Question on addresses/foreign

[NicholasWest]

Hi all,

I'm the Canadian spouse of a British Citizen, and will be allying for citizenship under the three year rule (though I've been in the UK for 6 years). Just had a few questions on the residency requirement.

My "start" date would be 20 February 2015. I was in the UK on that date, but out of the country for a couple months on both sides of this date.

In those three years, I was out of the country a total of 285 days (most of those days were in 2015/2016).

My questions are:

1) As I understand it, despite the 270 days absence allowed over three years, that 30 days automatic discretion is given, meaning that my 285 days would fall well under the 300 days actually allowed with discretion. Is this true?

2) Given that my "start" date is 20 Feb 2015, what is the soonest I can actually apply? I thought I read I could apply up to 30 days before, but I'm unclear on this.

Cheers!

[CR001]

Assuming of course that you hold ILR.

1. Should be fine yes.

2. There is no '30 or 28 days early' concession for citizenship applications. Your date of application by post is the date HO receives it. If you apply through NCS at the council (you get to keep your original documents and can apply for citizenship and passport at the same time), the date of application is the date of your NCS appointment.

[NicholasWest]

Assuming of course that you hold ILR.

1. Should be fine yes.

2. There is no '30 or 28 days early' concession for citizenship applications. Your date of application by post is the date HO receives it. If you apply through NCS at the council (you get to keep your original documents and can apply for citizenship and passport at the same time), the date of application is the date of your NCS appointment.

Thank you!

Yes, I do have an ILR.

So with regards to the date of my application, since my "start" date is 20 February 2015, my application date must be 21 Feb 2018? (given that I was out of the country for there months after that, until Mid May).

[CR001]

If you were in the UK on 20th Feb 2015, you can apply on this date in 2018 or 21st if you were also still in the UK.

The 'physically present at the start of the qualifying period' requirement is mandatory, no discretion is applied.

[NicholasWest]

If you were in the UK on 20th Feb 2015, you can apply on this date in 2018 or 21st if you were also still in the UK.

The 'physically present at the start of the qualifying period' requirement is mandatory, no discretion is applied.

Right. This is what's causing me a bit of confusion, and it's important in my case because I was out of the country for a couple months on either side of my start date, which makes the right application date crucial.

Here's what the Home Office says about it:

Legally in the UK at the start of the qualifying period.

To identify the start of the qualifying period you use the day after the application date minus the length of the qualifying period. For example in an application under section 6(1) made on 1 March 2016, the applicant must have been legally in the UK on 2 March 2011.

Where the applicant fails to meet the requirement to be in the UK at the start of the qualifying period by 2 months or less, either side of the application date, you must consider using discretion to allow them to re-declare their application. Where discretion is being exercised you must request that the applicant re-declares their application, by using Doc Gen letter 4746.

So for a start date of 20 Feb 2015, what should my application date be?

Thanks again for your patience!

[CR001]

What are the dates of the absence on either side?

Are you posting it yourself or applying through NCS?

[NicholasWest]

What are the dates of the absence on either side?

Are you posting it yourself or applying through NCS?

I arrived in the UK on 20 Feb 2015, departed on 21 Feb 2015. For approximately 60 days prior to my arrival I was in Canada, and for 60 days after I was on holiday in Italy. Returned to the UK 20 April 2015. But then left shortly thereafter to Canada again for 3 months. Since August 2015 I've been in the country continuously, but don't want to wait that long to apply, I'd like to apply in February.

I'm fine with either submitting my application online or using NCS...my main issue is ensuring that the Home Office receives the application on the correct date, which I think could mean 20-21 Feb 2018. If for example, if apply online on 20 Feb 2018 and the application is deemed "accepted" on that date, that would work. But with NCS, I'm not sure if the app date is the date of my NCS appointment, or the date the Home Office receives it from NCS.

[CR001]

But with NCS, I'm not sure if the app date is the date of my NCS appointment

NCS appointment date is considered the date of application.

You are however cutting it in incredibly fine. Why the rush to apply in February??

[NicholasWest]

But with NCS, I'm not sure if the app date is the date of my NCS appointment

NCS appointment date is considered the date of application.

You are however cutting it in incredibly fine. Why the rush to apply in February??

I'm planning on doing some travelling this summer, which would put me over the residency requirement limit...which would push my application back even further.

But if the date of my NCS appt counts as the date of application, I think I'm good, I'll just make my appt for that date. And as I understand it from the guidance I quoted earlier, it looks like they're supposed to use discretion and allow me to "re-delcare" the application date if necessary?

[ouflak1]

You are however cutting it in incredibly fine. Why the rush to apply in February??

I'm planning on doing some travelling this summer, which would put me over the residency requirement limit...which would push my application back even further.

Again, is that important? It doesn't sound like you are in dire need of either citizenship or a passport. Is it a cost element? Because if it isn't... you're really trying to thread a needle here. I think it should be ok, but they are awfully fussy on this particular point and there is no discretion.

[ouflak1]

..it looks like they're supposed to use discretion and allow me to "re-delcare" the application date if necessary?

I believe that particular discretion is only to allow you to move the date to a date where you meet the requirement. In your case, that's months off. I'm not sure the HO will simply hold onto the application until you qualify. I do think you will be ok if they accept your date (and they should IMO) and the timing is just right, but it's a risk.

[NicholasWest]

..it looks like they're supposed to use discretion and allow me to "re-delcare" the application date if necessary?

I believe that particular discretion is only to allow you to move the date to a date where you meet the requirement. In your case, that's months off. I'm not sure the HO will simply hold onto the application until you qualify. I do think you will be ok if they accept your date (and they should IMO) and the timing is just right, but it's a risk.

I've made an appointment at NCS, and they've confirmed what you've already told me...that the date of my appointment with them is considered the application date by the Home Office, and counting backwards three years would start from then, so I think I should be good.

I do have another question, if you don't mind. At one point during the three year period I was out of the UK for three months, and another point two months (one for holiday, one caring for a terminally ill family member). Should I list my foreign address during this period, or simply the UK one (our flat where my spouse was living).

Cheers & thanks again.

[secret.simon]

Only whole day absences from the UK count. So, you will have been present in the UK on both 20th and 21st Feb 2015 (but check the time the flights landed in the UK and took off from the UK carefully).

You need to be physically in the UK (date of application - three years + 1 day), so for an application on 20th February 2018, you need to have been physically in the UK on 21st February 2015.

Also worth doing a Subject Access Request on UKV&I to see what time of landing they have down on their records for you. The SAR fee is £10.

[NicholasWest]

Only whole day absences from the UK count. So, you will have been present in the UK on both 20th and 21st Feb 2015 (but check the time the flights landed in the UK and took off from the UK carefully).

You need to be physically in the UK (date of application - three years + 1 day), so for an application on 20th February 2018, you need to have been physically in the UK on 21st February 2015.

Also worth doing a Subject Access Request on UKV&I to see what time of landing they have down on their records for you. The SAR fee is £10.

Yes! And that's the date of my NCS appointment, 20 Feb 2018 (and I was in the UK on 21 Feb 2015). I've checked my passport and the stamp at Heathrow from my arrival is for 21 Feb 2015. Departure date is actually 23 Feb. So there should be no question of my physical presence.

So if what NCS tells me is right, and the date I meet with them is the day the Home Office considers my application accepted, I think I should be safe (unless anyone has had a different experience!)

[NicholasWest]

Hi all...I'm the spouse of a British Citizen applying for naturalisation under the three year rule.

During the past five years, I've been out of the country on and off, sometimes for months at a time (once as long as six months 4 years ago). I'm fine on the physical presence requirements, but my question is on listing the addresses. This was visiting family back home in Canada and caring for as sick relative.

For the periods I was to of the country for an extended period, my wife still lived in the UK, and my mail, etc. went to my UK address.

So I'm not sure if they want the address of where I was physically present during x periods, or simply my UK address?

Cheers!