

Hi - if the date of issue is used for calculation

There first visa was issued from jan 2011 to april 12 (they were in Uk from March to Septemeber 2012)
Second visa was issued Nov 2013 till may 2014 ( they came to UK in Feb 2013) this was after my extention

if this clarifies.. please can you confirm the below

in order to apply for FLR M.. i must be applying for ILR inperson and then submit there application by post... as per the requirment i become a settled person and apply for dependant?

the other requirment is earning of £24500 for wife and 2 kids.. is this earning in the last 12 months? or the projected earnings? does my wife or me need to maintain any balance in the account?

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